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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, just had a look at the site.

So, it's not as simple as "If it's under £35,000 it gets a grant".

Only the cars on this list qualify - as can been seen, masses of EV's have come off.

I would suggest anyone contemplating a purchase look at this list - but also speak to the dealer in case one you are looking at is about to be added.

So it's not enough to simply fall below the price threshold, it has to be "approved" - ie on this list.


Theoretically a PHEV could still qualify if it was under £35,000 and did over 70m range on battery alone - but I can't see that happening. Also pure ev's that can't do 70m range wouldn't qualify either.


As of 12:22 on 24/3/21 this is the list of approved cars - however obviously this may change soon as manufactures adjust pricing and specs.


Low-emission vehicles eligible for a plug-in grant
You can get a discount on the price of brand new low-emission vehicles through a grant the government gives to vehicle dealerships and manufacturers.
You do not need to do anything if you want to buy one of these vehicles - the dealer will include the value of the grant in the vehicle’s price.
The maximum grant available for cars is £2,500.
Vehicles eligible for a grant
The amount of the grant depends on which category the vehicle is in. The 7 categories are:
  • cars
  • motorcycles
  • mopeds
  • small vans
  • large vans
  • taxis
  • trucks
Not all low-emission vehicles will get a grant. Only vehicles that have been approved by the government are eligible for a grant.
Cars (previously ‘category 1’)
These vehicles have CO2 emissions of less than 50g/km and can travel at least 112km (70 miles) without any emissions at all:
  • Citroen ë-C4 – Sense Plus
  • Citroen ë-C4 – Shine
  • DS 3 Crossback E-Tense – Prestige
  • DS 3 Crossback E-Tense – Performance Line
  • Honda e
  • Hyundai IONIQ Electric – Premium
  • Hyundai KONA Electric (39kWh) – SE Connect
  • Hyundai KONA Electric (39kWh) – Premium
  • Kia e-Niro (39kWh) - 2
  • Mazda MX-30
  • MG MG5 EV
  • MG ZS EV
  • MINI Electric – Level 1
  • MINI Electric – Level 2
  • MINI Electric – Level 3
  • Nissan e-NV200 (5 Seater) – Visia
  • Nissan e-NV200 (7 Seater) – Visia
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – Acenta
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – N-Connecta
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – Tekna
  • Peugeot e-208
  • Peugeot e-2008 – Active Premium
  • Peugeot e-2008 – Allure
  • Renault ZOE
  • SEAT Mii electric
  • Skoda Citigo-e iV
  • Skoda ENYAQ iV 60 Nav – Loft
  • Skoda ENYAQ iV 60 Nav – Lodge
  • Smart EQ fortwo
  • Smart EQ forfour
  • Vauxhall Corsa-e
  • Vauxhall Mokka-e – SE Nav Premium
  • Volkswagen e-Golf
  • Volkswagen e-up!
  • Volkswagen ID.3 Pro (58kWh 145PS) – Life
  • Volkswagen ID.3 Pro Performance (58kWh 204PS) – Life
To be eligible for the grant, cars must cost less than £35,000. This is the recommended retail price (RRP), and includes VAT and delivery fees.
The grant will pay for 35% of the purchase price for these vehicles, up to a maximum of £2,500.
 

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thats it? when you quoted the entire list I was like ‘hmm I’ll have a scan through see if there are any obvious ones missing’ - and then I scrolled down a bit and the list just ended. thats pretty short!
 

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Kia e-Niro "long range" just added today. It is a 2 spec with the 64 kWH battery. Like I said if the grants are removed the prices have to drop, as the manufacturers HAVE to produce lots of EVs or get massive EU fines year after year for their ICE polluters CO2 emissions. And the more EVs there are , the more competition there is and the prices come down either officially or with discounts or dealer contributions. Simple market forces at work. These market forces apply to anything that is sold, not just cars. Competition and choice lowers prices.
And this is in the first few days after the government announced the £35k grant loss for EVs. Just see what will happen over the next few months.
Going to be interesting to watch!
 

