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It seems that Hackney council have noticed that there's going to be demand for public EV charging, and they've deemed that no house in the borough should be more than 500 metres walk from a public charging point.

That means there will almost be as many charging bays as bus stops.
They'll probably all be Source London (though the rapid chargers in the borough are on Chargepoint Genie). There's already many showing as planned on the Source London map. Knowing how fast Source London are at actually installing and activating chargers, expect them to be working by June or July.

Aside from Milton Keynes, can anyone else think of a UK council that is quite that committed?
 

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Wonder when Somerset are going to wake up, and Devon and Cornwall......... never, just like the pathetic lack of decent roads.
 

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I've contacted 3 local councils about charging points. Not a single one has even replied at all! That's how disinterested they are.
 

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The best there is at what I do
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I've contacted 3 local councils about charging points. Not a single one has even replied at all! That's how disinterested they are.
Of course councils are interested, Aylesbury Vale Council have three Rapids right outside their offices, they are in the best possible location to charge the council vehicles, there are also some Fast Charging posts in the car park.

Not sure if you can charge out of office hours now but the security didn't used to let you.

The siting of these chargers was really well thought out, nice to see Aylesbury Council using the OLEV funding so wisely:confused:
 

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Wonder when Somerset are going to wake up, and Devon and Cornwall......... never, just like the pathetic lack of decent roads.
In Cornwall we have 27 charging locations backed by the Council and SSE for the population and area I think that's pretty good. Devon's North West coast is the charging black spot down here.
 

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In Cornwall we have 27 charging locations backed by the Council and SSE for the population and area I think that's pretty good. Devon's North West coast is the charging black spot down here.
Wow, 27 in a county the size of Cornwall...... I rest my case. North Devon and South Devon are both really poor and frankly, having barely any options going from Exeter to Cornwall is the one reason I just haven't bothered to try it. I can get to Exeter ok, but there is no way I would risk the rapid being out that is stationed in between because where else do you go other than on a flatbed? Oh of course, we don't get motorways in the South West and the A303/A30 seemingly don't count. Who thought it a good idea to put 7 kwh chargers at the Little Chef near Honiton? Should be 2 rapids instead. Always got 4 X 4s icing them anyway.
 

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Wow, 27 in a county the size of Cornwall...... I rest my case. North Devon and South Devon are both really poor and frankly, having barely any options going from Exeter to Cornwall is the one reason I just haven't bothered to try it. I can get to Exeter ok, but there is no way I would risk the rapid being out that is stationed in between because where else do you go other than on a flatbed? Oh of course, we don't get motorways in the South West and the A303/A30 seemingly don't count. Who thought it a good idea to put 7 kwh chargers at the Little Chef near Honiton? Should be 2 rapids instead. Always got 4 X 4s icing them anyway.
So those 27 locations allow upto 76 simultaneous charges, I just counted and 1 from 72 was in use and all are live and working. So I'm not sure how anybody would build an economic case to install more. Add in podpoint, hotels, zero carbon, EH, etc and I really don't think we are that bad, would be nice to see a breakdown of charges / person or sq mile for each county I wounder if that data exists?
 

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How many are rapids? It still doesn't solve the issue of getting to Cornwall though as per my comment about the A30 and A303.
 

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"So those 27 locations allow upto 76 simultaneous charges, I just counted and 1 from 72 was in use and all are live and working. So I'm not sure how anybody would build an economic case to install more. "


I think that pretty much defines the problem with destination charging (OK so some are rapids? I do not live in Cornwall)

If the average ICE broke down on 1 trip in every 1000 on average (ie 99.9% chance of a successful journey for each trip), and that ICE did 2 trips a day, then it would break down on average every 500 days or about 16 months. Me, I would think about getting a new ICE. What would you do?

In my experience, my chance of getting a successful charge from an unknown destination charger selected at random from Zap Map etc are less than 50%. Mostly ICEing but lots of other ridiculous problems. Which is why I do not rely on them to get me home again if I drive beyond the range of my home charging point.

If there are 27 locations, and IF the 1 car mentioned above is being charged is at a single post, or if the other posts are ICEd, then my chances of getting a destination charge in Cornwall at any selected point at the moment is already down to 95% or less. Well below the unacceptably unreliable ICE at 99.9%.

This seems to me a very likely reason why destination chargers in particular see very little use? Until the chances of getting a charge at any particular destination get to be better than 99% (or improves very significantly from the current norm) then people will not bother with them. Unless they drive a PHEV, or do not really need to charge.

I think we need a lot more charging points at each particular destination to improve the chances of a successful charge. I have no idea how you build an economic argument for that though.
 

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"
If there are 27 locations, and IF the 1 car mentioned above is being charged is at a single post, or if the other posts are ICEd, then my chances of getting a destination charge in Cornwall at any selected point at the moment is already down to 95% or less. Well below the unacceptably unreliable ICE at 99.9%.

This seems to me a very likely reason why destination chargers in particular see very little use? Until the chances of getting a charge at any particular destination get to be better than 99% (or improves very significantly from the current norm) then people will not bother with them. Unless they drive a PHEV, or do not really need to charge.

I think we need a lot more charging points at each particular destination to improve the chances of a successful charge. I have no idea how you build an economic argument for that though.
Not sure of your point there? Are you saying it's not worth installing chargers unless there are more then 100 of them for every car that needs a charge? That can't be right.
 

