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Another great post and this sums up our reasoning perfectly;

"So I say to anyone considering getting a BMW i3... get the REx option. Sure, it is quite a bit extra. But you will not regret it when rapid chargers break down or are occupied... as will be the case more and more from now on as the rapid charge network gets busier and busier - that is when it is working at all!"
 

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Autocar refreshed their i3 review yesterday and they agree with you.

The decision to spec the REx or not is discussed a lot elsewhere, it's a bit of a hot topic but I can see it from both points of view. I would have spec'd BEV if I had a 2nd car but it seems a waste to have another car sat on my drive that I only use 5 or 6 times a year (in effect, the REx is my 2nd car, tucked away in the boot).

I just think it's good that BMW offer the choice (first manufacturer to do so ?).
 

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It would bother me to constantly carrying the extra weight around, but then my driving needs are simple. I have kept our mini and it would be nice if the government made that tax exempt say on the basis that owning an ev you could nominate one ordinary car as tax free to go with. Such things would be popular.
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
@Matt Beard Thx for pointing out the typo! Changed :)

@richardglover Perhams I am looking at this all wrong but I have never remotely been concerned at carrying the extra weight. In fact, there is a lot of importance placed on weight and I understand why. The i3 is a great example of how cars of tomorrow will save weight IMO. However, my EV efficiency on the Ampera is not all that different to that of the Leaf so although it clearly would be lighter without the ICE I am not sure that in practical terms it makes a lot of difference and in any case, any difference it makes is far outweighed in my opinion by the flexibility of never ever being inconvenienced by a failed or busy charging infrastructure.

Would I prefer not to have to carry around an ICE? Of course... but I don't think we are at that stage yet where 100% BEVs can offer anything similar to the experience of owning an ICE. When it does then I'll be the first to ditch the Ampera (or whatever ER-EV I have at the time) and go 100% battery for both cars.
 

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my worry is BMW will use the REX to prove "BEV are not viable yet since everyone is buying the REX"

Some may believe this to be true but I completely disagree, if its your 2nd car, and the range fits your usage profile, dont buy a REX because your frightened into it
 

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my worry is BMW will use the REX to prove "BEV are not viable yet since everyone is buying the REX"
Why would they want to say that ?

The BMW guy on that radio 4 show yesterday said orders placed to date were sitting at roughly 50/50 which is more BEV's than they first predicted.
 

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Some may believe this to be true but I completely disagree, if its your 2nd car, and the range fits your usage profile, dont buy a REX because your frightened into it
Who want's to be forced to have a 2nd car? Some people I know buying the REx will be using one car only and while they would love to drive 100% BEV they simply cannot accept todays restrictions when driving over ~80 miles.

In our household the REx will be one of two cars and neither will be a "2nd car". For this to work both require enough range to ensure we don't need to rely on 'rapid' charging infrastructure.

It's no coincidence that many people supporting the idea of 'short' range BEV and rapid charging infrastructure also drive Ampera/Volt, Teslas, and i3 REx. If @Paul_Churchley didn't have access to an extended range EV today then he'd be driving an ICE or staying at home :(

In 5 years time when we have long range BEV together with 'rapid' and reliable charging in the UK then I'm sure we will all think again :)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
my worry is BMW will use the REX to prove "BEV are not viable yet since everyone is buying the REX.
I can see your point but having been up to London and spent some time with the UK sales manager and some of the technical team I think that this is certainly not their objective.

However, if the majority is going for the REx, and I expect they will, then it would say something wouldn't it. To me it will suggest that people want the flexibility of not being inconvenienced by risking running flat or by charger failure or queuing.

I can't imagine many people being "frightened" into it though. The inconvenience is real not imagined. My trip today shows that very clearly. Why should people have to struggle when they don't have to?

My opinion is that the BEV is not yet ready for all types of use and so is not a complete ICE replacement. People need the safety net of a REx (or ER-EV) right now and will do for some time to come. When people cannot imagine themselves running flat or having to stop for ages and many times to charge on long trips then, and only then, will they, and I, consider EVs ready for the mainstream. Give them a 250+ mile real-world range and a 30 minute charging option and then things will start to look a little different.
 