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Just to add there will of course be a knock on in price reduction for the Kia e-Niro 39kWh model. And on and on it will go. Slowly but surely. EV sales will take off properly. Then the grant proper will end sooner rather than later, and then the market will find it's own level. Which will be significantly lower than it is today.
 

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Hi, just had a look at the site.

So, it's not as simple as "If it's under £35,000 it gets a grant".

Only the cars on this list qualify - as can been seen, masses of EV's have come off.

I would suggest anyone contemplating a purchase look at this list - but also speak to the dealer in case one you are looking at is about to be added.

So it's not enough to simply fall below the price threshold, it has to be "approved" - ie on this list.


Theoretically a PHEV could still qualify if it was under £35,000 and did over 70m range on battery alone - but I can't see that happening. Also pure ev's that can't do 70m range wouldn't qualify either.


As of 12:22 on 24/3/21 this is the list of approved cars - however obviously this may change soon as manufactures adjust pricing and specs.


Low-emission vehicles eligible for a plug-in grant
You can get a discount on the price of brand new low-emission vehicles through a grant the government gives to vehicle dealerships and manufacturers.
You do not need to do anything if you want to buy one of these vehicles - the dealer will include the value of the grant in the vehicle’s price.
The maximum grant available for cars is £2,500.
Vehicles eligible for a grant
The amount of the grant depends on which category the vehicle is in. The 7 categories are:
  • cars
  • motorcycles
  • mopeds
  • small vans
  • large vans
  • taxis
  • trucks
Not all low-emission vehicles will get a grant. Only vehicles that have been approved by the government are eligible for a grant.
Cars (previously ‘category 1’)
These vehicles have CO2 emissions of less than 50g/km and can travel at least 112km (70 miles) without any emissions at all:
  • Citroen ë-C4 – Sense Plus
  • Citroen ë-C4 – Shine
  • DS 3 Crossback E-Tense – Prestige
  • DS 3 Crossback E-Tense – Performance Line
  • Honda e
  • Hyundai IONIQ Electric – Premium
  • Hyundai KONA Electric (39kWh) – SE Connect
  • Hyundai KONA Electric (39kWh) – Premium
  • Kia e-Niro (39kWh) - 2
  • Mazda MX-30
  • MG MG5 EV
  • MG ZS EV
  • MINI Electric – Level 1
  • MINI Electric – Level 2
  • MINI Electric – Level 3
  • Nissan e-NV200 (5 Seater) – Visia
  • Nissan e-NV200 (7 Seater) – Visia
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – Acenta
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – N-Connecta
  • Nissan Leaf (40kWh) – Tekna
  • Peugeot e-208
  • Peugeot e-2008 – Active Premium
  • Peugeot e-2008 – Allure
  • Renault ZOE
  • SEAT Mii electric
  • Skoda Citigo-e iV
  • Skoda ENYAQ iV 60 Nav – Loft
  • Skoda ENYAQ iV 60 Nav – Lodge
  • Smart EQ fortwo
  • Smart EQ forfour
  • Vauxhall Corsa-e
  • Vauxhall Mokka-e – SE Nav Premium
  • Volkswagen e-Golf
  • Volkswagen e-up!
  • Volkswagen ID.3 Pro (58kWh 145PS) – Life
  • Volkswagen ID.3 Pro Performance (58kWh 204PS) – Life
To be eligible for the grant, cars must cost less than £35,000. This is the recommended retail price (RRP), and includes VAT and delivery fees.
The grant will pay for 35% of the purchase price for these vehicles, up to a maximum of £2,500.
It's a bit of a laugh that the government grant will pay 35% of the cost....
🤗🤗🤗
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Kia e-Niro "long range" just added today. It is a 2 spec with the 64 kWH battery. Like I said if the grants are removed the prices have to drop,


And this is in the first few days after the government announced the £35k grant loss for EVs. Just see what will happen over the next few months.
Going to be interesting to watch!
The price HASN'T dropped. The Niro 2 "Long Range" is a new model.

