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Hi, 1st post, please go easy...
Been looking at the 330e and I have a few questions
How much est does it cost to fully charge overnight?
Does the battery charge up whilst driving?
What is the real world range for using just electric, does the petrol motor only kick in over certain speeds?
Is it possible to travel the 25m range using just electric
They state 140 odd mpg is this real world?

Ta
 

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Hi Conbrue,

I'm new to this whole EV thing as well.

I pick my 330e up on Saturday so I can't answer definitively your questions, but I have been doing lots of research so I have a good idea.

1. A full charge costs in the region of 60p and takes between 2.5 and 3.5 hours depending on Charge Current supplied.

2. The battery will charge while driving but depends a lot on driving conditions. The charge comes via braking. Similar to KERS on an F1 car.

3. The real time Electric Range can vary greatly depending on driving style but reports are in the 15 to 22 mile range. The petrol engine kicks in above speeds of around 62mph.

4. I have seen reported figures in the 90’s for real world MPG but again is totally dependent on your driving style and the distance you travel.

The real savings for me will be the low Company Car BIK cost of just 7% this year plus the 100% Corporation Tax saving for my Limited Company.

Hope this helps
 

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Your last question depends entirely on your journey profile.
If you start with a full charge, drive 15miles and then recharge then you can potentially use no petrol assuming you stay under 60mph.
If you do 30 miles then it's half EV mode and half petrol. Then you can work out the mpg.
If you start with an empty battery and drive however far then it will be absolutely no better than a conventional petrol car expect ~40mpg I would guess.

I'm getting one in a few weeks so will know more then but don't expect it to do something different to a normal 330i when in pure petrol mode and batteries are empty.

The crazy mpg numbers on the cars sticker is just because the test cycle for all cars to determine their mph is 30 or 40 miles long. So any EV mode on a car offsets this massively and so bumps the mpg figure up.
 

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Your last question depends entirely on your journey profile.
If you start with a full charge, drive 15miles and then recharge then you can potentially use no petrol assuming you stay under 60mph.
If you do 30 miles then it's half EV mode and half petrol. Then you can work out the mpg.
If you start with an empty battery and drive however far then it will be absolutely no better than a conventional petrol car expect ~40mpg I would guess.

I'm getting one in a few weeks so will know more then but don't expect it to do something different to a normal 330i when in pure petrol mode and batteries are empty.

The crazy mpg numbers on the cars sticker is just because the test cycle for all cars to determine their mph is 30 or 40 miles long. So any EV mode on a car offsets this massively and so bumps the mpg figure up.
The batteries are never empty - you always have some left as AFAIK it can only start up in EV mode.

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Ok, well at some point they will stop providing power which for the user means they are 'empty' as I don't believe BMW have developed a limitless energy source yet!

I am just making the point that if you drive 200 miles then don't expect to get 100mpg... It will likely be a bit worse in touring mode on mpg figures compared to a conventional 330i due to the added weight.
 

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Hi, 1st post, please go easy...
Been looking at the 330e and I have a few questions
How much est does it cost to fully charge overnight?
Does the battery charge up whilst driving?
What is the real world range for using just electric, does the petrol motor only kick in over certain speeds?
Is it possible to travel the 25m range using just electric
They state 140 odd mpg is this real world?

Ta
Hi Conbrue,

I have had a 330e since around Mid April, and it is a lovely car to drive, but with limitations, in answer to your questions:

1) Yes, about 60p

2) No, not really, if running on the engine, you can get the odd mile back due to brake re-generation but even with the car in "battery save mode" it does it own thing and still consumes your battery, albeit less than normal, you will loose an odd percent or two and then get it back. It is all a bit random. I completed and 120 mile trip last week, put it into max battery mode whilst I was on the motorway, it was a 71% charged, it decreased at it s lowest to 68% and by the end of the trip was at 72% not quite what I was expecting. If you knock the gear lever across into sport you will see it charge, however your mpg goes down into the 20's so not worth it. I think it manages itself better in Auto mode.

