[dk6780]

From the latest issue of Zap-News I heard about a company called Jedlix. They claim to be a charge aggregator who control the charging times of EVs to minimise the use of non-renewable energy on the grid. By varying this load they apparently get paid by the grid and they pass some of this back to you as a payment. From what I can see these timings should also approximate to the lowest cost times on Agile although there's no data to support this assertion.
Sadly it only works with certain cars, currently Tesla, BMW, Renault and Jaguar (not Nissan ).
So is it too good to be true? The reviews on Google Play are "mixed" but the developer appears active.

https://www.jedlix.com/en/

Edit to add - clearly this firm is Dutch and is just entering the UK market. Encouragingly apparently Renault are amongst the shareholders

 

[Bill N]

Was just about to start a thread on this. I’m giving it a whirl. First issue I’ve come across is that I can’t see a way of changing the units from km to miles.

 

[Bill N]

Was a bit disappointed that it doesn’t seem to have Octopus Agile support baked in, but then just noticed this comment from the developer in response to a review on the Google Play store (I’m on iPhone so hadn’t noticed it before)...

“Good news! By not selecting any tariff or the single tariff plan, your car will be charged according to the dynamic energy prices, like Octopus Agile. Connect your car, select your supplier and we do the rest! On top of this, you can start with generating earnings for each Smart Charged kWh!”

 

[Bill N]

More info here on Agile support:

https://jedlix.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360017776560-Can-I-use-Jedlix-in-combination-with-dynamic-energy-prices-

 

[Bill N]

Some screenshots:

 

[idiotzoo]

I’ve been asking Kia about their plans to open an UVO api so exactly this sort of thing can be done. They have no plans at the moment

 

[mad_rich]

I don't understand how this works? How they make money?

They aren't in control of your tariff, they aren't in control of your payments. All they can do is start and stop charging when the grid is cheap/ green. But what is the benefit to Jedlix of doing that, given that we're not paying them for energy?

 

[electric_dreams]

I don't understand how this works? How they make money?

They aren't in control of your tariff, they aren't in control of your payments. All they can do is start and stop charging when the grid is cheap/ green. But what is the benefit to Jedlix of doing that, given that we're not paying them for energy?

I think the answer is in the first post - "By varying this load they apparently get paid by the grid"

 

[electric_dreams]

Looks like there is a special app for the Zoe - however it says it isn't compatible with my device (which might be code for "isn't available in your country").


edit - the website is contradictory! It seems to suggest the ZE40 works in the UK but through the normal app?
(OK, so I downloaded the app and that appears to be true - weird that the ZE40 works but the ZE20 and 50 don't)

 

[dk6780]

I think the answer is in the first post - "By varying this load they apparently get paid by the grid"

It's a very moot point as to whether they are moving the load or whether (say) Octopus are by pricing Agile in the way that they do. I'm also interested that neither the UK Grid and none of the UK DNOs are currently listed as partners, so are they yet receiving anything for the UK? Note also that there isn't a direct correlation between the needs of balancing the grid, minimising CO2 and low Agile prices so this will be an approximation at best of the "ideal" timings for Agile.
My other concern is the way that they have applied the "safety net" for charging in the event of an issue. For example, the Ohme lead "fails safe" if it loses connection and becomes a dumb lead and charges your car based on any car timers or charge point timers set, but at least you potentially have the charge you need the next day. It appears that Jedlix will charge to a set % either when you first plug in or at a time that you set. But if like me you need say 80% charge (or more honestly 30% to get to the nearest Rapid) and add that first then there's not much charging to be done at the best rates. However, if you don't do that and the API doesn't connect (a regular issue with Nissan where I live) then you may not have enough charge. I appreciate that this is SaaS and hence there is no hardware, but the lottery element (probably not even due to an issue with Jedlix) of all of this is something that would concern me.

 

[mad_rich]

I think the answer is in the first post - "By varying this load they apparently get paid by the grid"

Yes, I sort of understand the principle, but still wondering how it works in reality.

They go to a supplier (or suppliers? Which ones? The ones I use?) and say "We've persuaded some people to move their charging around. We moved X kWh from 7pm to 4am. No, we don't have any metering, but we do have a pretty graph that the computer made. Please give us £1k because we saved you money even though you can't really be sure we did"

 

[Bill N]

“We are working on an additional tariff plan which is aligned with dynamic pricing contracts, this will give you the right insights into the Jedlix app on your charging costs. Until now you won’t see the correct charging cost in your overview. Luckily this won’t keep you from charging during the most beneficial hours and to earn cash rewards on top of this.”

