Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner

Long distance EV comparison

9K views 59 replies 15 participants last post by  i-s 
#1 ·
I don't yet own an EV but my next car will be one.
Having some time to waste I sat & calculated a route from Lands End to John O' Groats for a variety of cars using A Better Route Planner.
I then entered them into a spreadsheet & sorted them by total journey times.
I've no idea how good A Better Route Planner is.
What do you guys think, are the results realistic?
The Hyundai Ioniq 28kWh appears to do amazingly well.
 
See less See more
1
#2 ·
I haven't gone through your calculations. Just here to mention:
  • There is a guy who did Lands end to John O'groats yesterday in Eniro, check out @tillathenun on Twitter;
  • Check out Bjorn Nyland, aka TeslaBjorn on YouTube. Especially his 1000km challenge results available on Google drive.
Good luck with your search!
 
#4 ·
I haven't gone through your calculations. Just here to mention:
  • There is a guy who did Lands end to John O'groats yesterday in Eniro;
  • Check out Bjorn Nyland, aka TeslaBjorn on YouTube. Especially his 1000 miles challenge results available on Google drive.
Good luck with your search!
I am following Andrew Till in his e-Niro which was what prompted this experiment. I have also seen Bjorn's YouTube.
 
#8 ·
I've not used ABRP in anger before and it would be interesting to try LEJOG sometime in the 28kWh Ioniq. I guess it scores well because the battery isn't huge compared to more recent EVs and the fact it can guzzle up to 69kW with the battery warm and around 20% SOC upon arrival. Out of interest did ABPR favour higher speed (> 50kW) rapids over the Polar ones? If you wanted to save time I guess you would need to end the charge around 80% as it does tail off rather than waiting to 94% when it ends automatically.
 
#10 ·
ABRP has always been pretty good, it is even better when you input the additional variable in the settings including ambient temp, and weather, for me I would add actual W/m for my car along with loading i.e. the wife, kids and luggage, for Tesla's it will even allow you to mark whether you supercharging rates have been nerfed.

I always knew I could do a little better than the plan it had, so it always was on the right side of error if you know what i mean, as would much prefer that to the alternative of it being overly optimistic and being stuck on a 7kw post somewhere as it has gone completely wrong.
 
#14 ·
it is even better when you input the additional variable in the settings including ambient temp, and weather,
I find the premium membership worthwhile - it does this automatically, as well as giving some other features.

If can be switched on and off from month to month if you only need to use ABRP for occasional long trips.

Tesla Bjorn and NowYouKnow have referral codes I believe for longer free trials / annual discounts.

 
#11 ·
I have the Ioniq 28, and I find ABRP very conservative and also misses out much more obvious chargers. It may give you an idea, but when you become comfortable with your choice of EV you will be less cautious, stretch the distances and find more appropriate chargers. Incidentally we were planning to go to Skye from Cheltenham, Gloucestershire with 6 charges and whilst I don't think you would necessarily do much better from JOG to LE, maybe 1 better, but you will have loads of choice of charger I am sure. By the by, Ioniq 28 is one of the most under-rated cars out there...who needs big batteries!!
 
#12 ·
ABRP documentation has stated they intentionally add a ~10% buffer to the default efficiency model for all cars to allow for variations.

I am definitely biased - but the car that stands out for me in the table (other than the classic Ioniq) is the i3 - it really is surprisingly capable for long journeys. This summer I've done single day journeys from London to Scotland and London to the Rhine Valley in mine - no bother at all.
 
#15 ·
@Dune Plodder what is your objective with this table? I like the exercise (I personally have a huge excel file with a lot of information from the last month driving the Kia.

So, digging deeper in your table I have a few observations:
  • You have a problem with either distance or average speed, as you have a driving time variation that seems extreme, presuming all cars can handle 70mph. Is the distance the same?
  • my calculation came up with 858 miles, while yours and others seem to vary greatly.
  • so if you are comparing the car capabilities, you need to eliminate the distance and manually choose the route and only allow the use of the same charging stops along the route for all (not charger/charging speed).
  • The car with the shortest driving time is Mini cooper SE?! And then ID.3 77kWh?
  • the Audi should be the fastest charger of them all, but is 3h40min? And it takes almost 50min longer driving...the same problem;
 
#19 ·
The car with the shortest driving time is Mini cooper SE?!
This does make sense to me. A car with a shorter range is forced to stop more often. Depending on the route, there will be a sweet spot where a certain car (in this case the Mini) has a range that is long enough to reach chargers that require a shorter total detour off the specific route in question, vs cars that either need fewer stops or that need even more stops.