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I can see your point but having been up to London and spent some time with the UK sales manager and some of the technical team I think that this is certainly not their objective.
Unless there's been the u-turn of all u-turns, those towards the top at BMW are placing their long term bets on hydrogen. Perhaps (as some have eluded to) a plugin-hydrogen-hybrid is in their thinking? God knows what abbreviations we'd have for that kind of beast?! :D
 

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However, if the majority is going for the REx, and I expect they will, then it would say something wouldn't it. To me it will suggest that people want the flexibility of not being inconvenienced by risking running flat or by charger failure or queuing.
Or that certain parties are hyping the failures of rapid chargers to sell more REX models, there is a lot of hype around rapid charger failures but I have never experienced an issue, yes I know a lot of people have but personally I have not had a single issue since the DBT chargers went in. I use the info from #ukcharge and plan accordingly and its working out for me, now In the spirit of openness i am a light user so that will have a factor.

Never forget the sales guys work on commission so if they can convince you that you "need" a REX they will make more money
 

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Unless there's been the u-turn of all u-turns, those towards the top at BMW are placing their long term bets on hydrogen. Perhaps (as some have eluded to) a plugin-hydrogen-hybrid is in their thinking? God knows what abbreviations we'd have for that kind of beast?! :D
I would imagine they are getting pressure from the oil and gas industry to support Hydrogen. Guess who has the infrastructure to support the storage and distribution of gas in liquid form, if we all charge at home that industry will see ever increasing losses as time goes forward

Hydrogen will be pushed by big oil companies otherwise they have to role over and die eventually
 

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Never forget the sales guys work on commission so if they can convince you that you "need" a REX they will make more money
Having gone through the whole BMW sales process I found the exact opposite - no pressure at all to select the REX.

I see petrol as a great carrier of energy - I can buy it pretty much anywhere and it's quick to dispense. As an emergency range extender it's pretty much the perfect product.
 

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Having gone through the whole BMW sales process I found the exact opposite - no pressure at all to select the REX.

I see petrol as a great carrier of energy - I can buy it pretty much anywhere and it's quick to dispense. As an emergency range extender it's pretty much the perfect product.
so to play devils advocate :)

If the i3 had another battery in place of the engine and had a 200 mile range would you have still chosen REX ?
 

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Absolutely, the REX is the only option for me, having driven one a couple of times now its pretty clear that REX is the option that would convince people to ditch their ICE cars, it’s the safety net most people don’t need in reality but it’s the safety factor the car needs in order to sell it to the masses. We know most REX drivers will do their level best not to use petrol because versus the cost of electricity it would be stupid to run it for any extended period on petrol.

No network even the Tesla network can be said to be 100% reliable, Tesla have far more redundancy obviously but no e charging station can be relied on 100% however the plethora of petrol stations would ensure that in a REX you would never get stranded and there is no need to compromise.

It is my opinion that BMW see the future as hybrid REX vehicles, and Kevin is right in that sadly the current Rapid Charging network isn’t rapid and isn’t reliable, I want to make a trip up to Chester to see my sister she’s having a party, a day ago I said yes sure thing, now both chargers en route are offline, one of them has been offline for a long time which means I cant go, there just isn’t the redundancy or reliability there at the moment.

The REX isn’t a cheap option but I don’t know how many times people will be able to stand the fact that their trip are “on” on the one day and “off” on the next, this simply is not a problem with the REX.

I love my car for what it is, a short range town car pretending that long journeys are possible with any certainty at the moment is foolish and has to be undertaken with the knowledge that you might not make it or might need recovery.

I would imagine if you were let down and flat bedded more than 2-3 times in a pure BEV it would be enough to make you look at REX or dare I say it even go back to an ICE car.
 

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so to play devils advocate :)

If the i3 had another battery in place of the engine and had a 200 mile range would you have still chosen REX ?
200, probably I'd still pick a Rex. 400, I might not. There is a tipping point around there somewhere which depends on charging infrastructure...

Question is if I can go camping, fail to charge overnight, and still make it home again.
 

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Or that certain parties are hyping the failures of rapid chargers to sell more REX models, there is a lot of hype around rapid charger failures but I have never experienced an issue, yes I know a lot of people have but personally I have not had a single issue since the DBT chargers went in.
Unfortunately, lots of people are having problems, read Pauls blog or watch Nikki and Mark shivering in the Leaf on the way back from returning the Tesla recently. If we focus on each EVs strengths and market that to the correct audience then we can continue to grow market share and before we know whats happened long range and reliable rapid charging will be available at a price people can afford.

One of the most interesting things about many new Tesla Model S owners is that they are 'just' car drivers and thats when transition really takes off :)
 

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200, probably I'd still pick a Rex. 400, I might not. There is a tipping point around there somewhere which depends on charging infrastructure...
Agreed... today my 150-200 mile range is more than enough for most journeys. However, a 200+ mile range and real rapid charging would make every trip I ever drive possible including the 4000+ mile drives around Europe.
 
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