Once (if) this is up and running with Agile it will hopefully be properly aligned with Agile pricing fluctuations.

A method of automatically charging based accurately on Agile pricing, and that doesn’t require any initial outlay in hardware, would be great.

 

[Schumpedro]

Works nicely with my EDF GoElectric rate. I've connected my Zoe (40) in the app. Seems that in the UK they run Renault in their own app while they have some kind of branded version as well for other markets.

 

[dk6780]

Once (if) this is up and running with Agile it will hopefully be properly aligned with Agile pricing fluctuations.

A method of automatically charging based accurately on Agile pricing, and that doesn’t require any initial outlay in hardware, would be great.

It would, but it may not meet their business objective of reducing the load on the grid and I wonder whether they will optomise the cost of Agile to the consumer or the benefit to their paymasters?

I have also asked them whether their model charges to the optimum contiguous period or potentially to a discontinuous set of 30 minute periods if that is what is implied by the CO2 emissions data on NordPool. The former is what is provided by Ohme, the latter may be very different but more reliable when communicating via an API with a significant degree of latency from Jedlix's server to your car. Again based on my experience of Nissan that can be 20 minutes plus.

 

[Schumpedro]

It would, but it may not meet their business objective of reducing the load on the grid and I wonder whether they will optomise the cost of Agile to the consumer or the benefit to their paymasters?

I have also asked them whether their model chargers to the optimum contiguous period or potentially to a discontinuous set of 30 minute periods if that is what is implied by the CO2 emissions data on NordPool?

Good question. Btw, what do you mean here with CO2 and Nordpool?

 

[Bill N]

I’ve set mine up with the single tariff setting for now, as suggested, and will see how it goes for a few weeks (not driving much right now..!) in terms of adjusting automatically and how well (or not) it aligns with cheaper periods and avoids the most expensive times.

It it doesn’t seem to be very effective, I may well go back to how I had initially set it up with a triple tariff and me just saying 4-7pm is peak and then estimating when to split the two cheaper periods.

Also, some semi-interesting info on how they control charging (on the i3 at least):

“The time periods you see in the myBMW app are continuously adjusted by the Jedlix platform, during a smart charging session. This also ensures that the car is kept stopped after the desired percentage has been reached.

In order to achieve this, the charging window is moved towards the future. As a result, it appears in the myBMW app that the car is going to charge in a peak moment, but charging is effectively postponed all the time. We advise keeping the Jedlix app as leading while you use smart charing.”

 

[Tandy0]

I bet it doesn't work for a Fluence.

 

[Bill N]

Well, it seems to be working pretty well so far. It, thankfully, stopped the charging automatically at about 3:30pm yesterday afternoon, and then fired it back up at 2am until my target SoC (100%) was reached at 4am. (I am using the granny).

I have departure with climatisation set for 7:30am so am interested to try and see how it works with that.

 

[dk6780]

Good question. Btw, what do you mean here with CO2 and Nordpool?

Nordpool is a published price of the result of the daily auction of electricity prices between generators and distributors, and is used as the basis of pricing for Agile by Octopus. As well as pricing there is also a carbon intensity figure which takes a similar profile to the cost but with different details as the generation mix changes. Jedlix use this and apparently the similar EPEX Spot market data when calculating the best time for charging to occur. So far, although they are very helpful, they haven't revealed the exact details of the calculation which I guess may be commercially sensitive. This makes it difficult to understand how closely it will match the optimum timing for Agile, although they have confirmed that it charges for a single contiguous period rather than the absolute optimum that may be a series of discontiguous 30 minute periods that Ohme will produce.
But this service is designed for a different objective than electricity price reduction and is not just free but potentially pays you. It'll be interesting to find out how much @Bill N "earnt" last night for his 2 hours on the "granny" charger.

 

[electric_dreams]

Works nicely with my EDF GoElectric rate. I've connected my Zoe (40) in the app. Seems that in the UK they run Renault in their own app while they have some kind of branded version as well for other markets.

Let us know how you get on. I'm keen to try this when they support the ZE50.