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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I had a Pod-Point fitted today and the guy, subcontractor, wasn't very confidence inspiring. Thankfully it was a very straightforward installation as in hole through the back of kitchen cupboard that has the meter & DB to outside wall, 10m straight along the wall to where the unit is. I'd even drilled a pilot hole.

Anyway, he's done a neat enough job, apart from not sealing the hole through the wall which was a little disappointing but no great shakes and easy enough sort myself. Maybe because it was my hole initially it's my responsibility :rolleyes::D

This lack of care in the job made me question a couple of other things, like he's fed the 2way dedicated board by splitting the feed from the meter which I feel is the better way rather than making it a sub DB from my main DB, however, he's split it using Henley blocks before the main isolator switch :unsure:. It looks like he's done it by removing the tails from the meter and retaining them as the feed from the new Henleys to the isolator, then provided new tails from the meter to the Henleys. Needless to say the meter is now sans seal:rolleyes:. I would have thought it would have been better to split after the isolator, not to mention safer as unless he pulled the main fuse:unsure:.........oh yeah, of course he did that, that is also devoid of a seal.

My main concern is regarding the tails from the new Henley blocks to the EVSE 2way board. He seems to have used 10mm tails. Is that normal practice? I appreciate the the breaker in the new 2way is only 40amp and I think 10mm tails are ok with a 60amp main fuse, just. I wonder how he knew it was a 60amp fuse? oh yeah, because he had it in his hand.

My plan was to get the DNO to upgrade the fuse but was holding fire until the meter was upgraded in March, along with 16mm tails from the meter to cut out (the rest were 25mm). I'm now concerned those 10mm tails feeding the EVSE 2way and being before any protection are going to throw a spanner in the works by restricting the main fuse to 60amp? We don't have any power showers and the central heating is gas so 60amp will probably be fine as the Pod Point has the load monitor but I'd rather the extra head room of an 80 or 100 amp.

The more I think about it, the more I'm shaking my head as to why he didn't spit it after the isolator. Weird.
 

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He probably did it before the isolator because they wasn't enough room installing without moving things around. So it was easier.

10mm is fine because only 30 amps is drawn on it.

When you get the fuse upgraded call podpoint office and get your settings changed from 60 to 80/100
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
He probably did it before the isolator because they wasn't enough room installing without moving things around. So it was easier.

10mm is fine because only 30 amps is drawn on it.

When you get the fuse upgraded call podpoint office and get your settings changed from 60 to 80/100
Thanks man (y)
 

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He probably did it before the isolator because they wasn't enough room installing without moving things around. So it was easier.

10mm is fine because only 30 amps is drawn on it.

When you get the fuse upgraded call podpoint office and get your settings changed from 60 to 80/100
I was always taught that the cable has to be sized for the protective device supplying it, that way under overload conditions the protective device blows before the cable catches fire.
 

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Sweet, as give podpoints QS a call and ask him. He'll be able to direct you to the regs and the NicEic approval he's got.
 

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Sweet, as give podpoints QS a call and ask him. He'll be able to direct you to the regs and the NicEic approval he's got.
I think he might struggle to find it in the regs unless they have changed a lot since I did my 16th edition.

Personally if I was the OP I would give Pod Point CS a call and suggest they might like to redo the job properly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
If you ignore the fact that he pulled the main fuse and faffed with the meter, he hasn’t actually left it unsafe. The split before the isolator is irksome for future maintenance but only EVSE is before it. My concern is whether anything changes should I get the fuse uprated, given the 10mm tails are rated a little over 60amps I believe. My understanding is voltage is equal more or less everywhere on a circuit whereas that is not the case with current.
 

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I had a Pod-Point fitted today and the guy, subcontractor, wasn't very confidence inspiring. Thankfully it was a very straightforward installation as in hole through the back of kitchen cupboard that has the meter & DB to outside wall, 10m straight along the wall to where the unit is. I'd even drilled a pilot hole.

Anyway, he's done a neat enough job, apart from not sealing the hole through the wall which was a little disappointing but no great shakes and easy enough sort myself. Maybe because it was my hole initially it's my responsibility :rolleyes::D

This lack of care in the job made me question a couple of other things, like he's fed the 2way dedicated board by splitting the feed from the meter which I feel is the better way rather than making it a sub DB from my main DB, however, he's split it using Henley blocks before the main isolator switch :unsure:. It looks like he's done it by removing the tails from the meter and retaining them as the feed from the new Henleys to the isolator, then provided new tails from the meter to the Henleys. Needless to say the meter is now sans seal:rolleyes:. I would have thought it would have been better to split after the isolator, not to mention safer as unless he pulled the main fuse:unsure:.........oh yeah, of course he did that, that is also devoid of a seal.

My main concern is regarding the tails from the new Henley blocks to the EVSE 2way board. He seems to have used 10mm tails. Is that normal practice? I appreciate the the breaker in the new 2way is only 40amp and I think 10mm tails are ok with a 60amp main fuse, just. I wonder how he knew it was a 60amp fuse? oh yeah, because he had it in his hand.

