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Ioniq
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
We went to ask about a new Zoe today; the salesman was utterly uninterested in the idea, so out of curiosity we popped in to have a look at the ZS EV next door.

Long test drive and a satisfactory quote later, we're very interested, but still unsure about its weaknesses against the Zoe of range and preconditioning.

Trying some common journeys in ABRP though, it has the ZS EV as more efficient than the Zoe; eh? 275 wh/mi instead of the Zoe's 324; this suggests that actually there's little difference in the range, which I find unlikely, surely?

I've struggled to find much online to compare the range of both. I am nervous to go from a current Zoe with a range of 180-ish miles to one with only 160-ish, let alone the new Zoe of 200-ish.

What gives? Has anyone else compared both? I've seen Bjorn's stuff but the seasonal differences make it not very useful. I'm about to go watch the rest of his ZS EV stuff though.

Thanks all

Phil
 

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Both suffer a bit at motorway speeds.

However see my latest road trip where I did almost 400 km in the ZE50 on one charge, at an average speed of 67 km/h, going up some big hills. So 242 miles, on the equivalent of B roads

On regular daily use which is mainly motorway, I’m getting a steady 265 Wh/mile, which equates to 200 miles of range with AC running.

You just need to work out what your maximum drive will be.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
"utterly interested", I don't understand
Ha, I'm an idiot, "uninterested" was what I meant! Duh

He basically told us how expensive they were, how little we'd get for our current car as a trade in and that a new one could take ages to turn up. They said they would phone me with a quote but I am not holding my breath.
 

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Ha, I'm an idiot, "uninterested" was what I meant! Duh

He basically told us how expensive they were, how little we'd get for our current car as a trade in and that a new one could take ages to turn up. They said they would phone me with a quote but I am not holding my breath.
What a knob.

I hope you reported him.;)
 

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Was APRB giving you from-the-wall efficiencies there? Maybe it knows Zoe doesn't charge so efficiently?

I did a long drive at "motorway+" speeds the other day and the Zoe was 'unable' to get below 2.8mi/kWh from the battery.

Though, from the wall based on my measured charging efficiencies, that would translate into about 2.0mi/kWh.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
ABRP uses the efficiency for calculating range so I assume it ignores charging efficiency. Our Zoe is not the most efficient at motorway speeds but we've generally expected 3.5mpkwh or 286wh/mi. This suggests the Zoe figure is not very accurate, and even less so using the 265 from @cah197, which seems odd as the whole point of ABRP is meant to be better accuracy...?

Even so, ABRP still says the ZS is better at 277. Unless that represents best case and my 286 is worst case. I've tried to find out where ABRP's numbers come from, but I can't find anywhere where they say this or how confident they are of them.

I'm very nervous of getting a ZS EV because ABRP says it will be fine on some of our longer trips in Wales where chargers are sparse only to find that actually it's not...
 

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There are some pertinent comments in the more recent posts in this thread over on the ABRP forum.

 

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And here too:


Long story short, I don’t think you can really rely on the ABRP info as it relates to relatively new car models that haven’t yet been refined much based on user feedback. The models will improve over time.

All ABRP default models are also apparently 10% or so conservative by design.
 

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ABRP uses the efficiency for calculating range so I assume it ignores charging efficiency. Our Zoe is not the most efficient at motorway speeds but we've generally expected 3.5mpkwh or 286wh/mi. This suggests the Zoe figure is not very accurate, and even less so using the 265 from @cah197, which seems odd as the whole point of ABRP is meant to be better accuracy...?

Even so, ABRP still says the ZS is better at 277. Unless that represents best case and my 286 is worst case. I've tried to find out where ABRP's numbers come from, but I can't find anywhere where they say this or how confident they are of them.

I'm very nervous of getting a ZS EV because ABRP says it will be fine on some of our longer trips in Wales where chargers are sparse only to find that actually it's not...
Maybe someone else can comment on ZS consumption.

Beware that the dash display consumption in the Zoe doesn’t include HVAC, so this can have a larger effect on longer journeys. For instance in colder weather I’d assume a usable capacity of 46 kWh, whereas you could assume up to 51 kWh with HVAC off. Although that’s pushing the boundaries.

On my 400 km trip ABRP estimated I’d have to charge on the way back, even when setting the max speed to 90 km/h. So there’s some conservativeness in the model for sure.
 

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Another factor to consider is that ABRP defaults to a 'reference speed' of 100%, whereas in reality (especially in the UK) it’s often not possible to achieve this, so IME actual consumption is often less than predicted.

The new premium features of ABRP such as taking into account live traffic data should go some way to accounting for this though.
 

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In terms of drag related to car aerodynamics, in the absence of a definite figure for the MG ZS EV drag coefficient so just comparing the frontal areas gives some idea - the ZOE frontal area is about 90% of the MG.
And comparing the battery capacities (using published spec figures), the MG battery is about 81% of the ZOE capacity.

Just based on the frontal areas and battery capacities, for the same driving conditions and driving style the ZOE range should comfortably exceed that of the MG.
 

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Whatcar tested the MG at 140 mile range so 52 miles less than the ZE50 (although I still don't think their testing methodology is valid). They are running a long term car and ran out of charge :rolleyes:


I prefer the NAF tests and Chrome does a good job of translating to English. Hilly but lowish speed test, but MG got 310km (193 miles) vs Zoe at 453km (281 miles)

 

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Yeah, I've got to agree. I would expect Zoe to be much more efficient than the MG. Both my Zoe were extremely easy to get a decent mileage from. I'm finding that I need to work a bit to get the most out of the MG's battery, but then it weighs more than the Zoe and has a very flat front end.

Still prefer the MG to the Zoe although I've heard say that Zoe's ride has been improved.

Recently the MG's GOM has reporting 173 miles range from a full charge. It does drop off a bit, but alarmingly so.
 

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We went to ask about a new Zoe today; the salesman was utterly uninterested in the idea, so out of curiosity we popped in to have a look at the ZS EV next door.
That is disappointing. Maybe try a different dealer and phone first as they may have a salesperson more experienced in Zoe sales you can make an appointment with. The new Zoe is a big upgrade so don't rule it out based on people saying "my MG is better than my Zoe was" as that will have been the "barely changed since 2013" model.
 
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"my MG is better than my Zoe was" as that will have been the "barely changed since 2013" model.
So has the Zoe improved with the new model. It didn't feel any better when I tried it.
 

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So has the Zoe improved with the new model. It didn't feel any better when I tried it.
I had a 1 hr test drive and IMO not only has build quality greatly improved but ride quality is massively improved too, feels a lot more stable on the road.

I think you maybe didn't want it to feel any better ;)
 

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I think you maybe didn't want it to feel any better ;)
On the contrary. I'm happy that it has improved. Whilst the Zoe was incredibly efficient, I could never call it comfortable. Having had 2 I was reluctant to have another. I've had 3 Reliants, 3 Micras and 2 Nissan Laurels, but never one after the other. There's always been something else in between. There wasn't anything EV in my price range after first Zoe, so as I wanted to stay EV another Zoe was the only choice. The MG was a massive improvement on comfort for me. The lack of height adjustment in the Zoe's driver's seat was a terrible thing for me. Forcing me to seat on 2 cushions to get a half decent view through the windscreen. So, even though the Zoe is a better ride now, I couldn't have another until the front seat is height adjustable and so many of the new stock is just better in that fashion.
 
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