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Discussion Starter #1
Both Source London and Chargemaster have upped their tariffs for Central London on-street charging locations.

Source London is now up to 12.9p/minute (if the charge point is capable of 22kW) in Camden,Westminster and Kensington & Chelsea.
Polar Network has added electricity charges (the usual 10.8p/kWh) to its locations (or an additional £1.50/hour for Polar Instant) in Westminster, they were previously inclusive.

So, plugging in a 3.3kW charging car to a 22kW capable charge point in one of Source London's Central London boroughs might cost £56.29 to fully charge a 24kW battery. *

* Source London currently aren't showing anything over 7kW on their network maps.
 

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42k miles on public charging. Am I an expert yet?
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For Chargemaster, it is up to the site host (who provide the electricity supply) as to whether the electricity charge applies, so it sounds like Westminster have decided they aren't paying for the electricity anymore.

Source London are just a bunch of rip off merchants whom I only use because once in a while I have no other choice....
 

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Be thankful you have the highest 'charger density' in the whole of the UK. I live in Shropshire and there are precious few, and even less in Mid-Wales.
 

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On the positive side, at least there is a per kWh/minute charge. That is where we have to be to make charging work for everyone.

One of our local charge points in now monopolised by an estate agent who's office overlooks it. That is where he now seems to park his Merc if he is at work. If it is in use, then he can see from the office when the user leaves and park up on the charge point again - plugged in, of course.

We have to get away from these various 'free at the point of use' models.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It looks like Source London are planning to install the same sort of 22kW DC chargers that they have in Paris; supposedly to support electric taxis, but they don't seem that interested in providing such charging bays, because their rental fleet can't do DC charging.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
On the positive side, at least there is a per kWh/minute charge. That is where we have to be to make charging work for everyone.
Maximum stay period works, and is something that local parking enforcement officers are already used to enforcing. (I've seen the BlueCity rental cars get tickets for blocking charge points, so that's a win, though I'd love some proof that Source London aren't giving preferential rates to BlueCity that they aren't giving to other customers).
 

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Source London is now up to 12.9p/minute (if the charge point is capable of 22kW)
Source London are planning to install the same sort of 22kW DC chargers that they have in Paris;
I take it the first quote refers to a 32A 3 phase post?

Thanks for pointing this stuff out. I find trying to understand EV charging in London difficult as it is, without extra pitfalls such as these to fall into.
 

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42k miles on public charging. Am I an expert yet?
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You can just as easily have 22kW CCS or CHAdeMo DC as you can 50kWh - just the electricity supply is cheaper, so it makes a lot of sense.
DC public chargers are a lot bigger and more expensive than AC. That is why 22kW are AC.

The supply is the same for AC and DC - 3 phase 32A per charger. There are few DC 22kW currently chargers available, but Nissan are bringing one out for fleets.
 

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DC public chargers are a lot bigger and more expensive than AC. That is why 22kW are AC.

The supply is the same for AC and DC - 3 phase 32A per charger. There are few DC 22kW currently chargers available, but Nissan are bringing one out for fleets.
Absolutely, and that's fine.

Just a shame that almost no models support 22kW AC; whereas literally any car that supports DC charging would also support it at 22kW.
 

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It makes sense, at least to me, to have more 22kW a.c. charge-points. The cost of the electronics behind the socket on the charge-point must be negligible and the chargers located in the cars will fall rapidly in price with increased volume and integration. At least we can have many more chargers at low cost, compared with the massive complexity of a DC charger - the DBT chargers appear to be a complete rats nest inside.

I say this as a Leaf owner with a 3.3kW charger and Chademo :-(
 

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Just a shame that almost no models support 22kW AC; whereas literally any car that supports DC charging would also support it at 22kW.
11kW 3-ϕ AC support is on many new models. Nissan are the notable holdout. LEAF 60 or whatever Nissan call it is rumoured to have 11kW standard and 22kW AC as an option.
 

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11kW 3-ϕ AC support is on many new models. Nissan are the notable holdout. LEAF 60 or whatever Nissan call it is rumoured to have 11kW standard and 22kW AC as an option.
Indeed, but 11kW AC is barely worth having compated to 7kW. If you're going to fit three phase, 22kW is an order of magnitude more beneficial than 11kW.

With 11kW 3-phase, that also means just 3kW single phase, which is really only useful in a few situations (pretty much just train stations and at home). 7kW is the minimum practical/reasonable charging speed.
 

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Indeed, but 11kW AC is barely worth having compated to 7kW. If you're going to fit three phase, 22kW is an order of magnitude more beneficial than 11kW.

With 11kW 3-phase, that also means just 3kW single phase, which is really only useful in a few situations (pretty much just train stations and at home). 7kW is the minimum practical/reasonable charging speed.
That's true for the UK, but these 11kW onboard chargers aren't aimed at the UK market - they're aimed at the continent. It's perfectly normal for homes on the continent to have three-phase supplies with a low amperage on each one - so much so that 7kW onboard chargers are a problem. My aunt's home in France has three phases of 30A each, so a 7kW car would have to charge at 3kW. With an 11kW onboard charger, the car would be able to pull the full 11kW from the same supply.
 

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With 11kW 3-phase, that also means just 3kW single phase,
If I have right end of the stick, both the Tesla and later BMW I3s can do 11KW 3 phase and use 2 of the 3 phase chargers to cover 7KW single phase.

Hope this is true as I like the sound of it, and charging at 35 MPH sounds useful at a lot of short destination stops.
 

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If I have right end of the stick, both the Tesla and later BMW I3s can do 11KW 3 phase and use 2 of the 3 phase chargers to cover 7KW single phase
Yes. 2019 LEAF should be the same.

Not sure about eGolf.
 

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Maximum stay period works, and is something that local parking enforcement officers are already used to enforcing. (I've seen the BlueCity rental cars get tickets for blocking charge points, so that's a win, though I'd love some proof that Source redacted aren't giving preferential rates to BlueCity that they aren't giving to other customers).
Both Hackney and Barnet have informally told me (by asking the wardens, not the council) that they don't care and have no enforcement powers anyway as the space is rented to a private company. Has this changed and/or which boroughs have bylaws allowing them to enforce limits?
 
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