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I have an all day test drive planned this week with Mini Cooper SE and I may be looking to place an order if me and the Mrs both get on with driving the demonstrator vehicle.

I have never paid list price for a car before and don't really want to make an exception this time, however when getting quotes via CARWOW, all I get back is the price less the OLEV discount from all MINI dealers.

Has the fixed OLEV grant effectively killed the idea of discounts or perhaps all the dealers are following the Tesla fixed price example for their BEVs?

I am not in a hurry to buy at the moment as I was going to be using the car for commuting but will be WfH for 3 or 4 days a week until the end of the year, so I can wait until a deal comes up.

I would want to get the Level 2 car for not much more than a level 1 price.
Is that too ambitious?
 

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Zoe Devotee
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I have an all day test drive planned this week with Mini Cooper SE and I may be looking to place an order if me and the Mrs both get on with driving the demonstrator vehicle.

I have never paid list price for a car before and don't really want to make an exception this time, however when getting quotes via CARWOW, all I get back is the price less the OLEV discount from all MINI dealers.

Has the fixed OLEV grant effectively killed the idea of discounts or perhaps all the dealers are following the Tesla fixed price example for their BEVs?

I am not in a hurry to buy at the moment as I was going to be using the car for commuting but will be WfH for 3 or 4 days a week until the end of the year, so I can wait until a deal comes up.

I would want to get the Level 2 car for not much more than a level 1 price.
Is that too ambitious?

Its a brand new car onto the market, savings are generally less easy on a new car, especially on a new EV. Give it a few months and you'll start to see deals I'm sure.
 
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Its a brand new car onto the market, savings are generally less easy on a new car, especially on a new EV. Give it a few months and you'll start to see deals I'm sure.
Think about who is buying the MINI BEV. It is all about Brand, quality and style and not much else. Top notch build a quite quick, but terrible passenger size, boot space, only 3 door, and awful range buy 2020 standards. But if you have a short commute and no kids, especially a under 80 mile daily round trip to work, especially if it's into a congestion charge city, are you really concerned on the best deal?

These buyers generally are not, they want the car to say "i can afford a very expensive small car that is pretty much a baby BMW"
 

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Kona PremSe64k 2020+bluelink +ohme
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When investing in a new EV it is still an investment. Assuming you can fund it the trade-off is much cheaper running costs, and that over time makes the whole deal worth the effort. Just one example, if I was at home tonight (I'm away) I could charge my 64kw Kona from 0-100% for around a fiver via the Octopus Agile tariff, with probably a max price of around £10 night in, night out and no need to charge anywhere else on a normal basis, nor waste any time at petrol/diesel filling stations. Compare that with most ICE cars where each visit to the fuel station would cost us £50, and that would go out of our bank account at least once a fortnight and sometimes weekly.

My moral is that if you are making that investment then I'd recommend getting on with it. Waiting for possibly discounts in months or years to come will mean you are missing out on today's lower running costs. It's your decision but I reckon most EV owners one regret is not buying their first EV sooner. If you can buy now, don't prevaricate.
 

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Renault Zoe ZE50 GT-Line Rapid Charge
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I keep seeing adverts on TV saying Renault are "contributing" £2500 towards buying a new Zoe.
 

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I've also been struggling with getting list price discounts, when looking at the Peugeot e-208 / e-2008. The 'nearly new' market doesn't seem to be much of a thing for EVs either, as I was looking at getting a demonstrator, but like you, I am perhaps being ambitious at seeking a level 2 car for a level 1 price! That said, I am very new to car buying in general so perhaps I am still calibrating my expectations.
 

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I've also been struggling with getting list price discounts, when looking at the Peugeot e-208 / e-2008. The 'nearly new' market doesn't seem to be much of a thing for EVs either, as I was looking at getting a demonstrator, but like you, I am perhaps being ambitious at seeking a level 2 car for a level 1 price! That said, I am very new to car buying in general so perhaps I am still calibrating my expectations.
It's the classic balance of supply and demand, look on Autotrader and there's only 11 e2008 listed in the whole country, they're not piling up at the dealerships, there's no pressure to sell them. But there are over 180+ e208s and there's already some being offered below list price, albeit only a couple of thousand.

Look at something like the MG ZS which has been on the market for some time now, with plenty of stock in the dealers and there's pre-reg models available for quite a bit below list, although the list price looks a bit high now because they raised it, so some of that is a bit illusory, but many are being offered below launch prices. Same with Nissan Leafs, quite a few below list.

