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Renault ZOE R135 ZE50 GTLine July 2020 (Sold: R90 ZE40 i Dynamic Nav June 2017)
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Discussion Starter #1
On ZOE ZE40 models (and presumably the 22kWh models), if you locked the car by pressing the button on the key fob it would only unlock using the key fob. Hand-free locking was disabled. This meant that thieves could not use a simple amplifier (man-in-the-middle) approach to make the car think the key fob was close to it, and just open a door.

We've just collected our ZE50 and the behaviour has changed, in my opinion for the worse. If hands-free unlocking is switched on then you can always just open the car if you have the key on you, even if you locked it with the key fob. So the man-in-the-middle attack is once again available to thieves and you do need to keep your key fob in a metal enclosure in the house. What a drag - I was quite happy just to lock the car with the key fob to get the same security.

There is one simple solution, which is to totally disable hands-free locking/unlocking in the settings. You are then forced to use the key fob, but the advantage is that the simple man-in-the-middle attack can't work.

This is just like cars used to be and I find it perfectly usable. I suppose it would be annoying if you have got used to leaving your key fob in your bag/case.
 

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On ZOE ZE40 models (and presumably the 22kWh models), if you locked the car by pressing the button on the key fob it would only unlock using the key fob. Hand-free locking was disabled. This meant that thieves could not use a simple amplifier (man-in-the-middle) approach to make the car think the key fob was close to it, and just open a door.

We've just collected our ZE50 and the behaviour has changed, in my opinion for the worse. If hands-free unlocking is switched on then you can always just open the car if you have the key on you, even if you locked it with the key fob. So the man-in-the-middle attack is once again available to thieves and you do need to keep your key fob in a metal enclosure in the house. What a drag - I was quite happy just to lock the car with the key fob to get the same security.

There is one simple solution, which is to totally disable hands-free locking/unlocking in the settings. You are then forced to use the key fob, but the advantage is that the simple man-in-the-middle attack can't work.

This is just like cars used to be and I find it perfectly usable. I suppose it would be annoying if you have got used to leaving your key fob in your bag/case.
My wife leaves her keys in her bag, if I see it in the hall - I move it to the kitchen.

I tend to lock the door so I put my keys in the pouch on the shoe rack rather than leaving the keys inside the door. After almost 2 years of Leaf30, I’m used to it




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No organised car thieves with the tech for this are targeting Zoe’s

I always leave the key to the zoe and Tesla somewhere obvious downstairs, as even if they can’t man in middle it, if they want the car that badly they are coming in your house for the key. It’s best they find it than wake you up at knife point to tell them where it is

This is what insurance is for people, I wouldn’t be disabling the feature and convenience on the small percentage chance it gets stolen....
 

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I take the opposite view - security is the insurance premium you pay for once. Good house locks, windows locked, keys kept out of the way. Alarm set at night when in bed and CCTV covering front & back. Thieves like easy targets. If yours looks too much like hard work, compared to your neighbour - they'll go next door!

My home is my castle, and heaven help any little scroat who thinks they can break in and get away with it. If more people had this mindset, thieves might think twice.
 
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