Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner

41 - 60 of 100 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,765 Posts
BTW - Shouldn't be driving a car with 4" of snow on the roof #illegal
Bloody hell - I would not be driving with the snow still on the roof !.
If it’s been sitting there all night, the cold temp transfer through the glass will make the cabin even colder.
Trust me, my previous car had a glass roof and it does take longer to get the cabin toasty.
My present car is the same make and model to the previous car, but it has NO sun roof, much quicker to get the cabin toasty !.
The MG has a FULL piano roof on the Exclusive model, that is a LOT of single layered glass to heat up !.
Just to say also, when it is really cold ( -6 ish ) you will hear the glass roof creak and groan when going over speed bumps etc.
This will stop as soon as the internal temp rises of course.
Note of caution, don’t try tipping opening the front section of the roof for ventilation until the temp has been raised.
Otherwise the roof will stick with the frost to the roof and will rip the wind proof seals around the pano roof.
If you are really unlucky, you even blow the fuse or burn something out by keeping you finger on the button.
I know somebody who did both of the above and the repair bill was huge !.
Given the above, am I having the pano roof - of course.
For me, the Pro’s beat the Con’s hands down.
The light it allows into the car makes it feel a much bigger space than it already is.
 

·
Zoe Devotee
Joined
·
7,634 Posts
If it’s been sitting there all night, the cold temp transfer through the glass will make the cabin even colder.
Interesting, google Snow and Insulation. Goes against your claim.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,765 Posts
Interesting, google Snow and Insulation. Goes against your claim.
Bugger Google, my old bones don’t lie !. Ha Ha !.
Anything between 50 ad 95% of the head lining is missing with a sun / pano roof, so any ( all be it small ) insulation offered here is lost.
My wife has a Fiat 500 with a fixed glass sun roof, my daughter has the very same car with out the roof, she said she finds our car takes longer to get warm in the winter.
I know what Google said.
It say’s Typhoo on the side of a bus, but they don’t sell tea.
That’s what my Dad use to say, bless him !.
 

·
Zoe Devotee
Joined
·
7,634 Posts
Thin steel roofs don't exactly retain much heat. The glass is thicker than steel. Only difference is the thin pad of roof lining. Maybe you could make a nice knitted tammy hat for the inside of the glass, complete with bobbles? Would look nice if you colour coded it to car too. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,765 Posts
Thin steel roofs don't exactly retain much heat. The glass is thicker than steel. Only difference is the thin pad of roof lining. Maybe you could make a nice knitted tammy hat for the inside of the glass, complete with bobbles? Would look nice if you colour coded it to car too. :)
How funny !.
“Tempting, but then again - NO”.
 

·
Zoe Devotee
Joined
·
7,634 Posts
How funny !.
“Tempting, but then again - NO”.
Awwww! Why not? If you did a good job I might commission you to make me one too lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,765 Posts
Awwww! Why not? If you did a good job I might commission you to make me one too lol
We would have the “Fashion Police” chasing us !.
It’s funny, sometimes you only miss something when it is taken away.
My previous Golf had a white head liner with the half electric sun roof.
My present Golf has a black head liner and NO sunroof.
It felt very “confining” and dark inside for the first few weeks.
It just gave the impression that the roof was SO much lower than the previous Golf.
When I saw the full pano roof in the MG EV Exclusive, it was a no brainier for me and the wife.
I will put up with the chill from the glass in the winter, to gain the extra light and feeling of space the pano roof brings.
I could always wear a furry hat in the winter months I guess !.
Prob look a right fool, no change there then !. LOL !.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
201 Posts
Ironically the glass roof would be greatly assisted in retaining heat if it was under 4 inches of snow. Snow is a great insulator.



No they don't function at all, unless assisted by a PTC heater first. If you then use AC (full climate) to keep the interior dry as well as warm your cooling it, so the PTC heater needs to come on and off (flip / flop like the AC) to generate the heat the heatpump then works with.