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Not sure of your point there? Are you saying it's not worth installing chargers unless there are more then 100 of them for every car that needs a charge? That can't be right.
I think destinations which only have 1 or 2 charge points are too likely to get ICEd, or EVd to often to get the likelihood of a successful charge up to levels that make EV drivers feel more enthusiastic about them.

Asda in Hayes has about 38 type 2 points. Greenwhich shopping park seems to have over 80 type 2s. I have not charged at either place, but if I were going there and needed a charge to get back home then in my naivety I would have much more confidence of it happening at these 2 locations as to a destination that only has 2 outlets.

If you drive a PHEV then maybe a set of points spread out thinly is your best option? For me concentrating a number of points together at 1 location so that the chances of getting a successful charge allowing me to get back home again afterwards seems a better use of these resources then spreading them out thinly. Even though this means fewer locations with charging points.

Looking at what I have just typed, does this mean there are more charging points in one London shopping park then in the whole of Cornwall?
 

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On my last trip to Westfield Stratford car park A has 14 charging spaces. I had arrived early and the points are well away from the store entrance so I had plenty of choice. One was marked as broken and the first one I tried didn't expect my Source East card whilst the second did. So off I went with the car happily charging on its own.
However on our return all the other spaces were ICE'd and yes I did get in contact with the centre and voice my concerns. Anyway as things stand it won't be a concern of mine as Source London will effectively ban me and other visitors from London. :mad:
 

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I think destinations which only have 1 or 2 charge points are too likely to get ICEd, or EVd to often to get the likelihood of a successful charge up to levels that make EV drivers feel more enthusiastic about them.

Asda in Hayes has about 38 type 2 points. Greenwhich shopping park seems to have over 80 type 2s. I have not charged at either place, but if I were going there and needed a charge to get back home then in my naivety I would have much more confidence of it happening at these 2 locations as to a destination that only has 2 outlets.

If you drive a PHEV then maybe a set of points spread out thinly is your best option? For me concentrating a number of points together at 1 location so that the chances of getting a successful charge allowing me to get back home again afterwards seems a better use of these resources then spreading them out thinly. Even though this means fewer locations with charging points.

Looking at what I have just typed, does this mean there are more charging points in one London shopping park then in the whole of Cornwall?
I think we will agree to disagree on this one, I would much rather have one or two chargers at every services (EH) then 200 of them at just one and them 600 miles of nothing. Sites just need to enforce their parking rules to allow an economic number of chargers to be useful for the actual amount of users for them. And back on track with Hackney then make them affordable to use.
 

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Affordability is a thorny issue as these spaces are linked to parking charges which in London are steep anyway and one price isn't going to fit all. The case in point is prime City location and the outer suburbs. Then there are the car parks at shopping centres that pay for entry / exit. Pay and display might be easier as charging will be deemed as covering the cost so no ticket required. But what about visitors, if you turn up and park on the street in London with your ICE there is a way to pay but not if you require a charge during your stay.
Remember this is a city that has been breaking pollution laws for a long time and should be doing everything it can to reduce this pollution. :coffee:
 

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My local boroughs (Wandsworth, Hammersmith and Richmond) are either in the process of adding a load of charge points or have just finished consulting on it. Sadly, they are all going to be installed by Source London as the most important thing seems to be "at zero cost to the taxpayer" and they are not tendering because it's "already been done" by the OLEV/TfL. Sadly, I think this will mean lots of charge points and little usage. I've pointed out to Richmond and Wandsworth that people will just use the free points at Sainsbury's instead. Richmond is talking about installing 3 rapids, which will be interesting if it happens....
 

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A couple of these new Hackney charge points have now been installed near me. At first I was chuffed, but the pricing makes them too expensive to replace home charging as it ends up costing more than petrol, so it all feels kind of pointless.
 

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Was up in Stamford Hill last night. Resigned to not being able to charge car due to STILL waiting for a Source RFID (it's now nearly 2 weeks - do they get then delivered by freighter from China?) as all local chargers were Source.

Then opposite the bar we were in we noticed the Nissan dealership, which doesn't show up on Zap or Plug. Of course it was all closed up, but on closer examination, the chargers (a fast and a rapid) were accessible from Morrison's car park which apparently stays open at night. You have to park in the disabled bays, but given the rest of the car park was empty this was hardly going to be challenged. I know Hackney has more rapid chargers than the rest of London put together (almost) but still, it's a good tip if you're in the north of the borough at night and need a rapid charge (non-Nissan drivers apart of course !!).
 

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Discussion Starter #20
My local boroughs (Wandsworth, Hammersmith and Richmond) are either in the process of adding a load of charge points or have just finished consulting on it. Sadly, they are all going to be installed by Source London as the most important thing seems to be "at zero cost to the taxpayer" and they are not tendering because it's "already been done" by the OLEV/TfL. Sadly, I think this will mean lots of charge points and little usage. I've pointed out to Richmond and Wandsworth that people will just use the free points at Sainsbury's instead. Richmond is talking about installing 3 rapids, which will be interesting if it happens....
If it's 'zero cost to the taxpayer', then Wandsworth etc have got better terms than Source London agreed with Barnet, because they got Barnet to buy the overpriced charge points (only IER were available), they got Barnet to foot the electricity bill, and Source London pay Barnet rent for the parking bays that would otherwise be revenue-earning to the council.
 
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