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And yet somehow Chinese mines continue to have a poor safety record, killing many employees but never get shut down?
 

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Abnormal acceleration, Battery fires?

Anyone heard anything about this?.

Chinese M3 anyone?

Damn, don’t have any free cash to buy the dip - why couldn’t they have waited until the end of the month before releasing this “story”?
 

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And yet somehow Chinese mines continue to have a poor safety record, killing many employees but never get shut down?
No, they do get shut down, just too late. Arguably the regulators are too late in the Tesla cases also. Perhaps Tesla have upset someone?
 

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No, they do get shut down, just too late. Arguably the regulators are too late in the Tesla cases also. Perhaps Tesla have upset someone?
To be honest the “unintended acceleration” stories are just driver error (they always are) and battery fires make me suspicious, lithium iron doesn’t set on fire, so it’s not a “battery” fire.
 
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Nissan Leaf 24 Tekna '64 reg
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Perhaps Tesla have upset someone?
Ha, like Jack Ma.

Law in China is not well understood. Or common sense isn't used. There were talks of Chinese Tesla owners getting upset and want to sue Tesla for lowing prices after their purchase.
 

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There have been many many unintended acceleration claims over the years - always put down by Tesla to driver error and it is common for "stamped on the accelerator when I meant the brake". Some are a bit more peculiar when it happens from a standing start and the car has shot forwards with no feet on pedals and theres video of the car doing so although nobody knows what happened inside the car. I imagine they're continue to resist it being a car issue.

Battery fires - there's also a fair bit of evidence on this on earlier batteries and batterygate and chargegate were a response to this as they reduced the stress on the batteries. Coupled that with a change in Teslas warranty allowing them to reduce the capacity of the battery through software suggests they are conscious they're pushing things hard. Whether its still a problem going forward I'm not sure
 

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I imagine the look at the logs or something...see that the seat sensor shows a passenger and the throttle is depressed
Sure - I guess the question is could interference or a software glitch have caused a false reading on throttle input? I understand there's 2 sensors on the throttle pedal so it shouldn't be a single misread that would cause the problem, but without knowing details such as how glitchy are individual sensors which usually goes undetected because the second sensor traps it, does the car log actual throttle or pedal position (thinking AP can set throttle position buy not pedal position if you follow my logic) etc We don't have the details and just have to trust their word, and while I'm personally fairly sure they will primarily, if not all, be operator error, I sadly don't trust them after their response to things that are mcu failures where they just refuse to acknowledge issues and prefer to try and quietly fix in software.
 

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Damn, don’t have any free cash to buy the dip - why couldn’t they have waited until the end of the month before releasing this “story”?
BBC are slow on the uptake, this report was well known yesterday and TSLA went up anyway. Bitcoin jitters by some old school thinking investors are more likely to cause a brief dip today.
 

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I imagine the look at the logs or something...see that the seat sensor shows a passenger and the throttle is depressed
Which proves nothing - that the car thought that the "throttle pedal" was pressed doesn't mean that it was, it just explains why the car reacted in the way that it did. In a similar way to the attitude sensor on the Boeing 737 Max saying that the nose was too high didn't mean that it was.
 

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Renault Zoe 50
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Which proves nothing - that the car thought that the "throttle pedal" was pressed doesn't mean that it was, it just explains why the car reacted in the way that it did. In a similar way to the attitude sensor on the Boeing 737 Max saying that the nose was too high didn't mean that it was.
Which would indicate in the logs.

You know they looked at the black boxes for the 737?
 

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Which would indicate in the logs.

You know they looked at the black boxes for the 737?
The logs point to what it thinks happened, doesn't mean its what did happen with respect to driver inputs.
And why would the forward collision emergency braking thing not kick in on events like this?
 

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The logs point to what it thinks happened, doesn't mean its what did happen with respect to driver inputs.
And why would the forward collision emergency braking thing not kick in on events like this?
Because it's not designed to work like that.

The car will let you accelerate at a wall if you command it to. If you see the logs and both throttle potentiometers gave the same command, it's unlikely they both failed at the same time.

Not sure why you're trying to hold Tesla to a higher standard than any other car?

Although they are introducing software that automatically selects the correct drive mode in future, to take away the human error issue.
 

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In the particular case, the claims of the owner were disproved:


In California I'm sure they could have got the logs through 'Discovery' in any legal case. Bit weird they didn't try that?
 

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The "Sudden unintended acceleration" (SUA) has been thoroughly shown again and again and again to be driver error. Search for the work done by wk057 on this. See the NHTSA investigation into this: NHTSA determines sudden acceleration complaints in Tesla vehicles were due to driver error – TechCrunch

SUA has happened many many times to people in automatic cars - a momentary mix-up between pedals, and then the instinctive response is to brake as hard as possible... but foot is still on the wrong pedal.

However, I suspect that there are two reasons why it is apparently more severe in Teslas - first is that there's no audible feedback of a noisy ICE which makes clear that the wrong pedal was pressed and gives another signal to the errant driver what is happening. The second is that compared to other vehicles in similar classes, Teslas are generally significantly quicker off the line. Let's say a buyer has come to a Model X after owning a Ford Explorer or Chevy Tahoe then a 1-second full press on the accelerator pedal gets the Tesla a LOT further and to a higher speed than either of the others. So... less noise means it takes the brain longer to figure out the pedal situation, and performance means that in any given amount of time a Tesla can wreak greater havoc in an SUA situation than another vehicle. Many SUA events that would simply be a "close call" in an ICE can be destructive in a Tesla.

But it's still down to the driver pressing the wrong pedal.
 

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Not sure why you're trying to hold Tesla to a higher standard than any other car?
I'm not especially - I've said that its highly probably that they're driver errors but, and its a big but. we don't know what Tesla records, how it works in detail and how much something like jitter noise is on something like the accelerator. sensors. Into the realms of wild speculation but lets say its far from uncommon on the car for mobile phone interference or some other issue to make the two sensors fluctuate, maybe even go negative which in computer speak is 100%. Individually thats fine because the other sensor traps it. Now if that happened once a month to either sensor randomly, no issue, but every now and again, across the whole fleet of cars, they could both glitch at the same time. I've seen a few people comment the cars raced off on them when they've been able to deal with it, but it does seem to be a thing. My point is simply saying the sensors say the foot was down is one thing, but without lots of other details is another

If other makes of car did things I'd be equally critical. I don't trust any of them to be honest. Another example of teslas behaviour is the nags on AP. After Joshua Brown died Tesla claimed the car and nags were working and it was just a lack of attention on his part. Ultimately it was his fault, but anybody who had a car back then knew the nags were almost none existent. Tesla made out no recall was required, a little bit misleading given they changed the nags considerably and much to many owners annoyance through over the air updates. Anybody's guess if the two were related but it seemed a bit of a coincidence. If Tesla can plausibly report "The log says at that moment in time the foot was to the floor" which isn't a lie as such but they have some concern over the veracity of the accuracy of the logged data, and then they go about quietly trying to fix it in software, they might, and I suspect most companies might and I think plenty of other car companies have done that much to their expense over the years when they were found out. To admit the problem would also be major.

The TL;DR is I suspect it is usually always a driver mistake, but I can also accept there may be a scenario where an issue could possibly creep in and Tesla would want to fix in private while hand on heart reporting "the computer reports the driver did it"

Its just idle speculation on a cold Tuesday afternoon. .
 

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So they forgot to give Winnie The Pooh his honey this month?
 
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