Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner

1 - 20 of 60 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I don't yet own an EV but my next car will be one.
Having some time to waste I sat & calculated a route from Lands End to John O' Groats for a variety of cars using A Better Route Planner.
I then entered them into a spreadsheet & sorted them by total journey times.
I've no idea how good A Better Route Planner is.
What do you guys think, are the results realistic?
The Hyundai Ioniq 28kWh appears to do amazingly well.
 

·
Registered
Kia Soul EV 2020
Joined
·
1,653 Posts
I haven't gone through your calculations. Just here to mention:
  • There is a guy who did Lands end to John O'groats yesterday in Eniro, check out @tillathenun on Twitter;
  • Check out Bjorn Nyland, aka TeslaBjorn on YouTube. Especially his 1000km challenge results available on Google drive.
Good luck with your search!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
143 Posts
I find it questionable that the Leaf 40 would take longer than the 30. I guess a lot depends on how low (%) you're prepared to go, I think ABRP can be quite conservative.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
I haven't gone through your calculations. Just here to mention:
  • There is a guy who did Lands end to John O'groats yesterday in Eniro;
  • Check out Bjorn Nyland, aka TeslaBjorn on YouTube. Especially his 1000 miles challenge results available on Google drive.
Good luck with your search!
I am following Andrew Till in his e-Niro which was what prompted this experiment. I have also seen Bjorn's YouTube.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I find it questionable that the Leaf 40 would take longer than the 30. I guess a lot depends on how low (%) you're prepared to go, I think ABRP can be quite conservative.
I was surprised but perhaps ABRP takes "RapidGate" into consideration?
 

·
Registered
Kia Soul EV 2020
Joined
·
1,653 Posts
Just did my own ABRP with my own settings for Soul EV 64kWh and got:
135824


The main change is 3.5m/kWh @70mph instead of the default efficiency. You can see the main difference is charging time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Just did my own ABRP with my own settings for Soul EV 64kWh and got:
View attachment 135824

The main change is 3.5m/kWh @70mph instead of the default efficiency. You can see the main difference is charging time.
Interesting. Thank you. I did find it strange that the vehicles with bigger batteries didn't do better. Petriix says ABRP is conservative in it's estimates.
 

·
RupesDotNet
Joined
·
8 Posts
I've not used ABRP in anger before and it would be interesting to try LEJOG sometime in the 28kWh Ioniq. I guess it scores well because the battery isn't huge compared to more recent EVs and the fact it can guzzle up to 69kW with the battery warm and around 20% SOC upon arrival. Out of interest did ABPR favour higher speed (> 50kW) rapids over the Polar ones? If you wanted to save time I guess you would need to end the charge around 80% as it does tail off rather than waiting to 94% when it ends automatically.
 

·
Registered
Kia Soul EV 2020
Joined
·
1,653 Posts
Interesting. Thank you. I did find it strange that the vehicles with bigger batteries didn't do better. Petriix says ABRP is conservative in it's estimates.
It is conservative, I think the default value for my Kia was about 3m/kWh. I have done only just over 1000 miles now, but my results for trips above 150 miles: 4.4, 3.8, 3.6 (torrential rain). And I still set up 3.5m/kWh.

Also, going through the charging stops suggested by ABPR, I think these can be optimised further.
 
  • Like
Reactions: finchlean

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,991 Posts
ABRP has always been pretty good, it is even better when you input the additional variable in the settings including ambient temp, and weather, for me I would add actual W/m for my car along with loading i.e. the wife, kids and luggage, for Tesla's it will even allow you to mark whether you supercharging rates have been nerfed.

I always knew I could do a little better than the plan it had, so it always was on the right side of error if you know what i mean, as would much prefer that to the alternative of it being overly optimistic and being stuck on a 7kw post somewhere as it has gone completely wrong.
 

·
Life's too short to wait for a Kona .....
Joined
·
100 Posts
I have the Ioniq 28, and I find ABRP very conservative and also misses out much more obvious chargers. It may give you an idea, but when you become comfortable with your choice of EV you will be less cautious, stretch the distances and find more appropriate chargers. Incidentally we were planning to go to Skye from Cheltenham, Gloucestershire with 6 charges and whilst I don't think you would necessarily do much better from JOG to LE, maybe 1 better, but you will have loads of choice of charger I am sure. By the by, Ioniq 28 is one of the most under-rated cars out there...who needs big batteries!!
 

