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Thanks - did you get the wifi or BT version? Looks like that's a great present for a friend of mine who has a 30kWh Leaf. He had bought a cheapo dongle but it didn't work either.
 

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Thanks - did you get the wifi or BT version? Looks like that's a great present for a friend of mine who has a 30kWh Leaf. He had bought a cheapo dongle but it didn't work either.
I have the WiFi version. With last few updated on android, I have to disable mobile data for Leaf Spy to connect (android changes).

I leave it plug in and start Leaf spy when I need to check

- Leaf 30 kWh
Sent from mobile phone so please mind the typos
 

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I have the WiFi version. With last few updated on android, I have to disable mobile data for Leaf Spy to connect (android changes).

I leave it plug in and start Leaf spy when I need to check

- Leaf 30 kWh
Sent from mobile phone so please mind the typos
Hi, looking at all your info, i would suggest your 30kw leaf has not had the BMS ( battery Management system) update, which would mean your battery is indicating poorer degradation than is actually true. The Update corrects this. It seems the 30kw leaf cars did not report the full potential of all cells hence lower readings obtained by management system, the update addressed this by re calibration of the whole battery cluster, after the update your car will show a higher SOH and as should as seems in mine will increase the range, seeing a milage range of 125 miles without heater on should be common place. Regards, Glenn
 

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Hi, looking at all your info, i would suggest your 30kw leaf has not had the BMS ( battery Management system) update, which would mean your battery is indicating poorer degradation than is actually true. The Update corrects this. It seems the 30kw leaf cars did not report the full potential of all cells hence lower readings obtained by management system, the update addressed this by re calibration of the whole battery cluster, after the update your car will show a higher SOH and as should as seems in mine will increase the range, seeing a milage range of 125 miles without heater on should be common place. Regards, Glenn
 

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Dear All,

First time poster here, so be gentle ! :).

I picked up a new (to us) March 2017 Tekna 30 two weeks ago, showing 5 stars in all categories on the Nissan battery health sheet, 12 bars on dash.

Then I did what I should have done before buying and checking it out with leaf spy - 85.44 SOH.

Needless to say I am less than impressed, HV battery is showing 4NR6A so there's no salvation to be had from a BMS update.

Any suggestions on how to handle the conversation that I am about to have with the Nissan dealer, I think I'm not going to get very far with them ........

Can I realistically hope it improves over time ? or when the weather warm up ?, or is this >5% per year degradation inevitable. Seems most folks are doing much better than this.

The car has spent its like in the UK, so i would suggest ambient heat has little to do with it.

Any advise or messages of sympathy will be gratefully received.


Leafspy's attached:

View attachment 125307 View attachment 125308

Kindest Regards,

John W
Sorry I missed this thread, but I would have said the new legislation gives a car purchaser an absolute right to reject a car within 30 days if there is a fault.

The fault here is evident, it is the disparity between the battery report and actual battery health.
 

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^ Definitely.

But it's proving it's a 'fault'. Or mis-sold on the basis that the dealer exaggerated the batteries health.

If the range suited, I might be tempted to push for compensation then thrash it until the warranty would replace the battery!

Anyway, the OP was 29 days ago! We need an update!
 

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Discussion Starter #47
@foureyes said - "Anyway, the OP was 29 days ago! We need an update!"

Well, not a great deal to update about.

As I stated a while ago I am not convinced there is anything to be gained in the miss-sold route. The dealer is confident that the correct Nissan approved process was followed. Nissan's battery report showed the battery as good. However as we all know that style of report is a very blunt tool, the exact SOH (in percent terms) is, of course, not shown.

I have had a discussion with the dealer, having first made sure they had read this thread, but they are sticking to their guns i.e. nothing wrong with the car, degradation is normal, some vehicles will experience more than others etc etc. I got some sympathy but little else.

There was no 'hard fault' to get fixed (other than a loose rear shock lower mount which was easier just to fix myself), so no real grounds to reject the car either.

The battery is degraded, but the car is approaching 3 years old and battery degradation is a fact of life, so this is not a 'fault'. It is unfortunate and bloody annoying, but debating the extent of degradation is pointless, the Nissan battery report did not lie, it provided little useful information, but it was not misrepresentation.

Nissan do not recognize leaf spy as a valid tool, as long as the official Nissan battery report applicable to the car is given, they don't care what non approved 3rd party software tools say (even if the tools are widely accepted as fit for purpose).

I am disappointed not to find the battery with a 'leaf spy reported' SOH in the 90's, but I have to say it is purely my fault for buying without using leaf spy first. The SOH is now at 87% (up a little), so a little under 5% degradation per year. No BMS update can be applied to my level of software, so nothing to be gained there.