3) My goal is to drive it as much as possible on electric, I have given up on the inbuilt guesstimator on mileage as it makes no sense at times. I now use the percentage charge indicator to give me an idea instead. I fully charge my car twice a day, 100% charge shows 14 miles on the gauge. It is about 8 miles to work and it shows about 2 miles left when I get there and about 25% battery left, go go figure that one out. Last week it showed 22% charged and only 1 mile range?

If I could not charge at work then I would not be able to get home on battery. I now take the slightly shorter A roads, rather than the 2 mile longer motorways as on battery I found I could not make even the single journey at motorway speeds without resorting to the engine.

3b) The petrol engine kicks in at around 65mph when on auto, and will kick in at around 75-80 when on max battery.

4) No, not a chance. That really puzzled me, I converted the BMW figures into mile I was expecting 20-25 miles, not 14 on a full charge.

5) The inbuilt iDrive efficiency gauge only goes up to 80mpg. On full battery you will get 77 ish, with both running it is hard to make any sense of it. Petrol engine generally does between 35-45 mpg.

BMW recommend you charge your car at every possibility, however it only works if charging is free, or you do not have to pay for a connection charge, for example ChargeNow, a one off connection charge is £1.20 + electricity. Bearing in mind my car only charges to 14 miles, then that comes out at roughly £1.80 or 13p per mile which according to my calculations is the same price as running it on petrol... Take into account you will most likely already have some charge in your batteries (it never seems to let you get below 6% anyway before starting the engine) then the per mile cost is even higher and definitely cheaper to run it on petrol.

So to sum up, drives like a BMW, really nice, would have been fantastic if they had taken the engine out and filled it full of batteries, as there are not enough batteries to really make them useful, knobbled further by an extremely long charge time due to them fitting a 3.7KW charger. If you are looking at a tax saving then it is a no brainer, if you want to run it like an electric car you may be better choosing something else. I think it is a mindset thing, the biggest thing is remember it is a hybrid, adding a charging socket does not turn it into an electric car as it does not have any great range.

Edit: When I first received the car it used to charge to 17 miles, now two months later it charges to 14 miles. The other thing I though I would mention is the pre-conditioning. Back in AprilI I used to use it in the cold dark mornings, plugged into a 13 Amp socket it would consume more charge than the charger would supply. I would loose 2 miles off the normal charge to heat the car up and defrost the windscreen, which would be 20-25% of the total charge. It may work better on a type 2 charger.

Hopefully enough information for you to make a decision :)
 

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I was actually trying to be subjective in my reply to allow @conblue to make up his own mind. But since we are having an opinion i will share market mine.

As i said before it is a mindset thing, it is a hybrid comparable to a Prius PHEV, the BMW has a slightly larger battery and a more powerful engine. The Prius seems to not come in for as much criticism though.

I think the issue is that people want to charge it all the time rather than driving it as a hybrid. BMW doesn't help by building it as a hybrid and then telling people to charge it whenever you can, it makes people think it is an electric car and then they hog the chargers.

I personally would not buy one, i have leased one for two years while I save up for a Tesla, the money saved in tax has just paid for a 3-phase supply and base station to support the 16.5KW charger for the model S.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve and go with what works for you. It is not a decision for a lifetime.


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I was actually trying to be subjective in my reply to allow @conblue to make up his own mind. But since we are having an opinion i will share market mine.

As i said before it is a mindset thing, it is a hybrid comparable to a Prius PHEV, the BMW has a slightly larger battery and a more powerful engine. The Prius seems to not come in for as much criticism though.

I think the issue is that people want to charge it all the time rather than driving it as a hybrid. BMW doesn't help by building it as a hybrid and then telling people to charge it whenever you can, it makes people think it is an electric car and then they hog the chargers.

I personally would not buy one, i have leased one for two years while I save up for a Tesla, the money saved in tax has just paid for a 3-phase supply and base station to support the 16.5KW charger for the model S.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve and go with what works for you. It is not a decision for a lifetime.


