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Hi Layzee, sorry to read that you're having these problems - it is unfortunately a definite issue with the Teknas, I do know through my own experience that Nissan read these forums, so you may find that they are determined to reject your case as the details of it are in the public domain ^^^^^.

I found as a result of this forum that there was a common problem (thanks to the forum for that !), and communicated with Nissan privately and secured a resolution that satisfied me.I am regrettably expecting to find that the problem re-occurs as that seems to be what other owners have experienced :-(

FWIW I have delayed buying into the face lifted Leaf until we see how they are bearing up rear beam wise ....
 

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Hi Layzee, sorry to read that you're having these problems - it is unfortunately a definite issue with the Teknas, I do know through my own experience that Nissan read these forums, so you may find that they are determined to reject your case as the details of it are in the public domain ^^^^^.

I found as a result of this forum that there was a common problem (thanks to the forum for that !), and communicated with Nissan privately and secured a resolution that satisfied me.I am regrettably expecting to find that the problem re-occurs as that seems to be what other owners have experienced :-(

FWIW I have delayed buying into the face lifted Leaf until we see how they are bearing up rear beam wise ....
If the problem is resolved can you tell us what the resolution was that satisfied you ?

I have been at the mercy of gagging orders in the past, I do not think that it is right that you are penalised for putting something in the public domain, I am not finished with the case yet it is still ongoing !
 

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@DrPhil @Layzee @oilit
Only just noticed the recent revival of this thread and curious to know what the 'fixes' are that you've been getting.

I'd also like to make a couple of points - based on a lifetimes experience in engineering and manufacturing, much of it automotive. Some of what follows may seem like semantics but it most definitely isn't. A core principle of engineering is precision - both in the physical parts and the written words - so it is important that all involved understand the true meaning of what each party is saying. (Preach over !)

When Nissan say 'the axle is not bent' what they mean is that it is as manufactured and has not been deformed since then. It may be out of true but that is not the same as 'bent'. People may also infer that with a large component like an axle beam (approx 1500mm long) the word 'bent' suggests that the beam itself is not straight.

What is most likely (normally I resist conjecture without having the facts but in this case I'm just trying to increase peoples' understanding) is that there has been a fault in the manufacture of the axle assembly which has then lead to the mounting points of the axle - the points where it fits to the bodyshell - being misaligned. So the axle is not 'bent' but the mounting surfaces are not in quite the right place or - more likely - the right plane. Obviously it doesn't take much of an error - a fraction of a degree - to throw the tracking out. There are several potential reasons for a manufacturing error like this - and it wasn't necessarily just one of them that caused the problem - but possibles include incorrect materials and welding processes. Most likely IMO is that for whatever reason the manufacturing jig was incorrect - damage, repair, not checked, wear through use etc - and so for a period of time incorrect axle assemblies were being churned out and again - for various reasons - the error wasn't picked up. They may well have been within tolerance but perhaps bodyshell tolerances combined to give the errors you've got ?

It is entirely possible that the axles are fine and the error is in the bodyshell. I have seen consistent manufacturing errors of over 10mm (waaaay out of tolerance) in bodyshells in the past - but the guys on the line just stuck the windy gun on the bolts and pulled everything 'straight' :rolleyes::rolleyes:. But this is less likely in this case particularly as the axle manufacture is probably subbed out which adds another layer of administration and distance between the root cause of the fault and final fitment of the component.

So to summarise (IMHO !!!) the axle is not bent - it's been made wrong. Hence why shimming is a possible solution but only if the original error and the style of mounting allows that. A simple solution is an axle swap - once they've identified and corrected the manufacturing problem of course - but that's the kind of fix that makes the bean counters sweat as it won't be one axle - it will be hundreds or even thousands. If the error is in the shell then the shim fix may still be valid - but changing the shell definitely won't be.:)

All of which detail is probably completely unknown to sales, marketing, admin etc etc people at Nissan and RCI.
 

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I am not suprised that I didnt get any joy from RCI didnt realise that RCI was in literally in bed with Nissan, this from RCI website:
" With it's unique alliance with Nissan, it has become one of the world's largest car companies."
"Our offices are based in Rickmansworth. Our unique business means we help drive the UK manufacture of Nissan models in the North East of England, and we only use our money to support the sales of new and used vehicles in the UK."
"Today, as a group, RCI Banque works exclusively with some of the worlds largest brands, including Renault, Nissan, Dacia and Infiniti"
 

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So
@DrPhil @Layzee @oilit
Only just noticed the recent revival of this thread and curious to know what the 'fixes' are that you've been getting.

I'd also like to make a couple of points - based on a lifetimes experience in engineering and manufacturing, much of it automotive. Some of what follows may seem like semantics but it most definitely isn't. A core principle of engineering is precision - both in the physical parts and the written words - so it is important that all involved understand the true meaning of what each party is saying. (Preach over !)

When Nissan say 'the axle is not bent' what they mean is that it is as manufactured and has not been deformed since then. It may be out of true but that is not the same as 'bent'. People may also infer that with a large component like an axle beam (approx 1500mm long) the word 'bent' suggests that the beam itself is not straight.