Battery degradation is not liner, so it may stay where it is for a while, however if it carries on degrading at the current rate then it has another 5 years to loose another 15% and if it does then I will be looking for it to be fixed under the 8 year battery warranty. At the current rate of degradation we will be there in three years time, well within warranty. I also suspect that we will see an awful lot of activity around 3rd party, higher capacity replacement packs over the next 5 years or so, so even if it doesn't end up getting replaced by Nissan, I'm confident there will be many options when needed.

We saw quite a few 'scabby' leafs (leaves?) before settling on this one, the car itself is in mint condition. My wife loves it, its warm comfortable quiet and a nice place to be. Her 7 mile commute each way to work is drawing around 12% of capacity. The trip does however take about 35 minutes and this weather all heating is on (even the steering wheel). The car therefore is fit for the purpose it was bought for, i'll continue to be annoyed, but not necessarily impacted, by the SOH. The cars a keeper for her.

However, with all of the above said, I did have an (limited) experiment over Christmas. On a dry day, driving below 50mph, with the heater off, just in D (no eco or B), it does seem that the car would be willing to cover 120 miles , which from extensive post trawling, I think is about normal. See photo, 20 covered, 100 remain. I'm sort of wondering if leaf spy is reporting correctly, or if the BMS stats it is reading are overly pessimistic (charging on Granny charger for most of its life ? a few US posts suggest this may cause the BMS to underestimate)

126140


I have a pod point install next week (part of the deal) and I'll try 'turtle-ing' it a couple of times and fully recharging to see if that helps matters any. I may well try a series of rapids if not.

Thanks for all responses on this one, I'll update as things progress.

Now if I could only get driving history stats to work ...............................................
 

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Very pragmatic. Enjoy it!

I miss my 24. My SOH went up a few percent after some running real low/rapid charging cycles. Although, because it met my day to day needs I wasn't religiously checking it.
 

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Dear All,

First time poster here, so be gentle ! :).

I picked up a new (to us) March 2017 Tekna 30 two weeks ago, showing 5 stars in all categories on the Nissan battery health sheet, 12 bars on dash.

Then I did what I should have done before buying and checking it out with leaf spy - 85.44 SOH.

Needless to say I am less than impressed, HV battery is showing 4NR6A so there's no salvation to be had from a BMS update.

Any suggestions on how to handle the conversation that I am about to have with the Nissan dealer, I think I'm not going to get very far with them ........

Can I realistically hope it improves over time ? or when the weather warm up ?, or is this >5% per year degradation inevitable. Seems most folks are doing much better than this.

The car has spent its like in the UK, so i would suggest ambient heat has little to do with it.

Any advise or messages of sympathy will be gratefully received.


Leafspy's attached:

View attachment 125307 View attachment 125308

Kindest Regards,

John W

Personally if it was me i'd enjoy it and hammer it so that you get a new battery soon with that degradation i bet its an ex demo that sat in a showroom for ages or has been left parked up in a storage yard.

Either way i'd carry on knowing that you'll get a new battery within the warranty as there isn't just one failed or lagging cell there but all of them are equal so they wont have much choice but to do a full pack swap when it dips below the threshold as just replacing some cells wont be enough.
 

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@foureyes said - "Anyway, the OP was 29 days ago! We need an update!"

Well, not a great deal to update about.

As I stated a while ago I am not convinced there is anything to be gained in the miss-sold route. The dealer is confident that the correct Nissan approved process was followed. Nissan's battery report showed the battery as good. However as we all know that style of report is a very blunt tool, the exact SOH (in percent terms) is, of course, not shown.

I have had a discussion with the dealer, having first made sure they had read this thread, but they are sticking to their guns i.e. nothing wrong with the car, degradation is normal, some vehicles will experience more than others etc etc. I got some sympathy but little else.

There was no 'hard fault' to get fixed (other than a loose rear shock lower mount which was easier just to fix myself), so no real grounds to reject the car either.

The battery is degraded, but the car is approaching 3 years old and battery degradation is a fact of life, so this is not a 'fault'. It is unfortunate and bloody annoying, but debating the extent of degradation is pointless, the Nissan battery report did not lie, it provided little useful information, but it was not misrepresentation.

Nissan do not recognize leaf spy as a valid tool, as long as the official Nissan battery report applicable to the car is given, they don't care what non approved 3rd party software tools say (even if the tools are widely accepted as fit for purpose).