If you've got the heated seats on, and the heater down low and the fan low I'd expect the car to be ok. Personally I like it warm, so i'm interested to know what MG is like with heater turned up high on an exclusive model with glass roof (but no snow, as said earlier #illegal).
My RAV4 EV had just a heat pump providing heat or cooling and it was fine in the really cold parts of winter, no ptc heater there, it did have a 120v metal film front windscreen tho
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
76 Posts
i might have my sums wrong here, but i made a spreadsheet...assuming 1k miles per month, at 15p a kwh (say 44kwh battery), the monthly cost of electric at 140 mile range per charge is about £48. If i drop the range to 100 miles per charge the monthly cost is £66. I expect to improve on those ranges and kwh price, but the extra £18-£20 per month cost doesnt bother me too much, for the few months of extreme weather. At 5p per kwh the difference is nearer £7 per month. I only need about 80 miles of range per day.
From a purely economics point of view,ifa heat pump added £500 to the price, it would take me a long while to make that back.
As such....im not fussed about the heater. Thought that may be of interest to someone who doesnt need the full range.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
i might have my sums wrong here, but i made a spreadsheet...assuming 1k miles per month, at 15p a kwh (say 44kwh battery), the monthly cost of electric at 140 mile range per charge is about £48. If i drop the range to 100 miles per charge the monthly cost is £66. I expect to improve on those ranges and kwh price, but the extra £18-£20 per month cost doesnt bother me too much, for the few months of extreme weather. At 5p per kwh the difference is nearer £7 per month. I only need about 80 miles of range per day.
From a purely economics point of view,ifa heat pump added £500 to the price, it would take me a long while to make that back.
As such....im not fussed about the heater. Thought that may be of interest to someone who doesnt need the full range.
15p / KWH for electric. You need to get yourself on a better tariff. Try octopus agile or octopus go. I'm on agile and it ranges from 5p to 9p most of the time. Octopus go is 5p for about 4 hours during the night.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
76 Posts
15p / KWH for electric. You need to get yourself on a better tariff. Try octopus agile or octopus go. I'm on agile and it ranges from 5p to 9p most of the time. Octopus go is 5p for about 4 hours during the night.
oh yeah I know, I was being extreme to prove the point. as i say, at 5p a kwh the drop in range doesn't make a huge affect on the running cost. it's just if you need that range or now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
557 Posts
There are a number of factors that users of EVs need to be aware of when purchasing an EV. Experienced users will already be aware of these but in case there are any newbies....
  • Speed - range is greater at the sort of speeds we might drive around town at. Efficiency still pretty good up to about 65mph, but drive much over 70mph and range can fall alarmingly. At high speeds expect a range reduction of around 25%
  • Weather - range is greatest on a warm, dry, still day. Driving in the depths of winter on wet roads, at sub zero temperatures can easily reduce range by a further 25%
  • Efficiency of heating and ventilation system - the difference between most efficient HVAC systems and the worst resistive heating could be 20% or more
  • Pre-heating - makes negligible cost to total energy used but bringing a car up to comfortable temperature after unplugging costs around 2kWH that might otherwise have given you around 8 miles extra range. More important is the warm smug feeling (and safety benefits) of setting off in nice warm, thoroughly defrosted vehicle.
Some of these factors would affect every EV. The absence of a HVAC system and pre-heating might rob the MG of 20 odd miles range it might otherwise of had which is not a big deal in a 250+ mile range car but might be a factor for some when the car might only have around 120 mile range when driving at faster speeds in winter.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,765 Posts
There are a number of factors that users of EVs need to be aware of when purchasing an EV. Experienced users will already be aware of these but in case there are any newbies....
  • Speed - range is greater at the sort of speeds we might drive around town at. Efficiency still pretty good up to about 65mph, but drive much over 70mph and range can fall alarmingly. At high speeds expect a range reduction of around 25%
  • Weather - range is greatest on a warm, dry, still day. Driving in the depths of winter on wet roads, at sub zero temperatures can easily reduce range by a further 25%
  • Efficiency of heating and ventilation system - the difference between most efficient HVAC systems and the worst resistive heating could be 20% or more
  • Pre-heating - makes negligible cost to total energy used but bringing a car up to comfortable temperature after unplugging costs around 2kWH that might otherwise have given you around 8 miles extra range. More important is the warm smug feeling (and safety benefits) of setting off in nice warm, thoroughly defrosted vehicle.
Some of these factors would affect every EV. The absence of a HVAC system and pre-heating might rob the MG of 20 odd miles range it might otherwise of had which is not a big deal in a 250+ mile range car but might be a factor for some when the car might only have around 120 mile range when driving at faster speeds in winter.
Can’t argue with any of those conclusions !.
Spot on!.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,819 Posts
There are a number of factors that users of EVs need to be aware of when purchasing an EV. Experienced users will already be aware of these but in case there are any newbies....
  • Speed - range is greater at the sort of speeds we might drive around town at. Efficiency still pretty good up to about 65mph, but drive much over 70mph and range can fall alarmingly. At high speeds expect a range reduction of around 25%
  • Weather - range is greatest on a warm, dry, still day. Driving in the depths of winter on wet roads, at sub zero temperatures can easily reduce range by a further 25%
  • Efficiency of heating and ventilation system - the difference between most efficient HVAC systems and the worst resistive heating could be 20% or more
  • Pre-heating - makes negligible cost to total energy used but bringing a car up to comfortable temperature after unplugging costs around 2kWH that might otherwise have given you around 8 miles extra range. More important is the warm smug feeling (and safety benefits) of setting off in nice warm, thoroughly defrosted vehicle.
Some of these factors would affect every EV. The absence of a HVAC system and pre-heating might rob the MG of 20 odd miles range it might otherwise of had which is not a big deal in a 250+ mile range car but might be a factor for some when the car might only have around 120 mile range when driving at faster speeds in winter.
This is some research done into some different cars, I don't remember where it came from.


