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The only users of Type 2 destination sockets are;
  • PHEV day trippers and commuters who have used more than half their battery getting there
  • BEV users who are staying overnight somewhere near (includes flat residents/no drive, etc)
  • BEV day trippers with an emergency (usually self-inflicted, who have royally fooked their charging strategy for the day)
I think you've failed to yet become fully engaged with the mindset of being a Zoe owner.

In happier times, our weekly schedule would involve driving to a local shopping centre, where we would plug into the 22 kW destination charger.

Whilst we drink our milky coffees and fresh orange juice, stroll around and do our weekly shop, the Zoe is getting it's charge for the week.

All part of the incentive the shopping centre uses to convince us to visit.
 

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What is a destination charger? I've Googled it but there's no agreed definition, it seems. Tesla seems to have coined the term.

I'm guessing that if I arrive at a destination and charge my car, then that's a destination charger, but if I arrive at that self same charger on the way to somewhere and charge my car, then it's not a destination charger?

Is it something to do with what it pumps out in terms of kWh that in some way makes it a destination charger, but only if it's at your destination?

I may have more questions later, depends on the answers.
As far as im aware a destination charger is usually 7kw, although some are slower 3.6kw, and there are a few that can even put out 22kw on a type 2 if your car can draw that amount (renault zoe).
I always assumed that the term destination implied that you have arrived at a location and you would probably be there for a few hours. Hence they tend to be in places like park and ride car parks, council and private car parks, store car parks etc.
Places where the vehicle will be left for a few hours to achieve what might be a reasonable amount of juice if required over the time frame.
 

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Ad the reason BEVs shouldn't use destination chargers is that; if they arrive 'needing' the charger then the driver has already sorely miscalculated and risked not getting home, but if they have mitigated that risk then they don't need to charge. BEVs should only use destination chargers if it really is an 'emergency' and their rapids along the way failed.
Simply untrue. I have on multiple occasions planned to use a 7kW destination charger whilst on a journey. It all depends on the availability of chargers, how hungry you are and exactly how much you need to top up by. Sometimes you will have a break of say 90 minutes and the rapid has a limit of 1 hour, but you know that a nearby destination charger will give you enough energy to complete your journey, even though you're currently nowhere near desperation levels and have multiple other charger options. It's simply more convenient to do this, and in some cases cheaper too.
 

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Adding to my previous post on the differences between rules and etiquette, I would add a third tier of public charging conduct, consideration.

Rule

Don’t exceed the maximum time limit imposed by the landowner/charge point operator.

Etiquette

Don’t use a Rapid unless your vehicle can pull >7kW.

Consideration

Disconnect early if someone is waiting and you have enough range to get to your next destination.

The only sanctionable offense is to break a rule. It is up to the landowner/charge point operator to enforce this. At most we could express our annoyance to the perpetrator and potentially report them.

Etiquette is dictated by what the majority of the group (charging point users) view as fair and appropriate conduct. By not abiding by this conduct, you have not broken any rules, and there are not any formal sanctions. So we can try and win over the non compliant by our own conduct, or some friendly advice if they will accept that. They may at most feel an outcast, but if they have thick skins, they probably will be oblivious to that anyway.

Consideration is going that extra mile and doing something that even good etiquette doesn’t require. It’s perhaps making a sacrifice to make someone else’s life a little easier. There’s no reward, except the good feeling you get from having done someone a good turn, and hopefully the thanks and appreciation of the person that you helped.

80% of people will respect the rules.

60% will respect the rules and observe the etiquette.

40% will respect the rules and observe the etiquette and show consideration.

Which tier are you in?
 
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You should never need to use a destination charger in a BEV. You'd be the one obstructing it.

Quite funny, really. You're in a BEV and can't get a charge, and you're royally fooked because it is not working. The PHEV just drives home.... and you say THAT is the half-arsed solution? heh... funny ...
Blimey 3 pages on already and mostly Donald. Who was talking about destination "chargers"? I was talking about PHEVs blocking rapid chargers. I agree I would rarely need to use a destination charger, but might use one if I was there for a fair while, it was free, and my battery was low. Usually to offset parking charges.
 

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Chernobyl 2.0
Don’t use a Rapid unless your vehicle can pull >7kW.
I never understood why some PHEVs had DC charging. Why fit a massive, expensive CHAdeMO connector when the battery is so tiny anyway? How many times would you have to use it to cover the cost of fitting it and the DC charging module?
 

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I wondered why this thread kept appearing at the top of new posts, and then saw Donald had become involved.

Moaning about people contriving charging situations to prove a point, then does it himself and insults a few people along the way. Usual MO.

I use destination chargers all the time, they’re parking spaces with a Type 2 socket, what are they for if not for electric vehicles of any sort?

What will sort it out, if not arguing about it on SpeakEV, is the fitment of many more destination chargers at destinations (!) where cars are left for a long time. Car parks, work, travel hubs, hospitals, cinemas etc etc.

Then there’s plenty of space for even PHEVs to charge, leaving rapids for rapid charging, and lowering Donald’s blood pressure too.
 

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You might not be looking hard, then?