The power shifts to the buyer when the stock starts piling up at the dealerships and they're under pressure to get the cars shifted.When models are new and EV buyers are happily lining up and signing up to waiting lists there's no need to cut prices, those early buyers are happy to pay the list price.

I wouldn't be in any rush, deals and offers are only likely to improve because we've seen a lot of new models launch in the last 6 months, there's more to come, production volumes are ramping up so the market is only going to get more competitive which will force the manufacturers and dealers to improve their pricing. Used EV prices are also coming under pressure as more vehicles on PCP and lease come back into the market.
 

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Try getting a discount on a Kia e-niro. You want one, join the queue and pay the full price.

Supply and demand.
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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I have an all day test drive planned this week with Mini Cooper SE and I may be looking to place an order if me and the Mrs both get on with driving the demonstrator vehicle.

I have never paid list price for a car before and don't really want to make an exception this time, however when getting quotes via CARWOW, all I get back is the price less the OLEV discount from all MINI dealers.

Has the fixed OLEV grant effectively killed the idea of discounts or perhaps all the dealers are following the Tesla fixed price example for their BEVs?

I am not in a hurry to buy at the moment as I was going to be using the car for commuting but will be WfH for 3 or 4 days a week until the end of the year, so I can wait until a deal comes up.

I would want to get the Level 2 car for not much more than a level 1 price.
Is that too ambitious?
PCPs have killed the idea of list-price discounts.

You get a PCP offer, and the dealer then 'makes a contribution'.

So list prices tend to be fixed these days, and you get a 'bigger contribution' to your finance.

That's how it works.

You can haggle on the contribution they make, not on the list.

Keep your money in your pocket and lease.

I'd challenge you to make a better outright purchase deal right now than you could a PCP.

If you can find a PCH with a lender prepared to sell you the car at the end if it, it is usually cheaper too.

The problem for PCH [AFAIK, this is what someone has told me] is that some 'schemes' are tax efficient for the lenders, they don't pay VAT up front nor some other stuff, and the lender 'has' to sell the car 'elsewhere' at the end else it is regarded as a VAT fiddle. Something like that, I don't know the details.

Others don't seem to be relying on that (like RCI) and you can often buy the car, this is almost always the most cost effective at the moment.

But only 'at the moment'. YMMV.

The only question you should have is whether to PCP or PCH. Yup, buying outright is dead, and dealers are more than happy to sell you at list if you are one of those stuck-in-the-muds that INSIST it is always cheaper to buy. Not at the moment, it isn't. The car market has changed since you woke up, Mr van Winkle.
 

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What about getting a PCP and then paying off the balance in cash after a few months?
Does that work ?
Yes, its typically one of the better options if you really do want to pay the whole car off, as you get the various "contributions" donald mentions. I'm not convinced doing so makes sense though?

I guess what matters is the depreciation of the car over the period of ownership, ie purchase cost against sale cost.

If you actually have 30grand sitting there, is that money not better working for you in a investment scheme, while you simply pay the monthlies on the car? You have the option of paying it off in full at any point ofcourse, but the PCP gives you some useful levers that outright ownership doesnt, including a few "get out" clauses such as the GFV and Voluntary Termination mechanism. Ofcourse you need to factor in whatever PCP interest rate is being applied.
 

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If you actually have 30grand sitting there, is that money not better working for you in a investment scheme, while you simply pay the monthlies on the car? You have the option of paying it off in full at any point ofcourse, but the PCP gives you some useful levers that outright ownership doesnt, including a few "get out" clauses such as the GFV and Voluntary Termination mechanism. Ofcourse you need to factor in whatever PCP interest rate is being applied.
Not really, as current PCP interest rate (~5%) will be higher than a comparable savings account. Investments might be better but not generally over the time period we are talking about (3yrs) and investments can actually loose you money! Longer investments could be better, but the risk is still there.

Obviously, if you can get a 0% PCP for an EV, but I'm still waiting to see such an 🦄...
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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Of course, if you have a PCP, you have the chance to pay it off, and it is better to pay it off then ... doh!.... ;)

But one way or another the deal itself is usually done around the 'deposit contribution' finance model, now. What you do once you drive it away is a different question.
 

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Buying a car outright is NOT dead! all depends on your personal situation eg how long you want to keep the car for, mileage and of course the discounts and pricing for each transaction type. In my own experience over the last decade PCH has been cheaper and more transparent than PCP and although nearly all the cars have been obtained on PCH there are a few that would have been cheaper to own with a heavy discount off list price. All things considered tho PCH is such a hassle free way to get and then get rid of a car and the depreciation risk sits with the finance company.
 

