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An impressive facility.

Although I was a bit shocked by the final bit: "The forecourt is in part being paid for by a £4.86m grant from the government." So that's costing more than £5 million to build?
 

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A bit shocked! It's outrageous. I will be writing to Mr Cleverly to explain what a waste of money it is . How much does it cost to install a 50kW charger? About £100k - 200k? So you'd get 25 - 50 charging points for £5m. Should cover a lot of Essex wit that.
 

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Hah. Read a bit more about it
"The project has been partly funded by a £4.86m grant from Innovate UK, a government-backed agency that offers financial support to UK-based technology developers".
So the govt. money is to support a £1bn project
Sorry Mr Cleverly.
 

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Not cheap, but initial thoughts are that it's a good answer of the current issue of not enough chargers at each 'station'. At the moment there only tends to be 1 or 2 chargers so it doesn't take much for someone to pull up ahead of you and you've got to wait 20min before using it. This is a solution that gives the user confidence there's going to be a free spot at the station.
 

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Not cheap, but initial thoughts are that it's a good answer of the current issue of not enough chargers at each 'station'. At the moment there only tends to be 1 or 2 chargers so it doesn't take much for someone to pull up ahead of you and you've got to wait 20min before using it. This is a solution that gives the user confidence there's going to be a free spot at the station.
I can see the argument with 1 charger. But with 2 I think it is fine. I'd rather see it spread out everywhere with sets of 2 chargers all over the region, rather than putting 24 all in one place. My local Fastned is a great example of why it is pointless, especially now they started billing for usage. The entire station typically sees one or two cars on a good day stopping at the high power chargers. The 50kW units unused for so long they have become a new home to various insects.

The only place where this is possibly a good idea is at motorway services imo.
 

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I can see the argument with 1 charger. But with 2 I think it is fine. I'd rather see it spread out everywhere with sets of 2 chargers all over the region, rather than putting 24 all in one place. My local Fastned is a great example of why it is pointless, especially now they started billing for usage. The entire station typically sees one or two cars on a good day stopping at the high power chargers.
I differ in opinion - I think the distribution of 1 or 2 fast chargers (at least browsing zap-map) is OK in most of the country, however there is no confidence in availability or operation of the units.

I'm not against 2bay fast-charger sites all over, but once the UK is completely 'filled in' we need big sites on major roads.

With the BIK changes, and more business users in EV's on the road shortly confidence and "guarenteed" charging is key in ensuring uptake.

I suspect your Fastned experience is skewed by cost and possibly facilities. Since you mentioned them, I assume only Dundee is still operational in the UK so compare the utilisation of the Dundee supercharger in contrast. That's 8 bays and I can only imagine its utilisation is far greater than Fastned.

With the Tesla on longer trips I (and I am sure most others) actively avoid 2 (or if given a choice, 4) stall sites even though operability is just-about-guarenteed and utilisation is known in realtime as things can change any minute. This is partly why Tesla has been discouraged not building 2-charger sites, and more recently 4-bay sites in the UK.

IMHO - build many of them, make it convenient and price it right and they will come.

The only place where this is possibly a good idea is at motorway services imo.
Agree. I believe I read in their marketing-spew that it is ultimately what Gridserve wants to become
 

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I differ in opinion - I think the distribution of 1 or 2 fast chargers (at least browsing zap-map) is OK in most of the country, however there is no confidence in availability or operation of the units.

I'm not against 2bay fast-charger sites all over, but once the UK is completely 'filled in' we need big sites on major roads.

With the BIK changes, and more business users in EV's on the road shortly confidence and "guarenteed" charging is key in ensuring uptake.

I suspect your Fastned experience is skewed by cost and possibly facilities. Since you mentioned them, I assume only Dundee is still operational in the UK so compare the utilisation of the Dundee supercharger in contrast. That's 8 bays and I can only imagine its utilisation is far greater than Fastned.

With the Tesla on longer trips I (and I am sure most others) actively avoid 2 (or if given a choice, 4) stall sites even though operability is just-about-guarenteed and utilisation is known in realtime as things can change any minute. This is partly why Tesla has been discouraged not building 2-charger sites, and more recently 4-bay sites in the UK.

IMHO - build many of them, make it convenient and price it right and they will come.



Agree. I believe I read in their marketing-spew that it is ultimately what Gridserve wants to become
I wasn't aware Fastned was in Dundee. I thought Sunderland was the only one in the UK, with the next supposedly being Newcastle, though everything went quiet regarding the development of that since they opened the first one.

I agree my local Washington supercharger sees a lot more use. But with that it's because its just behind the A1. With Fastned they put it just behind Sunderland City centre. Not particularly close to the major roads like the A1 or A19 and that's where they went wrong.

If they swapped locations with the Tesla supercharger I feel like the numbers would be different. And if every Tesla driver paid for supercharging, especially at Fastned prices I again think the usage would again drop.

