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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Vague question I'm sorry but I have many questions.

I'm collecting my 2nd hand PHEV on Friday and I've watched YouTube videos etc but I'm struggling to understand how they work/drive. I'm part exchanging a Lexus CT200h which did all the decision making for me.

My round trip commute is 8 miles. In theory perfect to be driving fully on electric each day providing I charge it every other night (or however frequently required). However, what forces it to drive in pure electric mode? Is it built in? Will it always try to drive in electric mode unless you press charge or press? It's one of the top reasons I've bought it.

There is a dip in my route, though. Can somebody explain the B0-5 levels? I never had this in my Lexus. Does harsher regen produce more charge? Or is it vice-versa? So basically, going down the dip what is the best regen to use. At the bottom of the dip I'm very likely to stop as there is a roundabout. This means I will go from a standing start up the dip. Will it maintain EV mode? If not, will it automatically go back into EV mode when it flattens out? Each side of the dip is about 200ft.

I know B0 is no regen, so is this best suited for motorway miles with the theory that momentum is more fuel efficient than building charge? If not, why is B0 an option?

I've learned that it's best to save charge on the motorway. Videos I've seen say it'll trickle the charge to maintain the percentage from when you pressed save. Why will it keep topping it up though? Is this a natural battery drain or does the car use battery on the motorways?

I've learned that charge is mostly best avoided but why? Coming off the motorway with max miles is surely a benefit? If you drive a long journey on the motorway with zero urban roads what would the approach be and what would the car actually do in it's neutral mode?

Sorry for the essay but I am very confused by all this.

Thanks in advance!
 

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richi.uk
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There's a handy animation of how the GKN transaxle works in this FAQ (see section K).

Beware that the internet is full of the most incredible garbage and half-truths about B modes and the SAVE/CHRG buttons. My usual advice is to not worry about it until you've got used to the car.

I used to own an Auris HSD (identical running gear to the 200h). Suffice to say that if you were to hit SAVE with less than 80% battery, you'll get a very similar effect to how the 200h works.
 

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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Richi.

I've watched the video so would parallel mode ever be generated outside of pushing the car (hills, acceleration etc?)

So I imagine series mode would be engaged when doing motorway miles? I presume this is more efficient than parallel because the ICE driveshaft is moving just the generator driveshaft rather than the axle with giant wheels on either ends?

When i collect the car I'll immediately be on motorways pretty much. I'm going to ask the dealer to charge the car before I collect. Shall I drive on the motorway in save mode or charge? What difference does it make if driving in series mode?
 

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My experience with aus 2014 phev.

Its tricky to keep in pure ev, but eco mode helps. I live in a pretty hilly area, so the ice does kick in when demanded.

In a flatter area, it will stay ev so long as there is sufficient battery
When battery is low, serial mode applies until you reach about 80kmh (50mph?) then it switches to parallel (which is really direct ice to wheels). From then, pushing it will bring in ev, drawing on the battery reserve.

At any time, regen occurs whenever you are slowing. Higher B will regen 'harder', slowing the vehicle more. I try to match B to minimise brake use.
In normal ice use, as soon as the battery has gained a couple of ks range, it will switch to ev again. Charge mode prevents this, so any excess accumulates. Good for high load coming up, eg hills, or slow speed as ev is more efficient than serial mode.
Save mode just uses ice regardless of the battery state, although it will let the battery drop from full charge a bit as some 'empty' is better to allow regen braking.
Finally, cruise control, at least with acc, does not allow setting B mode - but it can control the vehicle speed down to just about stopped.

I'm sure you will pick it pretty quickly.

-Russ

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk
 

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Thanks Richi.

I've watched the video so would parallel mode ever be generated outside of pushing the car (hills, acceleration etc?)

So I imagine series mode would be engaged when doing motorway miles? I presume this is more efficient than parallel because the ICE driveshaft is moving just the generator driveshaft rather than the axle with giant wheels on either ends?

When i collect the car I'll immediately be on motorways pretty much. I'm going to ask the dealer to charge the car before I collect. Shall I drive on the motorway in save mode or charge? What difference does it make if driving in series mode?
The car will run in EV when it can. When the battery shows empty (actually around 30%) or when Charge or Save is pressed, it will start to run the ICE to power the car.

Series mode is used below 40mph (65kph). The ICE powers the generator, which then powers the electric motors on both axles. The PHEV runs the ICE in its most efficient rev range when it can, usually generating more power than is required to move the car, sending any excess to charge the battery. When more power is required, it will rev the ICE freely to power the generator and use the battery to provide power to the electric motors.

Parallel mode is engaged above 40mph (65kph). The ICE powers the front axle directly in what is effectively a 5th gear. So it gets rid of the losses inherent in converting rotary motion to electricity and then using electricity to power the wheels. The ICE's rpm is tied to wheel speed, but it will still try to generate more power than it needs (when it can) and use the excess to charge the battery. The car is effectively FWD, with little power going to the rear wheels. When it needs more power, it will use the battery in parallel with the direct drive to power the electric motors in both axles. If it needs more power than the rev-restrained ICE and battery can provide, it will change to Series mode and allow the ICE to rev independently of wheel speed.
 

