Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner
21 - 40 of 51 Posts

· Premium Member
Joined
·
12,845 Posts
The GM Spark EV has CCS as an option too. With the number of manufacturers supporting it look likely to become the new standard.

http://bcove.me/2hvl8ui4
 

· Premium Member
Joined
·
12,845 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
6,489 Posts
Paul Churchley said:
It looks to me that the CCS plug will not fit into a J1772 socket on the cars so although you could use a J1772 if the car has CCS you won't be able to use the CCS charger on a car that has J1772 (Ampera). That is a pity.
I think for the foreseeable future you'll continue to get the sort of setup you get these days with both DC and AC chargers side by side. Locations that are AC only will of course just offer J1772.

And of course the chargers will continue to be out of order any time the spaces aren't ICEd. :roll:
 

· Registered
Joined
·
6,489 Posts
Paul Churchley said:
Duncan said:
Locations that are AC only will of course just offer J1772.
Don't you mean type 2 sockets and not J1772?
Not sure. If they are offering tethered cables for CCS, why would they not put in a tethered cable for J1772 as well? So far I've only used one public charger with a tethered cable in the UK, but that seems to be the common model for the US.
 

· Premium Member
Joined
·
12,845 Posts
The new ecotricity units seem reliable and so far I have not found them to be ICEd - the proper hatching on the ground helps and it is shame more posts do not something similar.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
9,330 Posts
Duncan said:
Not sure. If they are offering tethered cables for CCS, why would they not put in a tethered cable for J1772 as well? So far I've only used one public charger with a tethered cable in the UK, but that seems to be the common model for the US.
I guess that is because the CCS is high power. The rapid charger systems seem to have tethered cables and the lower powered ones (below 43kw) you seem to have to provide your own cable.

Just an observation... might be wrong tho :)
 

· Registered
Joined
·
6,489 Posts
Paul Churchley said:
Duncan said:
Not sure. If they are offering tethered cables for CCS, why would they not put in a tethered cable for J1772 as well? So far I've only used one public charger with a tethered cable in the UK, but that seems to be the common model for the US.
I guess that is because the CCS is high power. The rapid charger systems seem to have tethered cables and the lower powered ones (below 43kw) you seem to have to provide your own cable.

Just an observation... might be wrong tho :)
I found a new Ecotricity charging point yesterday. By new I mean you can see they haven't removed the red and white tape, and also unfortunately they hadn't turned it on.

This is one of their new AC/DC 50kW charging points. The cable on the side where I'm parked is a CCHAdeMO, the cable on the other side has a cable terminating in a Mennekes connector. It looked like I could have plugged my existing cable into the end of that cable, but I've no idea whether it would have worked: the Ecotricity website has quite a short list of vehicles compatible with these new chargers (Nissan LEAF, Citroen C-Zero, Mitsubishi I-MiEV, Peugeot Ion, Renault Zoe).

Has anyone else come across one of these in working order?
 

· Registered
Joined
·
9,330 Posts
That looks like the ones that are installed at the Welcome Break areas. I have used them quite a bit over the past few weeks.

Someone has tried plugging in a type 2 to type 1 cable into the AC side and it won't work. I haven't looked at it myself but I suspect that it would be male to male or female to female... either way they reported that it couldn't be done :-(
 

· Premium Member
Joined
·
12,845 Posts
Will either of the rapid charge plugs work with the Tesla S - just in case I win the lottery ;-)
 

· Militant EV driver!
Joined
·
4,943 Posts
There's quite a bit of misinformation in this thread so here is an attempt to correct it...

- Ecotricity are no longer installing the GE medium power AC Type 2 sockets at their rapid charge sites. So that freezes out the Ampera and other PHEVs. I don't have a problem with this at Motorway locations, but for destination charging this is very unhelpful. It also removes the redundancy this posts provided when the rapid charger (all too often) fails.

- CCS or Combo chargers in Europe have a combined Type 2 (Mennekes) plus the two DC pins. In North America CCS or Combo has Type 1 (J1772) and the two DC pins. Even if we did have Type 1 CCS, the larger plug would snag on the bodywork.

- The photo in Duncan's first post shows the Type 2 CCS and the second in the guy's hand is a Type 1 CCS.