What of a PHEV driver that uses their full 12kWh, parks up for their 8 hour working day, then plugs in at 3kW.
...
What of a driver with 30kWh in his 60kWh BEV to do his 5 mile commute, who parks up to charge for 8 hours.

Which one is charge point hogging?
Both of them. Either is an inappropriate use of the charger facilities. You'll be arguing next that someone filling their diesel Chelsea tractor has a right to park on the pump for the 8 hours they are at work after they've filled up.

That is why there should be charge per minute. If they want to park in front of expensive infrastructure then it is reasonable that they pay for the time that they do.
 

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..... it's just planning on using a type 2 along the way....
You've just defined 'not a destination charger'.

In your case, you have to go find a 7kW or 22kW, and indeed I would concede for your peculiar case (and in fact mine, now) your chosen en route charger may also be at your destination. I would agree that creates a pickle, semantically.

My whole narrative here came about because of the question of charging people a premium extra because they were plugged in but not charging. That is basically a ploy by BEV users to try to shun PHEVs off the very chargers that are most suited for PHEV and least suited for BEV.
 

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What is a destination charger? I've Googled it but there's no agreed definition, it seems. Tesla seems to have coined the term.

I'm guessing that if I arrive at a destination and charge my car, then that's a destination charger, but if I arrive at that self same charger on the way to somewhere and charge my car, then it's not a destination charger?
I will provide my definition. Other people may come up with their own meaning, but I expect theirs will be ambiguous.

A destination charger is where 'the owner of a destination' who wants you to leave your house specifically to visit their location, has installed a charge point as a convenience and/or incentive for you to do precisely that.

I'll happily take challenges on that definition, and I acknowledge potential limitations of it and reserve the possibility of changing that if they are good challenges so as to improve it.
 

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I'm afraid I can't agree with the last part... I know a couple of bev drivers in watford who don't have home chargers, (no driveway or dropped kerb), and they use the free ones when shopping at Tesco and B&Q.
Is that not covered by;
BEV users who are staying overnight somewhere near (includes flat residents/no drive, etc)

?

maybe I should have added (without access to their own driveway home charge point, just to clarify? I did cover that in the small print.)
 

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I think you've failed to yet become fully engaged with the mindset of being a Zoe owner.

In happier times, our weekly schedule would involve driving to a local shopping centre, where we would plug into the 22 kW destination charger.

Whilst we drink our milky coffees and fresh orange juice, stroll around and do our weekly shop, the Zoe is getting it's charge for the week.

All part of the incentive the shopping centre uses to convince us to visit.
Just for the avoidance of doubt, are you repudiating the claim that you are a sad fat git?

;)
 

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This thread has just become a wall of angry donald posts. Chernobyl was nothing compared to this.
 

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This thread has just become a wall of angry donald posts. Chernobyl was nothing compared to this.
Only about the on-going and ever-discussed arrogance of BEV drivers who think destination chargers are their preserve, and PHEV drivers should go elsewhere (nor rapids .. i.e. never charge).

If you are not one of those, then I am not angry with you. Are you?
 

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This used to be quite an interesting thread, with anecdotes about unpleasant characters EV drivers come across. I still persevere in coming back when there is a new post to see if there is anything I want to read.
 

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Discussion Starter #178
This used to be quite an interesting thread, with anecdotes about unpleasant characters EV drivers come across. I still persevere in coming back when there is a new post to see if there is anything I want to read.
Unfortunately for this thread everyone I've encountered along all 18 charge sessions this past week has been very nice, friendly and considerate. No more horror stories to share for now!

Worst thing I've seen recently is charging connectors on the ground in puddles/mud or pointed upwards in the rain. And honestly I blame Ecotricity more than the drivers for that since the holders are totally inadequate.

I'm sure I'll be back in the not too distant future with some other ridiculous encounter with others on my travels though.
 

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Double standard.
You seem to not want to be shooshed away from a fastcharger on your 22kw charging zoe by the tesla guy, but at the same time, have a dig at charging PHEVS.



It either matters how fast it charges or not. But your comments towards PHEVs charging seem no different to the tesla guy wanting CCS that you're complaining about. (in my opinion they should be the prime users of public chargers as EVs can charge at home in 99% of situations, while theyre the ones that need charging constantly to run as an EV).
 

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Problem is rapid chargers don't lock the connector. The car does in the case of type 2 or CCS. That's what bugs me most when you see a Golf GTE plugged into a rapid charger for example. You know the charger is useless for hours if they have plugged in and walked off intending to only return when they're finished charging. If it stops a minute later after detecting a very low charge rate, it's still probably too late and the owner has already walked off.
On CCS / Type 2 the car locks the socket, on Chademo the Rapid charger locks the plug.

You can't unplug a Chademo car while it's charging regardless of the model of car as the locking is in the plug under control of the charger, and remains locked until the charge session ends.

However some chargers (Instavolt) allow a stranger to press the stop button on the charger to end the session prematurely (and therefore unlock the plug) while others (Charge Place Scotland) will not allow a stranger to end someone else's charging session, and the session can only be prematurely ended by re-presenting the same RFID card or using the same app account to end it if the charge was started by app.

This prevents strangers from removing the cable before you're finished but will unlock it automatically if the car finishes charging naturally, which seems like a good compromise for a tethered charger with two parking spaces per charger.
 
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