·
EVEZY code d55d6 *** Try my car cost calculator
Joined
·
1,575 Posts
ABRP documentation has stated they intentionally add a ~10% buffer to the default efficiency model for all cars to allow for variations.

I am definitely biased - but the car that stands out for me in the table (other than the classic Ioniq) is the i3 - it really is surprisingly capable for long journeys. This summer I've done single day journeys from London to Scotland and London to the Rhine Valley in mine - no bother at all.
 

·
EVEZY code d55d6 *** Try my car cost calculator
Joined
·
1,575 Posts
it is even better when you input the additional variable in the settings including ambient temp, and weather,
I find the premium membership worthwhile - it does this automatically, as well as giving some other features.

If can be switched on and off from month to month if you only need to use ABRP for occasional long trips.

Tesla Bjorn and NowYouKnow have referral codes I believe for longer free trials / annual discounts.

 

·
Registered
Kia Soul EV 2020
Joined
·
1,653 Posts
@Dune Plodder what is your objective with this table? I like the exercise (I personally have a huge excel file with a lot of information from the last month driving the Kia.

So, digging deeper in your table I have a few observations:
  • You have a problem with either distance or average speed, as you have a driving time variation that seems extreme, presuming all cars can handle 70mph. Is the distance the same?
  • my calculation came up with 858 miles, while yours and others seem to vary greatly.
  • so if you are comparing the car capabilities, you need to eliminate the distance and manually choose the route and only allow the use of the same charging stops along the route for all (not charger/charging speed).
  • The car with the shortest driving time is Mini cooper SE?! And then ID.3 77kWh?
  • the Audi should be the fastest charger of them all, but is 3h40min? And it takes almost 50min longer driving...the same problem;
 

·
EVEZY code d55d6 *** Try my car cost calculator
Joined
·
1,575 Posts
The distance varies because different cars are routed via different chargers.
 

·
EVEZY code d55d6 *** Try my car cost calculator
Joined
·
1,575 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
@Dune Plodder what is your objective with this table? I like the exercise (I personally have a huge excel file with a lot of information from the last month driving the Kia.

So, digging deeper in your table I have a few observations:
  • You have a problem with either distance or average speed, as you have a driving time variation that seems extreme, presuming all cars can handle 70mph. Is the distance the same?
  • my calculation came up with 858 miles, while yours and others seem to vary greatly.
  • so if you are comparing the car capabilities, you need to eliminate the distance and manually choose the route and only allow the use of the same charging stops along the route for all (not charger/charging speed).
  • The car with the shortest driving time is Mini cooper SE?! And then ID.3 77kWh?
  • the Audi should be the fastest charger of them all, but is 3h40min? And it takes almost 50min longer driving...the same problem;
It was just an exercise, a bit of fun. I simply used the defaults. I was asking myself similar questions. The Mini looks very odd. I'll rerun it in case I made a mistake copying the value.
 

·
EVEZY code d55d6 *** Try my car cost calculator
Joined
·
1,575 Posts
The car with the shortest driving time is Mini cooper SE?!
This does make sense to me. A car with a shorter range is forced to stop more often. Depending on the route, there will be a sweet spot where a certain car (in this case the Mini) has a range that is long enough to reach chargers that require a shorter total detour off the specific route in question, vs cars that either need fewer stops or that need even more stops.

Cars that need fewer stops are likely to have faster charging speeds, and may be routed by ABRP via 100kW+ chargers. The driving time may be longer, but this is made up by charging faster.

Cars that need even more stops (eg the eUp) are more likely to be forced to detour further off route to find chargers.

Or....

It may well just be a case of ABRP not using the same parameters for each car. It can sometimes be a bit funny when changing cars - messing up parameters etc or not changing the reference consumption properly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,208 Posts
28kW Ioniq has low drag coefficient, can do 4.5m/kWh (60mph) or better, will charge as many times as required, can get up to 66kWh. Even at 50kWh, at 4.5m/kWh, you get far more miles than an E-tron at 2.5m/kWh, takes nearly twice as long for each mile. I happily do 350 mile birmingham- scotland with 3 charges.
 
1 - 20 of 60 Posts
Top