122253
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
147 Posts
This is some research done into some different cars, I don't remember where it came from.


View attachment 122253
So given the range drop off for those speeds above, does anything know how to convert a WLTP range figure into say constantly driving at 80mph? Based on the assumption that WLTP is a blended range of typical driving scenarios and that they don't publish any other stats around the main figure.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,819 Posts
So given the range drop off for those speeds above, does anything know how to convert a WLTP range figure into say constantly driving at 80mph? Based on the assumption that WLTP is a blended range of typical driving scenarios and that they don't publish any other stats around the main figure.
Not based on WLTP, but at a 48% reduction compared to 50mph, 80mph will deplete you battery very quickly.

Based on my experience of the Leaf 40 which has a similar range to the ZS, you are looking at a range of 120miles at 70mph, so based on the table above, another 12% on average will give a range of around 100 miles.

Personally I think it would be less based on my experience.

But it’s breaking the speed limit, and in my considered opinion pointless driving a car almost flat out, which is something I would never do.
 

·
Zoe Devotee
Joined
·
7,634 Posts
A little additional bit of info. On one of the sites found by avid MGZSEV FB group showed MG saying at @40mph the ZS will do 262 miles. Which for 44kwh works out at 5.95mpkwh.

Might be worth adding into your equations.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,486 Posts
A little additional bit of info. On one of the sites found by avid MGZSEV FB group showed MG saying at @40mph the ZS will do 262 miles. Which for 44kwh works out at 5.95mpkwh.

Might be worth adding into your equations.
I would guesstimate the ZS drag effect to be closer to i3 (50% drop from 40 to 70mph) than LEAF (42% drop) which would translate to ~130 miles at constant 70mph, which is what I would expect (~3m/kWh).

Still means ~160 miles at 60mph which is not terrible.

Can't find a CdA for the MG ZS 2017-on, but a 2018 BMW X1 (roughly size of ZS?) is 0.79 vs ~0.7 for the i3. CdA for original LEAF was 0.66 but we know the later versions are better.

(source: carfolio)
 

·
Zoe Devotee
Joined
·
7,634 Posts
I would guesstimate the ZS drag effect to be closer to i3 (50% drop from 40 to 70mph) than LEAF (42% drop) which would translate to ~130 miles at constant 70mph, which is what I would expect (~3m/kWh).

Still means ~160 miles at 60mph which is not terrible.

Can't find a CdA for the MG ZS 2017-on, but a 2018 BMW X1 (roughly size of ZS?) is 0.79 vs ~0.7 for the i3. CdA for original LEAF was 0.66 but we know the later versions are better.

(source: carfolio)
I'm not sure I trust the published mpkwh figures above. In my Zoe I've never seen less than 3.6mpkwh at 70mph sustained.

Many posts on the FB group about how the MG did 4.2mpkwh average no mater how much it was cained.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
557 Posts
As far as I can see, all testing of ZS EV in UK has been completed in warm conditions. It will be a different story in the depths of winter when battery is cold and heater is working hard.

I have made a Soul EV with a range varying between about 65 and 110 (depending upon conditions and how driven) work for me over the past few years. With a 60% larger battery I'm anticipating the range of the ZS to have a range of over 100 miles driver at motorway speeds in the cold and wet, up to something approaching 200 miles round town in summer months. Preconditioning and efficient HVAC could potentially have added another 20-30 miles in more extreme conditions and while it is disappointing these are missing I'd argue that the range is still adequate for many.

I don't have a problem in making a 30-40 minute charging stop every couple of hours on the relatively few times each year I'm making a long journey. My only concern would be that the current infrastructure can't cope with an increase in number of longer range cars each wanting to dwell longer to fill larger batteries. Adequate charging facilities, ideally working faster than 50kW in sites on main routes will alleviate concerns.
 
41 - 60 of 100 Posts
Top