I am disappointed not to find the battery with a 'leaf spy reported' SOH in the 90's, but I have to say it is purely my fault for buying without using leaf spy first. The SOH is now at 87% (up a little), so a little under 5% degradation per year. No BMS update can be applied to my level of software, so nothing to be gained there.

Battery degradation is not liner, so it may stay where it is for a while, however if it carries on degrading at the current rate then it has another 5 years to loose another 15% and if it does then I will be looking for it to be fixed under the 8 year battery warranty. At the current rate of degradation we will be there in three years time, well within warranty. I also suspect that we will see an awful lot of activity around 3rd party, higher capacity replacement packs over the next 5 years or so, so even if it doesn't end up getting replaced by Nissan, I'm confident there will be many options when needed.

We saw quite a few 'scabby' leafs (leaves?) before settling on this one, the car itself is in mint condition. My wife loves it, its warm comfortable quiet and a nice place to be. Her 7 mile commute each way to work is drawing around 12% of capacity. The trip does however take about 35 minutes and this weather all heating is on (even the steering wheel). The car therefore is fit for the purpose it was bought for, i'll continue to be annoyed, but not necessarily impacted, by the SOH. The cars a keeper for her.

However, with all of the above said, I did have an (limited) experiment over Christmas. On a dry day, driving below 50mph, with the heater off, just in D (no eco or B), it does seem that the car would be willing to cover 120 miles , which from extensive post trawling, I think is about normal. See photo, 20 covered, 100 remain. I'm sort of wondering if leaf spy is reporting correctly, or if the BMS stats it is reading are overly pessimistic (charging on Granny charger for most of its life ? a few US posts suggest this may cause the BMS to underestimate)

View attachment 126140

I have a pod point install next week (part of the deal) and I'll try 'turtle-ing' it a couple of times and fully recharging to see if that helps matters any. I may well try a series of rapids if not.

Thanks for all responses on this one, I'll update as things progress.

Now if I could only get driving history stats to work ...............................................
You could do the Turtle and rapid option or speed up the degradation by simply keeping it on a low SOC over the weekends or nights and just topping up enough to get her to work and back easily and with pre heating on as well. Or the fully charged method may work and have it topped up for as long as possible each night.

As you say, in a few years there will be some good replacement options and when they happen there will still be value in a used 30kwh pack, so getting nissan to replace it under warranty and then sell it on would help pay for a nice bigger upgrade :) They may even let you buy the old pack back cheaply as well if it saves them disposing of it as they wont do much else with it.
 

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Warranty only recovers to 75% ish .
When you drop to eight bars they will just restore it to nine bars and there is no ongoing warranty after that on the reconditioned cells they use apart from whats left of original one.
 

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Warranty only recovers to 75% ish .
When you drop to eight bars they will just restore it to nine bars and there is no ongoing warranty after that on the reconditioned cells they use apart from whats left of original one.
I think someone made the point earlier that if the degradation is fairly uniform across the cells, it's not going to be practical to refurb a battery pack by replacing one or two. Thinking about how this process might scale... would you even get your pack back, or more likely one that's been re-manufactured earlier in preparation? Did anyone ever get a warranty battery refurb?
 

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If I were the OP, I’d worry less. Our car (exact same age) showed 93% battery health from new. its not had many rapid charges in its life, but loads of level 1 and 2 charges. I’d try running the battery down until at least you get under 6% remaining, when the display shows - - - then rapid charge it to full, or at least 95%. I think you will see a change then. Good luck.

sorry if this has been said before, it’s been at least two years since I popped in here and I haven’t read the whole thread. Just wanted to chip in straight away
 

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It was me that said it would be pointless replacing just one or two modules on an evenly depleted pack. They would do the whole thing with a reman pack.

Half of me thinks the way this may go is that you get a software locked 40kwh pack stuck under your leaf or at least the modules for it in your battery case, or half the modules from a 62kwh pack to get you to 28kwh if they can technically do it.

It would be cheaper for them to do the 30kwh pack if they have loads of them as over stock or committed purchases but then they run the risk of someone getting the pack unlocked..
I'd quite like a 40kwh pack under my 2016 tekna and then a muxsan pack in the boot to get me a nice fat range and charging boost(they are working on 100kw chademo charging currently for older upgraded leafs)
 

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Discussion Starter #55
it would be pointless replacing just one or two modules on an evenly depleted pack.
Agreed, and that's what gives me hope that (if it ever comes to it )the entire pack will require to be replaced . I have no cells showing weaker that others, its general degradation across all cells.

Leaf spy shows an imbalance of 8mv at best and 18mv at worst depending on which snapshot I look at.

So although the SOH is poor, it is uniformly poor.
 
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