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I can't help but feel that most phev owners are trying to drive everywhere on electric as they think it's somehow saving them money. I did the conversion of cost petrol vs electric at 3.2 miles per KWh (only 5.5Kwh is useable) a few days ago and it compared to 60mpg equivalent in petrol. These cars don't deliver what the manufacturer claims and people are falling for it hook line and sinker. I've tried to tell people but they just don't want to hear it. 125p of petrol will take a car circa 17 miles at 60mpg. Where's the saving? The battery is too small, the system design is parallel which is less efficient and the additional weight offsets any savings. For the moment it can cheat the system and qualify for low bik, personally I'm hoping the government switch on to this soon as it's taking the market down a dead end. It costs 96p to recharge the 8kwh battery inside at 12p per kWh at home.

 

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I was actually trying to be subjective in my reply to allow @conblue to make up his own mind. But since we are having an opinion i will share market mine.

As i said before it is a mindset thing, it is a hybrid comparable to a Prius PHEV, the BMW has a slightly larger battery and a more powerful engine. The Prius seems to not come in for as much criticism though.

I think the issue is that people want to charge it all the time rather than driving it as a hybrid. BMW doesn't help by building it as a hybrid and then telling people to charge it whenever you can, it makes people think it is an electric car and then they hog the chargers.

I personally would not buy one, i have leased one for two years while I save up for a Tesla, the money saved in tax has just paid for a 3-phase supply and base station to support the 16.5KW charger for the model S.

I think you need to work out what you are trying to achieve and go with what works for you. It is not a decision for a lifetime.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think the Prius gets an easier time because it's off most EV buyers radars. I wouldn't even look at one.
 

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@Perrin21 with all due respect, there are different cars for everyone's taste and needs. This car has its place in the market as much as a Model S, Range Rover, Micra, i3 etc...

I personally wouldn't buy a range rover but I don't slate those who have bought one. I might disagree with their idea of needing that big a car but trying to shame people and telling them their car is rubbish is not going to help them change their mind. I urge you to try and let people know the facts and let them decide. I totally understand what you are saying about the 330e but i think most owners would prefer the car to do 30, 40, 50 miles etc. in ev mode but at the moment it doesn't. BMW have already announced that the iPerformance cars of which I believe the 330e, 225xe and X5e are a part of will be given bigger batteries soon. It will improve and then everyone who has had a 330e and enjoyed it will look to get a car with more ev range.

Please see them as a stepping stone to more BEVs on the road. many people don't want to change to something completely unknown. See how many Leaf drivers have actually now reverted to a PHEV/REx because of being a tad naive about range and charging networks.

I also get your point about rapids being taken up by these cars but again, if its free to use and no usage restrictions then the drivers are not at fault to use them. If Ecotricity introduced a price per charge then suddenly the situation would change but still if the 330e driver or whetever PHEV it is, wants to pay an extortionate rate to charge slowly then its their prerogative and have just as much 'right' as a leaf, i3 or Model S driver.

As a side point I am getting a 330e next week and will have it for a few months so will see what its like for myself!
 

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@Perrin21 with all due respect, there are different cars for everyone's taste and needs. This car has its place in the market as much as a Model S, Range Rover, Micra, i3 etc...

I personally wouldn't buy a range rover but I don't slate those who have bought one. I might disagree with their idea of needing that big a car but trying to shame people and telling them their car is rubbish is not going to help them change their mind. I urge you to try and let people know the facts and let them decide. I totally understand what you are saying about the 330e but i think most owners would prefer the car to do 30, 40, 50 miles etc. in ev mode but at the moment it doesn't. BMW have already announced that the iPerformance cars of which I believe the 330e, 225xe and X5e are a part of will be given bigger batteries soon. It will improve and then everyone who has had a 330e and enjoyed it will look to get a car with more ev range.

Please see them as a stepping stone to more BEVs on the road. many people don't want to change to something completely unknown. See how many Leaf drivers have actually now reverted to a PHEV/REx because of being a tad naive about range and charging networks.

I also get your point about rapids being taken up by these cars but again, if its free to use and no usage restrictions then the drivers are not at fault to use them. If Ecotricity introduced a price per charge then suddenly the situation would change but still if the 330e driver or whetever PHEV it is, wants to pay an extortionate rate to charge slowly then its their prerogative and have just as much 'right' as a leaf, i3 or Model S driver.