There will also be either a 3 "Standard Range" which can have a "Battery Enhancement option" added as well as a 2 with a "Luxury Options pack" you watch - this car will cost more or less the same as a 3 64KWh does now once optioned, but will meet the law to get the grant. Manufacturers will just try and circumvent it.
 

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Irrelevant if a new model or not. The market demands (for the vast majority of the UK public) "longer range EVs", before they will consider changing from ICE vehicles. The loss of the grant virtually killed or at least will seriously dent any sales of EVs above £35k-those that have the promise of real world longer range, as quite simply hardly any are worth the asking price.
I only predicted that now that the upper price mark grant has gone, manufacturers will slowly but surely hit the "just below" £35k mark to try to maintain sales. They have to or multimillion £/€ fines are coming. This lowering of prices will continue.
And these longer range EVs are still only medium range when compared to ICE cars at any price. I still own a 8 year old ICE VW Up. It does 450 miles in all weathers and costs £30 to do so. It cost £10k and is very comfortable and well equipped. If I want to drive to Frankfurt, for example, tomorrow I can just go. (When Lockdown ends) No planning or RFID cars or apps required. A long way to go until EVs are as attractive to the main car buying public. But the main stalling point is buying price. And we are a 2 EV family who took advantage of the grants but did not need one. The whole grant thing needs to go. EV prices will drop.
 

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The price HASN'T dropped. The Niro 2 "Long Range" is a new model.

There will also be either a 3 "Standard Range" which can have a "Battery Enhancement option" added as well as a 2 with a "Luxury Options pack" you watch - this car will cost more or less the same as a 3 64KWh does now once optioned, but will meet the law to get the grant. Manufacturers will just try and circumvent it.
Nope, grant cut-off is list price including any options. This new "long range" 2 spec is £34945 (so £32445 OTR after the grant), about £2.5k over the 39kWh one.

Hell of an uplift now (just under £5k) from there to a 64kWh 3 spec, just for heated leather, telematics and a bigger touchscreen.

edit: I was wrong, optional equipment doesn't, however "any non-standard option fitted by the manufacturer or dealer affecting the capacity of the battery, drive train configuration or maximum net power" does count towards the cut-off.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I can see them.dropping the 3 spec for a while, then re-launching it with a different spec and 50kwh or something - we will certainly see some new models from all the borderline manufacturers
 

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And I am sure Hyundai will announce something similar as Kia, as their LR Kona is now so marginally above the grant cut off or well above with their Ultimate version. These are not £40k+ cars. And that is in comparison with their ICE equivalents.
Kona ICE Ultimate edition equivalent is £26k. The Kona EV is not worth £14-£15k more!! Just no way. Even when the grant was there the EV top model was around £37k. Nearer £10k more but with cheaper running costs overall and probably better residuals than the ICE equivalent- especially in a UK market heading for EV only sales, then helped to make it a ballpark alternative. Now no way.
 

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Is the grant
Nope, grant cut-off is list price including any options. This new "long range" 2 spec is £34945 (so £32445 OTR after the grant), about £2.5k over the 39kWh one.

Hell of an uplift now (just under £5k) from there to a 64kWh 3 spec, just for heated leather, telematics and a bigger touchscreen.

edit: I was wrong, optional equipment doesn't, however "any non-standard option fitted by the manufacturer or dealer affecting the capacity of the battery, drive train configuration or maximum net power" does count towards the cut-off.
Surprised options don't count - they do for the ICE luxury tax. End of the day its what you're paying. Otherwise you can bascially spec £3k of options for free.