My plan was to get the DNO to upgrade the fuse but was holding fire until the meter was upgraded in March, along with 16mm tails from the meter to cut out (the rest were 25mm). I'm now concerned those 10mm tails feeding the EVSE 2way and being before any protection are going to throw a spanner in the works by restricting the main fuse to 60amp? We don't have any power showers and the central heating is gas so 60amp will probably be fine as the Pod Point has the load monitor but I'd rather the extra head room of an 80 or 100 amp.

The more I think about it, the more I'm shaking my head as to why he didn't spit it after the isolator. Weird.
Well if he’s left the seal off the main incomer you could always..... adjust things?

You seem to be ahem!.... pretty competent in such things? 😉
 

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If you ignore the fact that he pulled the main fuse and faffed with the meter, he hasn’t actually left it unsafe. The split before the isolator is irksome for future maintenance but only EVSE is before it. My concern is whether anything changes should I get the fuse uprated, given the 10mm tails are rated a little over 60amps I believe. My understanding is voltage is equal more or less everywhere on a circuit whereas that is not the case with current.
The 10mm to feed your EV dB is fine from a 100amp fed Henley. They wouldn't install over 500 a week like that if it wasn't. If your worried call NicEic and/or the QS at podpoint.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
The 10mm to feed your EV dB is fine from a 100amp fed Henley. They wouldn't install over 500 a week like that if it wasn't. If your worried call NicEic and/or the QS at podpoint.
yeah I tend to agree, it was just in the back of my mind that maybe he installed 10mm because he knew it was only a 60amp fuse, but to be honest, I’m not sure he was putting that much thought into it really 😆. At the end of the day a lot of these installers are simply fitters. In hindsight, I think there’s some value in dealing with a proper spark, even if it means foregoing the grant. I certainly would if the install was slightly non standard.
 

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Officially only the DNO can cut the seal on the main fuse, in reality most are not too fussed but some can get excited.

Missing seal on the meter tends to make DNOs more excited. Personally that is the kind of conversation I would prefer to avoid, but YMMV.

As far as I am aware there are no special rules for wiring and equipment supplied direct from the DNO fuse (happy to be proved wrong). On this basis the relevant section of the regs is/was 433.1.1 (may be a different number in the latest regs)

Provided it is clipped to a surface and you can use an ambient temperature of 30 degC 10mm2 cable is ok protected with a 60A fuse. You need to derate if 50mm or more of the cable passes through thermal insulation (table 52.2), which will drop your cable capacity below 60A.

If reg 433.1.1 applies then upgrading the 60A DNO fuse is not possible - if it does not apply I would be curious as to why not.

If your DNO is on the ball you will find out when he comes to upgrade your fuse :).
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Officially only the DNO can cut the seal on the main fuse, in reality most are not too fussed but some can get excited.

Missing seal on the meter tends to make DNOs more excited. Personally that is the kind of conversation I would prefer to avoid, but YMMV.

If your DNO is on the ball you will find out when he comes to upgrade your fuse :).

I‘m having the meters changed at the beginning of March so I suspect a conversation then. As much as I‘m not prepared to actively cause problems for the guy today, I’m certainly not taking the fall for the seals if a stink is kicked up.

Worse case scenario is we keep the main fuse at 60amp which is probably not going to be a problem anyway.
 

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The guys changing the meters are typically just subbies for your supply company rather than your DNO, may not even notice.

Once you have a smart meter they will know if anyone pulls the DNO fuse :) . Whether they will care remains open to debate.
 

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So if the installer went to the trouble of pulling out the main fuse to install a couple of henley blocks it means he couldn`t be arsed wiring it after the Double pole switch because it was difficult for some reason (ie no room , no 25mm tails to remake a connection etc.) its just lazy work and now you have the 2 issues because of his incompetence ...if you need to isolate your whole supply in a hurry your double pole switch wont do it,(which is one reason for it) and if you have a dispute about your electricity bills ....you cant complain because your main service fuse and meter seals are now missing.
You may be liable for a meter change at your cost so get on that phone !
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
So if the installer went to the trouble of pulling out the main fuse to install a couple of henley blocks it means he couldn`t be arsed wiring it after the Double pole switch because it was difficult for some reason (ie no room , no 25mm tails to remake a connection etc.) its just lazy work and now you have the 2 issues because of his incompetence ...if you need to isolate your whole supply in a hurry your double pole switch wont do it,(which is one reason for it) and if you have a dispute about your electricity bills ....you cant complain because your main service fuse and meter seals are now missing.
You may be liable for a meter change at your cost so get on that phone !
I agree, its irksome because there was far more play available in the tails after the isolator than the ones he actually cut. The meters are being changed in a couple of weeks anyway, if any finger pointing starts I will furnish them with whatever contact information they require 🙂

It‘s still unclear as to whether the 10mm tails to the dedicated PodPoint circuit is going to be a problem with the main fuse, mainly from a regulatory point of view. I’m still awaiting a response from PodPoint, however, I’ll wait till the meters are changed before following it up.
 
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