Cars that need fewer stops are likely to have faster charging speeds, and may be routed by ABRP via 100kW+ chargers. The driving time may be longer, but this is made up by charging faster.

Cars that need even more stops (eg the eUp) are more likely to be forced to detour further off route to find chargers.

Or....

It may well just be a case of ABRP not using the same parameters for each car. It can sometimes be a bit funny when changing cars - messing up parameters etc or not changing the reference consumption properly.
 
#17 ·
#30 ·
 
#46 ·
Tesla Model 3 SR+ ( mainly on the Supercharger Network )
Great to review the data. A few observations on your two different cars.. 1. Tesla is charging time is 50% less than the Zoe - perhaps no surprise? 2. The charging strategy for Zoe relies on Ecotricity.. 3. The calculated average speed in the Zoe is 53mph vs 58mph in the Tesla - says a lot about the average mph on the roads. 4 Yes, the Tesla charging stops are short, but is that good/safe for driving that distance? 5. How would the M3LR compare?

Also, would anyone ever drive the equivalent distance from Land's End to John o'Groats in one stint? I once did Aberdeen to the Midlands and I'd not do that again out of choice.
 
#45 ·
I nearly bought a 94ah one when I ended up in the Tesla, I really liked it BMW Maidenhead were nice enough to give me one from the Friday to the Monday to test drive it and managed to cover about 300 miles in it.

Tesla however gave me a Model S P90DL for a similar 4 days and after that decision made...

My wife doesn’t do a big mileage annually 3-4,000 miles in a year so range isn’t really a problem but the occasional longer jaunt means 120ah will always be more than enough. So probably swap into one in the new year, replacing a 62 plate 528i. Which means we will be all electric, which is quite different from where I thought we would be not too long ago.

Lots of new EVs but the i3 is still what she wants, so certainly made an impression nearly 4 years ago!
 
#47 ·
Lots of new EVs but the i3 is still what she wants, so certainly made an impression nearly 4 years ago!
Aside from a Tesla, it's only really this year that a few other EVs are coming along that I would maybe choose over an i3. And also as more 100kW chargers are being installed.

But i3 still a great choice I think - especially as a second car.
 
#51 ·
i3S is the solution to stability problems, I think. Never had any wind/speed roadholding issues in mine, although it does let in an unusual amount of noise in those conditions.

But yeah, charging speed seems like the obvious thing to improve. We need >50kW charging capability to become the norm in cars, so it becomes the norm for rapid stations too. I don't think we'll see it in the i3 before the next battery update though (assuming it gets one).
 
#52 ·
I spent some time last evening playing around with ABRP and then combined it with Zap-Map. And then it hit me, there are no chargers capable of over 100kW from the first Ionity@Cullomton all the way to Birmingham! And the Birmingham one is something like 8-10 miles off course!
 
#56 ·
20H 20M in a i3 94Ah without using the Range Extender.

That is at 20C with no wind. Assuming 5% battery degredation. My i3 has no noticible degrediation. BMW use the margin to hide degredation. i3 has a large top margin that gradualy decreases as the pack ages. I left it at 5% to make up for the unlikely weather.


Not a journey I'd want to do in one go. 5H 21M charge duration.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Todor
#58 ·
20H 20M in a i3 94Ah without using the Range Extender.

That is at 20C with no wind. Assuming 5% battery degredation. My i3 has no noticible degrediation. BMW use the margin to hide degredation. i3 has a large top margin that gradualy decreases as the pack ages. I left it at 5% to make up for the unlikely weather.


Not a journey I'd want to do in one go. 5H 21M charge duration.
I think I would do it over 2 days, then a very leisurely drive back over a week or so, enjoying the Scottish scenery.
 
#60 · (Edited)
The i3 seems to me to echo the Audi A2 - a car that was so ahead of its time that it wasn't appreciated until it was (almost) too late. In fact, the two cars have a lot in common. It certainly seems to me that the world is growing into the i3. Much of what was done for the A2 (aluminium construction from a combination of casts and extrusions) would make a good EV (and indeed seems to have been much of what Tesla are running with for the model Y) and it was a very lightweight vehicle, as is the i3. Both the A2 and i3 were lightweight, innovative and ahead of their time.

An A2 EV conversion would be fascinating...
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top