What is most likely (normally I resist conjecture without having the facts but in this case I'm just trying to increase peoples' understanding) is that there has been a fault in the manufacture of the axle assembly which then lead to the mounting points of the axle - the points where it fits to the bodyshell - being misaligned. So the axle is not 'bent' but the mounting surfaces are not in quite the right place or - more likely - the right plane. Obviously it doesn't take much of an error - a fraction of a degree - to throw the tracking out. There are several potential reasons for a manufacturing error like this - and it wasn't necessarily just one of them that caused the problem - but possibles include incorrect materials and welding processes. Most likely IMO is that for whatever reason the manufacturing jig was incorrect - damage, repair, not checked, wear through use etc - and so for a period of time incorrect axle assemblies were being churned out and again - for various reasons - the error wasn't picked up. They may well have been within tolerance but perhaps bodyshell tolerances combined to give the errors you've got ?

It is entirely possible that the axles are fine and the error is in the bodyshell. I have seen consistent manufacturing errors of over 10mm (waaaay out of tolerance) in bodyshells in the past - but the guys on the line just stuck the windy gun on the bolts and pulled everything 'straight' :rolleyes::rolleyes:. But this is less likely in this case particularly as the axle manufacture is probably subbed out which adds another layer of administration and distance between the root cause of the fault and final fitment of the component.

So to summarise (IMHO !!!) the axle is not bent - it's been made wrong. Hence why shimming is a possible solution but only if the original error and the style of mounting allows that. A simple solution is an axle swap - once they've identified and corrected the manufacturing problem of course - but that's the kind of fix that makes the bean counters sweat as it won't be one axle - it will be hundreds or even thousands. If the error is in the shell then the shim fix may still be valid - but changing the shell definitely won't be.:)

All of which detail is probably completely unknown to sales, marketing, admin etc etc people at Nissan and RCI.
in a nutshell you are just saying that the terms used are incorrect and misleading, In my dealings with Nissan at both local and national level I have explained in detail that the alignment is incorrect, but nissan say it is not, even though Nissan provide the suspension geometry settings to the bods that make the alignment kit when tested and it returns a result out of tolerence Nissan say its within design tolerance, which confuses me somewhat, what it alludes to is there are one set of tolerences issued to for alignment purposes but another set of tolerences for manufacture.
However the most annoying thing is that Nissan have failed to provide one shred of documentary evidence to support their side of the issue !
I am hoping that the Financial Ombudsman will give RCI a kick up the backside as no way did they do an "independent investigation"
 

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So in a nutshell you are just saying that the terms used are incorrect and misleading
. Agreed - and once the problem has been processed and filtered by several tiers of 'advisors', call handlers etc etc the info the engineer at the end of the chain gets will be useless. I learnt this many times - go back to the source and ask your own questions. Unfortunately the end users perception of the problem was rarely the same as as anyone else so it always came back to harvesting all the information and then sorting the wheat from the chaff. Always frustrating but usually satisfying.

there are one set of tolerances issued to for alignment purposes but another set of tolerances for manufacture.
Correct. There are tolerance bands for each manufactured component. If each component is within tol then the final assembly will also be within its own tolerance band. In theory even if every component was at one end of the band (very unlikely btw) the final assembly would still be within tolerance. IF the calculations were done correctly. However bloody humans can creep in and mess up the process. They don't measure accurately, they don't always sample check often enough - or even at all. More often than not through pressure of work rather than simple human failing.

However the most annoying thing is that Nissan have failed to provide one shred of documentary evidence to support their side of the issue !
This is what worries me the most. Either they haven't found the root cause - which is unlikely as there are globally used and very effective systems in automotive for doing just that (google FMEA, 8D, 5Y to know more) - or they have found it and they don't like the answer. Perhaps a tooling or welding process that had crept out of tol and not been picked up.

See here for how bad things can be - financial and production pressures can lead good people to make bad decisions. Professionalism/The Ford Pinto Gas Tank Controversy - Wikibooks, open books for an open world

I would put money on it that somewhere in Sunderland there is an engineer with a solution and an accountant with a calculator. Guess who wins ?

I am hoping that the Financial Ombudsman will give RCI a kick up the backside as no way did they do an "independent investigation"
Good luck with that ;)
 

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Something we can do that would be much harder for Nissan to collect is the VIN numbers of the affected cars. That should help indicate a date range for the problem. If it is a random scatter then Nissan may not yet fully own the issue. If after a certain date all is well then a change will have been made which suggests the root cause of the problem is known but not admitted. I forget how but the approximate date of manufacture final assembly is I believe included in the VIN.
 

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I found that having the dealer on my side helped tremendously - the first dealer I used claimed they knew nothing of the problem - but also couldn't do 4 wheel alignment themselves.

The second dealer I went to did the 4 wheel alignment and said it looks similar to some others we have seen - we will talk to Nissan for you - the axle was replaced within 2 weeks and the tyre was replaced.

The first dealer closed down within 6 months.

As I said in a previous post - use a larger dealer who sells and services a lot of leafs and I'm sure that can help.

Good luck!
 