Also to clarify when you talk about 2 Bay fast chargers. I don't mean one charger with 2 parking spaces. I mean like the typical Instavolt install with 2 separate chargers. If there were more of them dotted around it would be better than one central charging hub, with the only big 24 bay hubs like in this article being on motorways and the major A roads.
 

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If there were more of them dotted around it would be better than one central charging hub, with the only big 24 bay hubs like in this article being on motorways and the major A roads.
We need both. One or the other simply won't do (unless/until every local petrol station has been converted to a 4 bay charging spot, which is unlikely).
This is a start. I can't believe people are moaning about it.
 

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We need both. One or the other simply won't do (unless/until every local petrol station has been converted to a 4 bay charging spot, which is unlikely).
This is a start. I can't believe people are moaning about it.
I'm fully supportive of the fact that both is something we all hope for. But there will be various excuses and delays revolving around not having the money to install such a thing everywhere. For now if I had to pick, my above suggestion of a fair distribution around the entire area, meaning more people have local chargers is better than a central charging hub.

As I said, with the levels of demand we have right now, a couple of rapids here, a couple there etc. is enough. But to enable long journeys that's where we are more desperate for Ecotricity to either do something productive (be that an extensive rollout of more, newer, faster, more reliable chargers, or for them to withdraw and allow another company to do a better job)

I'm not moaning about it. I'm simply pointing out evidence to suggest that it's never going to see much use and that for now any available funding for EV Charging infrastructure is probably best spread out evenly elsewhere.
 

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What a total waste of money, it does nothing to advance the take up of EVs and just shows how little people understand what is actually required.

Surely the coachway charging hub in MK was the first.
 

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I'm fine with this if it helps people realise that slow charging speeds = queues = not practical for national rollout.
 

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We need 350 kWh chargers in hubs all over the motorways and A roads. Having low power rapids in ones and twos all over the place is a total waste of time and money. I drove EV's for three years and am back in an ICE. No way will I be in an EV hoping when I need a charge that the charger works, isn't being used and is not ICE'd. As a start there should be at least six high power reliable non ice-able chargers at every MSA/A road/ major garage. Lets get real most people just cannot afford the time, hassle and unpredictability of what we have now. (Tesla have it right).
 

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Also - just in the budget,

Mr Sunak has promised to spend £500m to support the rollout of new rapid charging hubs for electric cars, which he says will ensure that drivers are never more than 30 miles away from being able to charge their vehicle.
 

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As I said, with the levels of demand we have right now, a couple of rapids here, a couple there etc. is enough
Yes, to cater for the majority of EVs from the last several years with sub-100 mile real ranges and which largely pootle around locally on home charging. But that's yesterday.

Tomorrow the new uptake of 200 mile EVs need to be able to undertake long journeys without having to scour the countryside for an available charger. These sort of hubs are absolutely essential for that, so people will be happy to drop their ICE for an EV knowing that longer trips won't be a nightmare.

I know there are hypermiling EV owners on here who do long journeys, but they all have a plan, plus a B and C and drive without heating or aircon. That's just not the way most people want to travel.

Right now there is a 350 mile round trip I'd like to take, but looking at zap-map and the few 'possible' chargers I might be able to use has put me off, even in a Kona. I'd only need one charge, but I could spend hours trying to get it. If there was a hub like this even 20-30 miles off my track I'd be happy to do it.
 

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I also don't understand the whole moaning about this project. Some say 2 chargers spread evenly are enough. They are NOT!
It is ok for now with very small number of EVs on roads but it is completely impractical for the future uptake. And this project is exactly that - for the future. Maybe not all the chargers need to be installed immediately as initially utilization will be low. But there needs to be at least space / infrastructure for the future expansion.

Take a look at some other sites in Norway, Germany, etc: Tesla SC has >30 chargers in some locations right now. And some of those are already heavily utilised (Norway). If we want mass adoption of EVs we need to be prepared for that.

Another problem is of course "destination chargers" (slow chargers) for people without hoe chargers. But that's task for local councils.
 

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It will take 20 to 30 minutes to charge a vehicle, those behind the project say

But Skoda say about the Mii

The Mii electric’s 36.8 kWh battery will charge to 80% in around four hours using a standard home wall box. A three-pin domestic plug can take up to 16 hours to charge your car, while a rapid public charge point can be as quick as one hour.

So can this new technology really charge a Mii in 20-30 minutes or do they just have no insight into the restrictions of current EVs?
 

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So can this new technology really charge a Mii in 20-30 minutes or do they just have no insight into the restrictions of current EVs?
The latter of course - if your BMS refuses to go over 5kW no amount of press articles will "rectify" your car's capabilities.
 

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It will take 20 to 30 minutes to charge a vehicle, those behind the project say

But Skoda say about the Mii

The Mii electric’s 36.8 kWh battery will charge to 80% in around four hours using a standard home wall box. A three-pin domestic plug can take up to 16 hours to charge your car, while a rapid public charge point can be as quick as one hour.

So can this new technology really charge a Mii in 20-30 minutes or do they just have no insight into the restrictions of current EVs?
Are you just arguing with yourself?
 
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