- If you plug a ITT Type 1 - Type 2 cable into the Ecotricity rapid charger's AC side, it will physically mate but there is an electrical incompatibility (I suspect the charger is detecting the resistors in both cables and throwing an error).

- If you plug the AC cable from an Ecotricity charger into a Tesla Model S, it will charge but only at 11kW or 22kW depending on which charging option you specified. Better off getting Tesla's CHAdeMO adapter for 50kW charging on the DC side (assuming you specified supercharging).

- It would be possible to plug a tethered AC Type 2 cable like that on the Ecotricity chargers into the Ampera with a simple physical adapter. Electrically they are the same.

- CHAdeMO is not being phased out by 2018. Instead there is a proposal to not allow any further installs of CHAdeMO using public funds after that date at an EU level. It's not yet law and there have been statements saying that the proposed legislation will be modified to allow both (after lobbying from Nissan and the CHAdeMO association).
 

· Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
As someone mentioned I plugged a standard mennekes cable (the one you plug to the 22kW charge points) to the 43KW AC fast charger but the equipment doesn't recognize that the vehicle is attached to it. Is this still complying with the IEC 62196 standard? The plug did seem a bit loose.
As it appears, some service areas served by ecotricity only have this type (no 22KW AC chargers) which might be an issue for some of us.
 

· Banned
Joined
·
3,684 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
307 Posts
As someone mentioned I plugged a standard mennekes cable (the one you plug to the 22kW charge points) to the 43KW AC fast charger but the equipment doesn't recognize that the vehicle is attached to it. Is this still complying with the IEC 62196 standard? The plug did seem a bit loose.
As it appears, some service areas served by ecotricity only have this type (no 22KW AC chargers) which might be an issue for some of us.
If you are describing plugging the Type 2 plug on a lose cable into a Type 2 vehicle connector tethered to a charge point - and thus connecting 2 cables end-to-end - then it's absolutely correct not to work. There's no provision in the standard for connecting multiple cables end-to-end which defeats the ability for the charge point to decode the current capacity of the cable and thus risks overload.
 

· Banned
Joined
·
3,684 Posts
There's no provision in the standard for connecting multiple cables end-to-end which defeats the ability for the charge point to decode the current capacity of the cable and thus risks overload.
Correct, which is why I wrote "if you know what you are doing"... FYI it works perfectly and many Roadster and other EV owners have used the technique by using modified or first generation connectors (which supported daisy chaining as envisioned by Mennekes prior to the publication of the IEC standard).
 

· Registered
Joined
·
608 Posts
Sorry but this is nonsense - even if you knew what you were doing, what about the idiot that can simply pull the connectors apart? The plug mod is also expressly against all the operator T&Cs I've read. So is not the way forward.

I'm appalled at the level of 'help' in this thread, suggesting variously that an Ampera could use any Rapid charger, that a CCS plug looks as though it could support J1772 - but perhaps best of all, Ecotricity site have a T2 option! Not from a Rapid they don't, and the company has stopped supporting T2. Any remaining sites will eventually be removed - so it's the end of the road for motorway driving for non Rapid cars - I know, I've had two of them.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
307 Posts
Correct, which is why I wrote "if you know what you are doing"... FYI it works perfectly and many Roadster and other EV owners have used the technique by using modified or first generation connectors (which supported daisy chaining as envisioned by Mennekes prior to the publication of the IEC standard).
I don't think we should recommend cobbling up non-standard cables / connectors in order to defeat recognised international standards and potentially compromise safety. If we were to do that, and injury to people or damage to equipment resulted, who would be responsible?
 

· Banned
Joined
·
3,684 Posts
Sorry but this is nonsense - even if you knew what you were doing, what about the idiot that can simply pull the connectors apart?.
What about the knowledgeable person who implements a lockable collar that prevents the connectors from being pulled apart?

As I stated previously, the connectors fully supported daisy chaining prior to the current standards (which are just standards not laws).
 

· Registered
Joined
·
307 Posts
The person who modified the cable like any other DIY project.
We don't usually put our DIY projects in public places. However your position appears to be that you can tell someone how to defeat an international standard, which you appear to accept has risks attached, but if anyone follows your instructions and injury results then it's their fault for modifying a cable?
 
21 - 40 of 51 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top