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Buying a car outright is NOT dead! all depends on your personal situation eg how long you want to keep the car for, mileage and of course the discounts and pricing for each transaction type. In my own experience over the last decade PCH has been cheaper and more transparent than PCP and although nearly all the cars have been obtained on PCH there are a few that would have been cheaper to own with a heavy discount off list price. All things considered tho PCH is such a hassle free way to get and then get rid of a car and the depreciation risk sits with the finance company.
It's certainly not dead for used cars, indeed if your goal is low cost, economical motoring then buying a good used car outright and running it until the wheels fall off is about the lowest cost motoring you can get. New cars on PCP or PCH are a nice luxury but they're never a money saving choice, even if they're EVs, the depreciation or monthly payments easily eat any notional fuel or maintenance savings for breakfast, because the depreciation costs dominates. Low cost motoring is as much about minimising your depreciation as reducing your fuel and maintenance costs.
 

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I guess what matters is the depreciation of the car over the period of ownership, ie purchase cost against sale cost.

If you actually have 30grand sitting there, is that money not better working for you in a investment scheme, while you simply pay the monthlies on the car?
That depends! I'm in the process of moving from an 11 year old car, which is still a perfectly functional tool, and buying an MG EV, on which I've got a good deal. Never had a newer car than 4 years old before but as I sold some shares at peak the money sitting in my bank wasn't working for me, the divis were down too and I couldn't see any other obvious opportunities. Maybe it's partly my age and thinking I can't take it with me, but on the practical side can use my rooftop PV and get my friend to install the charger.

As for depreciation, it's never been an issue with previous cars, so I very much hope if I treat the battery nicely this one lasts with as few issues as my previous cars. This is about the first car, even at 11 years old, that I've disposed of before I really needed to.. The MG seems to have a better BMS than the Leaf at any rate so I'm hopeful on that account.
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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It's certainly not dead for used cars, indeed if your goal is low cost, economical motoring then buying a good used car outright and running it until the wheels fall off is about the lowest cost motoring you can get. New cars on PCP or PCH are a nice luxury but they're never a money saving choice....
Again, one has to look at the specifics.

Old stuck-in-the-muds like you are golden to 'the trade'. Keep 'em coming, line 'em up.

Open your eyes and get your calculator out.

How can any other car possibly compete with my new Zoe? It will work out at 20p/mile over 30k miles. If I buy a 2nd hand car that does 40mpg and costs £140 a year to tax, say two years, then it'll cost 13.6p/mile in fuel, 1p/mile in road tax, 1.5p/mile in new tyres (unless they were brand new when you bought your 2nd hand car and don't need to change them) assuming 'nothing whatsoever goes wrong with it', and that will leave you the grand total of ~£1,200 remaining to account for depreciation over 2 years.

Really, you have to have been one of those kids at the back of the class who could never do mental arithmetic to not figure out what is best here.
 

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Again, one has to look at the specifics.

Old stuck-in-the-muds like you are golden to 'the trade'. Keep 'em coming, line 'em up.
The people who are golden to the trade are the ones regularly changing their cars, that's the purpose of PCPs and PCHs to keep the buyers coming back and lining up every 2, 3 or 4 years like clock-work, handing back a perfectly good car they can resell for a profit and signing up to a new deal to take a brand new one. The manufacturers warranty means most will go to the dealers for their servicing. For the manufacturers and dealers it's brilliant.
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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The people who are golden to the trade are the ones regularly changing their cars, that's the purpose of PCPs and PCHs to keep the buyers coming back and lining up every 2, 3 or 4 years like clock-work, handing back a perfectly good car they can resell for a profit and signing up to a new deal to take a brand new one. The manufacturers warranty means most will go to the dealers for their servicing. For the manufacturers and dealers it's brilliant.
The arithmetic proves you wrong.

I mean, I am not saying that there might not be a storming 2nd hand deal and a really crap PCP.

But the BEST deals are the cheapest PCPs, right now.

The market will adjust this in due course, it'll wave back and forth. The secret is not to get too invested into one 'model' of car buying or another, lest one misses a bargain, be it PCP, PCH, or direct purchase.

Blank out one or other because 'you know this' then you'll miss the trick. The whole point of the market is that sellers will make offers to draw people from one type of 'buying' into another, ergo, it is all about timing, not the type of deal itself. They make something super cheap, get customers on a roll, then jack the prices. Look out for the super cheap.

Buyer beware, and all that.
 
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