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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Some people are still trying to say they don't see much evidence of demand for this sort of thing.

It looks like nearly 400k reservations in the US alone. UK with the fourth highest total at 7133

some additional summary comments on the site:
Dec 12, 2019
Administrator Update: As of March 30, 2020, the reservations spreadsheet (reference it below) shows 622k+ Cybertruck reservations since pre-ordering began on November 21, 2020! [2019]
The last time Elon Musk disclosed Cybertruck reservation figures was on November 26, 2019 when he tweeted that 250k pre-orders had been received. That means approximately 372k orders have been received since his last update.
To compare, the Model 3 received around 518,000 total reservations between its unveiling in April 2016 and August 2, 2017 (when Musk disclosed the gross reservation figure on Tesla’s Q2 2017 earnings call).
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
From an industry analysis standpoint, I think what's important here is to note the achievement. When the Model 3 first went up for sale, with a few hundred thousand pre-orders it shattered a decades-old record held by Citroen for such orders (at least according to the blurb I've read on wikipedia). Here we are and the pre-orders for the cybertruck appear to be well beyond what we heard about for the Model 3. I don't know if that means it has set a record or not, but to my eye it says something about demand and the market for such vehicles.

When the Model 3 pre-orders occurred (particularly in a relatively moderate fossil fuel price environment) I thought finally at least the worst of the "the demand for good electric vehicles will prove to be paltry" arguments would be put to bed (forever), and so far as I am concerned, those arguments are over, but I have noticed that in some quarters there are folks who are really hanging on. While I think the basic arguments are done, to a limited degree I suppose they have at least some points. There are many gasoline burners already on the road and in a low fuel price environment, such transportation can be economically competitive. Still .... 622k pre-orders... and even in the face of moderate gasoline prices? It appears there is "some" demand. How much is "some"? Enough so that most of the knee-jerk denialists that electric vehicle demand can be substantial should think twice before answering, IMO.
 

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Musk flew a kite. People bought into it. He will now try to build it but when it will appear and in what form is open to debate.

Personally I don't stump up cash for things that don't exist.

But I guess people have to believe in something right ?
 

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Musk flew a kite. People bought into it. He will now try to build it but when it will appear and in what form is open to debate.

Personally I don't stump up cash for things that don't exist.

But I guess people have to believe in something right ?
They said this about the Model S.

Then they said it about the Model X.

Then they said it about the Model 3.

Look at us now.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
They said this about the Model S.

Then they said it about the Model X.

Then they said it about the Model 3.

Look at us now.
Have to agree. What evidence is there that Tesla is dealing in vaporware? They have delivered the models they've promised. Sure, they've had issues with schedules and volumes and some big-time quality issues, but in the end the vehicles have been there.
 

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I'm sure they will build it, or something close, but the high early reservations is probably due to the low cost as much as anything. You could only compare with the Model 3 if they'd had the same conditions.
 

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Have to agree. What evidence is there that Tesla is dealing in vaporware? They have delivered the models they've promised. Sure, they've had issues with schedules and volumes and some big-time quality issues, but in the end the vehicles have been there.
As far as delivery timeline slippages are concerned, the Model 3 was pretty much delivered "on schedule" and the Model Y now looks like being a fair bit ahead of schedule (though with some interference from COVID-19). The Model X was pretty bad, but it looks like Tesla and Musk learned some lessons from that particular episode.
 

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So the other companies have promised dates and taken consumer cash ?
They’ve taken investor cash.

FSD features have already been delivered by Tesla and they continue to roll them out. Whether you want to pay for that is completely optional.
 

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They’ve taken investor cash.

FSD features have already been delivered by Tesla and they continue to roll them out. Whether you want to pay for that is completely optional.
They have taken consumer cash on a promise that they have not delivered nor do they appear close to delivering.

Fanboys believing differently doesn't change the facts.
 

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They have taken consumer cash on a promise that they have not delivered nor do they appear close to delivering.

Fanboys believing differently doesn't change the facts.
You don’t know what you’re talking about. That’s fine.
 

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Unlike these gems:
But still you have no answer.

I'll lay it out for you.

1. When you order a new Tesla do you have to pay for FSD ? Yes
2. Do you get FSD when you pay for it ? No
3. Having paid for it do you know when FSD will be delivered ? No

Thus far FSD clearly does not exist as a deliverable product to the consumer.

There are many things to admire about Tesla but this particular business practice is not one of them.

The Cybertruck is likely to be another one as it doesn't look like a deliverable product in the form as teased. Oh and you can add the Roadster to that category. Musk has a habit of making promises he cannot deliver.

You seem like a fully paid up member of the cult and so I don't expect you to agree.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
HI Dave:

I don't have as much knowledge of FSD and in isolation the points about it seem useful. self-driving was always questionable if only in that I don't know of any government that would allow it completely. I don't doubt that there is much that is questionable with whatever Tesla is offering in this regard, and that there is more that you know about it than I do. Further, I am pretty appalled by what may be Tesla's approch to enabling or disabling it (though I need to know more). In the meantime, FSD, however, intriguing, is a feature and not a model. I think it is difficult to deliver a vehicle model to the market with anything resembling decent quality, safety and a chance at business success, let alone whether you can include most or all of the features you claimed would be part of it. I have found Tesla to be really impressive in this regard. Warts and all, I see them as five for five even if self-driving is not FSD.

It's possible that the cybertruck or the new Roadster will substantially miss what it has promised to deliver, but IMO you haven't really presented a solid reason that I can see for assuming this, not to mention that you are doing it with some notable dismissiveness in seeming to try to insist that the failure to deliver full self-driving is the thing that we should be primarily focused on here in trying to gauge what we will be getting with the pickup or the sports car.




But still you have no answer.

I'll lay it out for you.

1. When you order a new Tesla do you have to pay for FSD ? Yes
2. Do you get FSD when you pay for it ? No
3. Having paid for it do you know when FSD will be delivered ? No

Thus far FSD clearly does not exist as a deliverable product to the consumer.

There are many things to admire about Tesla but this particular business practice is not one of them.

The Cybertruck is likely to be another one as it doesn't look like a deliverable product in the form as teased. Oh and you can add the Roadster to that category. Musk has a habit of making promises he cannot deliver.

You seem like a fully paid up member of the cult and so I don't expect you to agree.
 

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But still you have no answer.

I'll lay it out for you.

1. When you order a new Tesla do you have to pay for FSD ? Yes
2. Do you get FSD when you pay for it ? No
3. Having paid for it do you know when FSD will be delivered ? No

Thus far FSD clearly does not exist as a deliverable product to the consumer.

There are many things to admire about Tesla but this particular business practice is not one of them.

The Cybertruck is likely to be another one as it doesn't look like a deliverable product in the form as teased. Oh and you can add the Roadster to that category. Musk has a habit of making promises he cannot deliver.

You seem like a fully paid up member of the cult and so I don't expect you to agree.
You don't have to pay for FSD when you order a Tesla. I didn't.
 
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