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I found that having the dealer on my side helped tremendously - the first dealer I used claimed they knew nothing of the problem - but also couldn't do 4 wheel alignment themselves.

The second dealer I went to did the 4 wheel alignment and said it looks similar to some others we have seen - we will talk to Nissan for you - the axle was replaced within 2 weeks

The first dealer closed down within 6 months.

As I said in a previous post - use a larger dealer who sells and services a lot of leafs and I'm sure that can help.

Good luck!
Unfortunately I have used the biggest dealer in my area they also could not do a 4 wheel alignment test but took it to a tyre fitting place they did 2 tests both results were flagged as being outside the manufacturers tolerance, and still Nissan say there is nothing wrong !! I had previously had 2 tests done and again both sets of results flagged up the error with the rear axle
 

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I've just had my head under the back end of a Leaf and I think I can see Nissan's problem. The design is such that there is no way of correcting or adjusting a tracking error other than changing 'out of tolerance' components. The two components involved are the axle assy and the bodyshell. One of them (or both !) must be wrong. (Or I could be :))

Basically the axle position is set by two damn great pivot bolts which pass through holes in each component. There is no provision for adjustment.

Presumably they were relying on their QC being tighter than their tolerances were slack. One of them wasn't.

All I can think of as a fix is some sort of eccentric bush/bolt arrangement but I can't quite visualise how that would work. I'm sure I've seen it done somewhere.
 

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I've just had my head under the back end of a Leaf and I think I can see Nissan's problem. The design is such that there is no way of correcting or adjusting a tracking error other than changing 'out of tolerance' components. The two components involved are the axle assy and the bodyshell. One of them (or both !) must be wrong. (Or I could be :))

Basically the axle position is set by two damn great pivot bolts which pass through holes in each component. There is no provision for adjustment.

Presumably they were relying on their QC being tighter than their tolerances were slack. One of them wasn't.

All I can think of as a fix is some sort of eccentric bush/bolt arrangement but I can't quite visualise how that would work. I'm sure I've seen it done somewhere.
That would indeed resolve the issue if the axle is straight as you would be able to swivel the entire axle to get it into alignment, however if the axle has been made with one stub axle out of alignment there would still be no way to correct it
 

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Just a little update on my rear axle saga,
Nissan have maintained from day one that the axle is within tolerance !
The Financial Ombudsman is dealing with the case at present as RCI and Nissan have said No!
Got a phone call from FO yesterday (one thing I had been asking for from day one was some documentary evidence from Nissan that supported their claim that the axle was within limits) FO said that suprise suprise RCI had sent over two documents which were test results showing the axle was within limits the only one that is relevant I have attached.
It isnt a test result at all it is service data sheet ! furthermore in a letter to the FO RCI had claimed that the problem with the rear axle had been fixed !! total lie !
I explained all this to the FO in an email and other errors in RCI's response.
I have also attached the final 4 wheel alignment test that Nissan had done, if you look at the rear offside both toe and camber are in the red which = outside the manufacturers tolerance, but not according to Nissan, if you check the rear alignment pdf it shows max toe angle of 0°24' on the test result it is 0°26'
Camber should be max of -0°59' on the test result it is -0°17'
near side are both marginal !
The other thing I explained to the FO is that under Consumer Rights Act 2015 if the fault is reported within 6 months of the date of purchase it is deemed to have been there prior to the purchase, furthermore the onus is on the dealer to prove that the fault was'nt there at the time of purchase, it is not upto the purchaser to prove the fault was there.
If it had gone past the 6 month cut off then it switches, the onus then falls on the purchaser.

Cant wait to see what their next response is going to be !
 

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OK so update time, RCI came back with "can you ask the customer to get a technical examination done on the car if the result proves conclusively that the fault was there at point of sale we will refund the £299 fee for the exam" they wanted carried out by a firm called DEKRA, so I called them and asked them wht the examination would cionsist of and would they state conclusively that the fault was present at pos.
The exam was visual only, would include a short test drive and they would not state that the fault was there at pos.
So that was a total waste of time, I explained this to my adjudicator at the FOS who was a very nice girl but to be honest didnt have a scoobie about the ins and outs of this case.
In the end I instructed her as we were getting nowhere to forward the case to the Ombudsman for a final and binding decision.
Yesterday flop on the doormat a letter from the FO which stated that he was upholding my complaint !!! woo hoo however it is not all sweetness and light, although he has upheld my complaint he feels that RCI should be given the chance to repair the car, new axle you think but no, a shim kit is to be fitted grr, which is the solution nissan offered way back.
But it is not all bad as they get one chance to fix it, of it goes belly up then I can reject the car !! and its all in black and white no arguements.

This started 12 Aug 2018 here we are end of June 2019 and although its been resolved its not yet fixed it shouldnt be like this at all.
I can understand why people just put up with it, but it gives me the raving ump when I know im right and some multinational company says go away little man, well no I wont Im like a dog with a bone as the saying goes !!

An F ing big bone !!
 

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I'll be really interested to see how this 'shim kit' works because I've looked at this problem close up and don't see a fix at all. Keep us posted please if that's the way it goes - and good luck !
 
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