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Maybe I'm doing parenting wrong but no problems with 5 and 2 year old and the fabric seats in both our cars. Have seat protectors under the car seats, and on the front seatbacks (for muddy feet). Tend not to feed them anything that can't be hoovered and drinks are water only.
 

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Does the vegan thing also mean no wool content in the materials?
Uh-oh, now you've done it ;)
To some vegans yes, others no.
Me personally, I choose not to eat animal products for environmental reasons, nor do I believe that sitting on or wearing leather products is ethical.
However, sheeps wool is a product of keeping the animals in good health, so shearing their winter coats and making use of the product is perfectly acceptable, however others might see it differently.
It's far too easy to lump all vegans together, just as it is with those who choose to eat meat. My other half is a carnivore, so I do see things from both sides.
As long as you aren't ramming your beliefs down other peoples throats, the easiest thing to do is let people have their own lives and not worry too much.
 

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Clearly you've never owned leather ventilated seats? :)
I had red perforated leather Recaro seats in my ST220.

One of the boys was sick on the seat during a week-long holiday in Cornwall. I managed to wipe and cleanse it, but couple of weeks later, I sat in the car with a pin and spent an hour picking dried sick out of the perforations.
 

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MG EZS has completely faux leather (heated front) seats and electric adjustment in the Exclusive model. Very comfortable. Worth a try.
That's exactly why I went for the MG ZS EV. Yes there is probably something somewhere on the car that is not Vegan, but I think it's about making a statement. The vegan issue was even more important for me than range.
 

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Jap made leaf trim is cloth. But you then have lots of fun eeking out the miles from an aging 22kwh usuable pack which is probs now 18 or less thanks to both age and use related degradation.
You could alway convert an ice with non-leather trim if you want to rid yourself of more borderline excessive vegan guilt.
Fair play to you though. Im only a vegan most of the time. Failure rate often depends on whether food the kids are eating is going in the bin or not.
 

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picking dried sick out of the perforations.
Great post but I just cannot bring myself to tap the like button.

whether food the kids are eating is going in the bin or not.
I'm vegetarian rather than vegan and also have this problem. If it's going to be thrown away I think it's better not to waste it (but it does need to be appetising to me as well).
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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Uh-oh, now you've done it ;)
....sheeps wool is a product of keeping the animals in good health..
Like milk and dairy products, then?
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Does the vegan thing also mean no wool content in the materials?
Indeed it should. Most vegans are aware of leather as a concern. Wool is a futher concern. For example the abuse of sheep due to time pressures to deliver a lot of wool incredibly quickly can mean physical harm to the animals.

Veganism has many many dimensions that are a knock-on from human supremacy claims, ie "I am king of the jungle". My primary focus is againstg the incessant slaughter of farm animals. Solve that through a change of culture and many secondary issues evaporate.
 

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Indeed it should. Most vegans are aware of leather as a concern. Wool is a futher concern. For example the abuse of sheep due to time pressures to deliver a lot of wool incredibly quickly can mean physical harm to the animals.

Veganism has many many dimensions that are a knock-on from human supremacy claims, ie "I am king of the jungle". My primary focus is againstg the incessant slaughter of farm animals. Solve that through a change of culture and many secondary issues evaporate.
Have you seen how animals are treated in the wild by Mother Nature?
 

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Indeed it should. Most vegans are aware of leather as a concern. Wool is a futher concern. For example the abuse of sheep due to time pressures to deliver a lot of wool incredibly quickly can mean physical harm to the animals.

Veganism has many many dimensions that are a knock-on from human supremacy claims, ie "I am king of the jungle". My primary focus is againstg the incessant slaughter of farm animals. Solve that through a change of culture and many secondary issues evaporate.
How do you feel about plastics?

I struggle greatly with understanding why it's fine to replace a natural product with a man made one that will never be gone from the environment. I dislike leather seats, I dislike faux leather even more, and I fully support the use of recycled natural cloths (cotton and natural wool) as the true options in protecting the planet.

How have you reduced plastics in your life, given the impact this has on the wildlife in the oceans and sky and beyond with out any slaughter needed?
 

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How do you feel about plastics?

I struggle greatly with understanding why it's fine to replace a natural product with a man made one that will never be gone from the environment. I dislike leather seats, I dislike faux leather even more, and I fully support the use of recycled natural cloths (cotton and natural wool) as the true options in protecting the planet.