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2021 Citroën ë-C4 Shine Plus
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For your 8-mile round trip commute, it will be very simple if the model you have purchased has EV mode (an EV button). Assuming it has;

Charge the vehicle overnight, and simply hit the start button in the morning followed immediately by the EV button. The car will then remain in EV mode regardless of any heating, uphill gradient or you punching the throttle, until the battery is nearly depleted which should not be the case after a mere 8 miles. You should get at least 15 miles even at this time of year.

For longer journeys, simply select normal mode and let the car do the rest. You’ll have to use the ICE at some point anyway because after three months if the ICE has not been used the car will force you to use it in order to allow you to add more fuel to prevent it going stale.
 

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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks all. That answers a lot of questions!

Off-Worlder, it does not have an EV button. It simply has seat heater settings, 4WD motor lock, and save/charge. Does this cause an issue?
 

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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Do you think it's possible to have full EV on my commute with what I've said? Again, no EV button to force the issue.
 

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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Also, complete side subject, I think the Outlander is screaming for a little spoiler/lip.

Does anybody know if anybody's added one? Nothing major, just to extend the top line of the car.
 

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Do you think it's possible to have full EV on my commute with what I've said? Again, no EV button to force the issue.
It depends if your car has an electric heater, which would allow you to preheat the car before use. The electric heater can be used while the car is plugged in, so it can charge while the heater is on. If not, all heat has to come from the ICE, which will start automatically when the weather is cold. You can get round it by turning off the heating and relying solely on the seat heaters (and steering wheel heater if it has it). But that's a bit hair shirt IMHO
 

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2021 Citroën ë-C4 Shine Plus
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Off-Worlder, it does not have an EV button. It simply has seat heater settings, 4WD motor lock, and save/charge. Does this cause an issue?
Without an EV button you have very little control over when the ICE cuts in.

My first Outlander was a 2015 model, and that one did not have an EV button. I used to hate it when the ice cut in, so much so it gave me the push to get a 100% Electric EV when it was time for its replacement.

I also used to hate the way the ICE screamed like a banshee on steep inclines because the engine would be running at what seemed to be full pelt and there was no way to stop it until able to back off the throttle.

I’m currently in a 2018 model which does have EV mode, and that eliminates my ICE anxiety. I no longer have to be so gentle on the throttle or keep the heat off, whereas with the MY2015 striving to prevent the ICE firing up had become a bit of an obsession.
 

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Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV (2015)
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
It depends if your car has an electric heater, which would allow you to preheat the car before use. The electric heater can be used while the car is plugged in, so it can charge while the heater is on. If not, all heat has to come from the ICE, which will start automatically when the weather is cold. You can get round it by turning off the heating and relying solely on the seat heaters (and steering wheel heater if it has it). But that's a bit hair shirt IMHO
It does have an electric heater I believe. It’s a G4XH


Without an EV button you have very little control over when the ICE cuts in.

My first Outlander was a 2015 model, and that one did not have an EV button. I used to hate it when the ice cut in, so much so it gave me the push to get a 100% Electric EV when it was time for its replacement.

I also used to hate the way the ICE screamed like a banshee on steep inclines because the engine would be running at what seemed to be full pelt and there was no way to stop it until able to back off the throttle.

I’m currently in a 2018 model which does have EV mode, and that eliminates my ICE anxiety. I no longer have to be so gentle on the throttle or keep the heat off, whereas with the MY2015 striving to prevent the ICE firing up had become a bit of an obsession.
I’m know mine is a G4XH I’m not clued up on the models enough to know MY2015 etc. It’s disappointed hearing you mention the ICE would just kick in. I was hoping mine wouldn’t on street roads going to my commute.

Here is the car Page 1 of 1 for Used Mitsubishi for sale in Sheffield, South Yorkshire |Independent Cars
 

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Nissan LEAF30
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I've learned that charge is mostly best avoided but why?
The cost of generating electricity from petrol is between 3 and 10 times the cost of buying it from the grid, even when in addition to providing traction.
Coming off the motorway with max miles is surely a benefit?
That depends on the exact details of the journey. If you are charging the battery up using petrol and only have a short drive until you can recharge from the mains, clearly not.
If you would have to pay an emissions charge after leaving the motorway if using the ICE then clearly so.
Otherwise it is marginal, but the chances are that the roundtrip losses of charging/discharging the battery probably outweigh the gains of running the ICE at a more optimum setting for the differential power on the motorway.
 

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If your journey exceeds your electric range, the car will HAVE to run in Charge mode for some of the journey. If you read the FAQ, it explains how on a longer journey the car constantly charges the battery till the range has gained a mile or so, then uses EV till it’s empty again. So saying that using Charge is not cost-efficient totally misses the point of how the car works. As long as you arrive at your next charge point with the battery empty, using Charge sensibly will have very little effect on overall consumption- the car needs to use the same amount of energy to get from A to B whatever you do.

Using Charge above 60% full is less effective as the charging rate the battery can take is reduced. So you can actually waste fuel trying to maintain the battery above that. But it is generally assumed that charging in Parallel mode is slightly more efficient than in Series mode. So charging on the motorway and using EV around town should be more efficient. But then again, simply leaving it in ‘D’ and letting the car work it out for itself also works pretty well...
 
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