As a side point I am getting a 330e next week and will have it for a few months so will see what its like for myself!
knowing you Alex I don't expect you will be plugging it into ecotricity Rapids.
 

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knowing you Alex I don't expect you will be plugging it into ecotricity Rapids.
No I certainly won't. But I've waited for other PHEVs who have whilst I've been in my Roadster or i3 and despite it annoying me as well, they do have just the same right to use them unless restrictions are introduced.
 

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@Perrin21 you'd said that "feel that most phev owners are trying to drive everywhere on electric as they think it's somehow saving them money"
But that is exactly what is happening with my PHEV ( Golf GTE) that I treat as a REX.
Instead of £2.80odd of unleaded per 25 real miles, on battery it's costing me 90p, and that's when I do pay for the electrons which is about a 1/2 of my charges due to some freebie places around me. Yes my routes/trips work in my favour for this, not always the case.
So due to my Mon-Sat driving pattern it is working out fab in my case, plus the car is so much nicer than the Toyota HSD I had before, as would be a 330e !. Sunday I drove Portsmouth slap into the centre of London and back out, on time dependant trips--- I could not have done that in a BEV, so again the PHEV works for me.
Just before that I had covered 1250miles with a 1/4 tank of unleaded left before refuelling.

What I don't get, is why BMW have not put the i3 REX setup into an 1 Series or 3 Series ....... including the Touring / Couple / Cab as am sure they would fly out of the showrooms. Eep the new long-range version.
I guess they thought the 225XE would cover ?
 

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BMW have not put the i3 REX setup into an 1 Series or 3 Series
It doesn't fit, it will be in the Flat Battery Architecture which will be used as the underpinnings of all new generation models. Persistent rumour is the next MINI will have the drivetrain from the REX.

The 225XE, 330e and X540e all have a different drivetrain setup and motor, I think they are partially using it as a data collection exercise to see which motor setup works best in the field.
 

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The potential purchase by @Conbrue may be only the first step on the road to full EV, everyone has to have a starting point, and if somebody is looking at PHEV then I suspect they have some kind of a longer term vision. They are a perfect vehicle for changing the mindset of themselves or others that they live with. People will stop posting if everyone just rants, we should try to giving fact based constructive feedback.

I admit the manufacturers are not helping the charging situation, the 330e suffers by having such a tiny charger. It is BMW who is giving no consideration to other rapid chargers users by telling their customer to charge it at every possibility and then fitting them with the slowest possible chargers. I agree with @Alexander Sims, people are free to use rapid chargers, there are no rules, only etiquette, if PHEV users choose to pay for charging then they have a right to be there as much as anybody else, even with etiquette.

What I would like to see is more collaboration between the manufacturers and the customers, a working group for example. I wonder for example how many people on this forum are working close with BMW or other manufacturers to give feedback and improve the product, when was the last time you saw a BMW product owner at your dealership. I suspect never, I have tried giving feedback but there appears to be no channel to do so (apart from BMW Connected Drive which is buggy and I have 2 open defects raised with them and 1 closed). I would quite happily tell them about their small chargers impacting other drivers. It is quite obvious that manufacturers are not on the same page as their customers.

Anyway @Conbrue I hope our ramblings have helped you, one way or the other :)
 

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The charger sizing is a result of the battery size, simply put too small to rapid charge and too small to justify the extra expense of adding a KLE.

BMW do engage a subset of customers, they have been especially receptive of discussion by the i3 owners via various means - however, they very rarely if ever directly communicate. They take it on and leave you thinking its gone into a pit of silence.
 

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The charger sizing is a result of the battery size, simply put too small to rapid charge and too small to justify the extra expense of adding a KLE.

BMW do engage a subset of customers, they have been especially receptive of discussion by the i3 owners via various means - however, they very rarely if ever directly communicate. They take it on and leave you thinking its gone into a pit of silence.
It's too small to offset its own weight. It doesn't offer a tangible benefit to the car other than to get through the emissions testing procedure. It's designed to keep the 3 series on the company car list. In reality id wager most owners won't even be able to offset the cost of the home charger against the car over 3 years. I worked out it would take over 1666 charges to save £299.
 
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