How have you reduced plastics in your life, given the impact this has on the wildlife in the oceans and sky and beyond with out any slaughter needed?
Such a good post! You ask a great question. Should we make best use of products that will naturally decay or use man made products that permanently pollute?

We could of course develop man made products that naturally decay.

I need to lie down. 🥴
 

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Discussion Starter #37
How do you feel about plastics?

I struggle greatly with understanding why it's fine to replace a natural product with a man made one that will never be gone from the environment. I dislike leather seats, I dislike faux leather even more, and I fully support the use of recycled natural cloths (cotton and natural wool) as the true options in protecting the planet.

How have you reduced plastics in your life, given the impact this has on the wildlife in the oceans and sky and beyond with out any slaughter needed?
I buy from stores that support zero-plastic schemes as much as possible by taking my own bags, pots and filling them. This includes cleaning liquids, washing liquids etc etc. So anything that can be done to reduce plastic, esp single-use must be a good thing.

However research consistently shows over half of the plastic in the oceans is from fishing trawlers who discard unwanted trawler nets etc that have developed holes. These nets float around in the ocean trapping fish forever - strangling fish as they float. So if we are talking about plastic we must also talk about not eating fish.

Did you know that hemp is infinitely better for the planet than cotton, which is incredibly demanding on water. Looking back in time legislation stopped hemp being used to protect cotton growers. Only now is hemp coming back in, but it does not yet have the economies of scale to bring its price down.

Whatever the issues with plastic it does not harm animals directly. Also as a normal person there are very few other measures we can take to reduce plastic use, apart from lobbying. As an ethical vegan direct harm of animals for no human benefit is my primary concern. It is something everyone can do for example you don't need to lobby companies, government to choose different foods at the supermarket. Also most vegetables I buy are not covered in plastic, whereas meat is to protect it from cross-contamination.
 

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However research consistently shows over half of the plastic in the oceans is from fishing trawlers who discard unwanted trawler nets etc that have developed holes. These nets float around in the ocean trapping fish forever - strangling fish as they float. So if we are talking about plastic we must also talk about not eating fish.
That leaves over half of it from other places, billions of tons every year. Not to mention the plethora of mirco-plastics due than are in the digestive systems of fish/whales/other sea and land creatures. Lets not try to downplay it.

Did you know that hemp is infinitely better for the planet than cotton, which is incredibly demanding on water. Looking back in time legislation stopped hemp being used to protect cotton growers. Only now is hemp coming back in, but it does not yet have the economies of scale to bring its price down.
Yes I know all about hemp and cotton growing, hence why I said recycled materials!

Whatever the issues with plastic it does not harm animals directly.
Tell that to the oil industry who destroy habitats in the sea and on land and displace animals, or kill them due to the activities in order to make some of these plastics.

Studying the footprint of a product is also very important, from start to finish if you can as I have found over many years that there is a great deal of folk who are happy to practice certain things, but ignore others. No one can be perfect, and I think that everyone just needs to do a little bit to try and help, but as you rightly said lobbying the big suppliers/manufacturers who cater to the masses is how you bring about big change.

Sadly harmonious living will never occur, we'll always be killing something, or culling something, or expanding somewhere to fit more people in. If we can ever get nuclear fusion right, and provide almost unlimited clean energy that will help solve a huge number of issues across the globe, and should have a big knock on effect to everything living on this planet, humans being the most important of course!
 

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Discussion Starter #39
Tell that to the oil industry who destroy habitats in the sea and on land and displace animals, or kill them due to the activities in order to make some of these plastics.
The oil industry are bad, very bad. We simply have to stop using fossil fuels.

There are other aspects of life that have displaced or killed animals in their wake. Forests are cleared for animals to grow on grassland, most recently this has been highligted in the amazon rainforest - which come into the UK as cheap beefburgers or soya for animal feed.
 

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Discussion Starter #40 (Edited)
Lets not try to downplay it.
I don't want to downplay plastic use/misuse. There is much education needed to help reduce plastic use. Companies need to do so much more Personally I have to work a lot harder. I consider myself better than most - but does everyone consider themselves better than average?

What I want to focus on are the easy things we can all do if they make a significant difference. Mind you having said that many people find reducing meat intake a fearful task!

"Where will that protein come from?" is one of the first questions, matched with "drink that milk for protein." An interesting fact is that mother's breast milk has a low protein level
 
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