Wonder how something like the DLC 'acceleration boost' on Tesla works. If its after you drive away but unlock with a payment I guess it escapes being counted? with OTA updates that could start to be a slippery slope - you can already unlock rear heated seats, faster acceleration on Tesla (did they allow you to pay to unlock more range on that SR in the US?)
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Irrelevant if a new model or not. The market demands (for the vast majority of the UK public) "longer range EVs", before they will consider changing from ICE vehicles. The loss of the grant virtually killed or at least will seriously dent any sales of EVs above £35k-those that have the promise of real world longer range, as quite simply hardly any are worth the asking price.
I only predicted that now that the upper price mark grant has gone, manufacturers will slowly but surely hit the "just below" £35k mark to try to maintain sales. They have to or multimillion £/€ fines are coming. This lowering of prices will continue.
And these longer range EVs are still only medium range when compared to ICE cars at any price. I still own a 8 year old ICE VW Up. It does 450 miles in all weathers and costs £30 to do so. It cost £10k and is very comfortable and well equipped. If I want to drive to Frankfurt, for example, tomorrow I can just go. (When Lockdown ends) No planning or RFID cars or apps required. A long way to go until EVs are as attractive to the main car buying public. But the main stalling point is buying price. And we are a 2 EV family who took advantage of the grants but did not need one. The whole grant thing needs to go. EV prices will drop.
Ok, so I sort of agree with you.

The manufacturers won't "drop prices" - as in get the same car for less money.

The manufacturers WILL bring in cars that meet peoples wants and needs at a price they will buy it at. Logic dictates that the grant means that MOST customers (not all) will look at the£30-35k mark and see what is the best car for that price to take advantage of the grant - simply because not to is foolish.

So I can see us ending up with more "low spec, long range" ev's rather than high spec, high price, long range....

And who in their right mind would drive to Frankfurt in a VW Up......? My other half has a Citygo (same car) it's ok for popping to the shops, but 100m in it? No ta.....1000? OMG no ta!!!! My BEV is smoother, quieter and has adaptive cruise - I'd happily take the 3 charges to get me there thank you very much!

For very long distances ICE does make sense I agree, but for the comparison you used you would need to compare a BEV with a similarly comfy ICE. So take something like a Ford Focus Titanium at about 28k or so. Doing 12k miles a year that car is gonna cost me £1500 - £2000 more a year in fuel.... it will also depreciate at least 3 times faster in the first 3 years than the BEV. You cannot compare a decent BEV with a VW Up - and certainly not in comfort terms!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Not just Tesla, it was rumoured that Audi had worked out it was cheaper to fit EVERY option to their cars, then allow the dealers to "unlock" them later for customers - this would work both for the original buyer and the dealer trying to sell a 2nd hand one.

I don't know if they ever actually did it - but it's an interesting concept.

I think it would annoy the hell out of me to know my car had heated seats but they just wouldn't work unless I paid to "upgrade" - I get an additional cost to fit when the cars built - but to put them there and then not let you use them - that just stinks of profiteering....
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Is the grant


Surprised options don't count - they do for the ICE luxury tax. End of the day its what you're paying. Otherwise you can bascially spec £3k of options for free.

Wonder how something like the DLC 'acceleration boost' on Tesla works. If its after you drive away but unlock with a payment I guess it escapes being counted? with OTA updates that could start to be a slippery slope - you can already unlock rear heated seats, faster acceleration on Tesla (did they allow you to pay to unlock more range on that SR in the US?)

Also of course these touch-screens will help with this. Not good to fit a heated seat button that didn't work unless you upgraded, but if you just did a software upgrade and the button appears on the touchscreen - seems better.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
who knows lol... I would imagine if you sold privately they couldn't turn them off. However if you p/x to a Tesla dealer for example they COULD turn them off - however in US certainly (and a bit over here) it looks like used cars have everything turned ON to maximise their profits... So used Model 3's for example all seem to have full self driving ready, I am sure they weren't all ordered like that from new - but the price is almost new price....
 
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