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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey 馃憢

Just got our first EV and after 1500 miles using the public charging network we're going to get a charger installed at home, we've picked out the EO Mini Pro 2 to get installed in our carport. Only issue is the layout of our house and the location of the consumer unit to the carport. Everything is okay regarding the install except the route of the cable. The installer obviously wants to run it the easiest option, out the side of the house and strapped to the front of the house but I'm not keen on this. Would rather try and run it discretely. I have a couple of questions before going back to the installer.

1. Can I run the cable and leave ends for him to complete the connection? Assuming I get the correct cable and permission from them?
2. Can the cable be run through the ceiling (ie. fished between the down lighters). Is this a safe space? and any other considerations?
3. Also just wanted to double check the quoted price. 拢1023 (less 拢350 OLEV less 拢300 EST), this is for the charger, 20m cable and run out the house and along the front.

I've attached the floor plan and a front photo of the house for anyone who has any ideas. The consumer unit is in the cupboard under the stairs in the WC and the install location is ideally on the wall opposite the house in the carport.

Any ideas would be great.

Thanks!

144901
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144903
 

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It's a bit difficult to tell from your post but have a look at the regulations for the UK. Basically you can run cables vertically or sometimes horizontally in walls, and in ceiling voids if they are through the joists and not against the ceiling or floor. The electrician will probably want to see that because they have to sign off that the cable has been installed safely. For that reason a lot of the time they just want to go out and along an outside wall, which is allowed if the cable is armoured and clearly visible.

Is that an electrical box by the drainpipe? If so then I expect they would want to come out from there and along the outside wall, getting past the gate somehow.
 

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Hey 馃憢

Just got our first EV and after 1500 miles using the public charging network we're going to get a charger installed at home, we've picked out the EO Mini Pro 2 to get installed in our carport. Only issue is the layout of our house and the location of the consumer unit to the carport. Everything is okay regarding the install except the route of the cable. The installer obviously wants to run it the easiest option, out the side of the house and strapped to the front of the house but I'm not keen on this. Would rather try and run it discretely. I have a couple of questions before going back to the installer.

1. Can I run the cable and leave ends for him to complete the connection? Assuming I get the correct cable and permission from them?
2. Can the cable be run through the ceiling (ie. fished between the down lighters). Is this a safe space? and any other considerations?
3. Also just wanted to double check the quoted price. 拢1023 (less 拢350 OLEV less 拢300 EST), this is for the charger, 20m cable and run out the house and along the front.

I've attached the floor plan and a front photo of the house for anyone who has any ideas. The consumer unit is in the cupboard under the stairs in the WC and the install location is ideally on the wall opposite the house in the carport.

Any ideas would be great.

Thanks!

View attachment 144901 View attachment 144900

View attachment 144903
Hi Stu, running cables through ceiling voids will most probably require RCD protection of the cable from the supply because you probably won't be able to guarantee sufficient depth from either ceiling or floor. You will then want to ensure discrimination between RCDs in series, ideally not have this issue. The cable type requires some detailed consideration, especially how tight any bends will be and how it's going to be pulled through end to end.
In your situation, I would put a spec together and get 3 written quotes from local electricians against your spec. Don't be tempted to do any of the physical work yourself, that will just be an excuse for the Sparks to increase the cost against rework.
Probably resign yourself to no grant for this job, but console yourself if you get the charger installed with no major redecorating costs.
Give a shout out if you need help putting a spec together. Mostly it will consist of marked up plans, the model number of the charger you have selected, reference to key British Standards, a list of the documents you want handed over such as a copy of the DNO notification etc.
 

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Hyundai Ioniq 28
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As mentioned, those two boxes at the front near the drainpipe look suspiciously like electric and gas meter boxes. If they are then the solution would be simple. The new car point feed can be split off after the meter into its own mini CU and it would be a simple round the corner run from there.

And up to the ceiling and across in conduit to the other side if that's what you want.
 

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1. Can I run the cable and leave ends for him to complete the connection? Assuming I get the correct cable and permission from them?
Yes, but you have to ensure that all cable runs can be inspected, as the electrician has to sign the EIC to say that he/she has phsyically checked and that all the cables are adequately sized, derated/protected as required if run in insulation, they all run within the safe zones proscribed in BS7671:2018 and that the cables have adequate provision for prevention of premature collapse in the event of fire. This means leaving all the runs exposed for inspection in practice, and also means understanding the relevant parts of the regs that apply.

2. Can the cable be run through the ceiling (ie. fished between the down lighters). Is this a safe space? and any other considerations?
Yes, but as above, in this instance the prevention of premature collapse needs to be carefully considered, as the cables may need securing with fire resistant clips at regular intervals along such a run, and also as above, all DIY cables have to be able to be physically inspected


3. Also just wanted to double check the quoted price. 拢1023 (less 拢350 OLEV less 拢300 EST), this is for the charger, 20m cable and run out the house and along the front.
That price doesn't seem to far adrift from the prices being normally charged. especially as it's before the grants.
 

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Nice looking house, pity the developer didn't consider installing a suitable cable.

As you'll see from @freddym and @Jeremy Harris above, in theory you can do the work yourself but in practice you'll struggle to get the work signed-off as by the time you have convinced the Sparky that it all meets regulations then they may as well have done it themselves. A direct connection from the tails after the meter will reduce the cable run but add the issue of protection.

Out of interest, what is the construction of the roof terrace? Is there even an accessible void between the ceiling finish of the carport and the floor of the roof terrace?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for everyones replies so far. I've emailed the installer and he is happy for me to run the cable but is going to speak to me ahead of this.

It's a bit difficult to tell from your post but have a look at the regulations for the UK. Basically you can run cables vertically or sometimes horizontally in walls, and in ceiling voids if they are through the joists and not against the ceiling or floor. The electrician will probably want to see that because they have to sign off that the cable has been installed safely. For that reason a lot of the time they just want to go out and along an outside wall, which is allowed if the cable is armoured and clearly visible.

Is that an electrical box by the drainpipe? If so then I expect they would want to come out from there and along the outside wall, getting past the gate somehow.
The box by the down pipe is actually power for the street light. Would of been ideal if it was our supply.

Hi Stu, running cables through ceiling voids will most probably require RCD protection of the cable from the supply because you probably won't be able to guarantee sufficient depth from either ceiling or floor. You will then want to ensure discrimination between RCDs in series, ideally not have this issue. The cable type requires some detailed consideration, especially how tight any bends will be and how it's going to be pulled through end to end.
In your situation, I would put a spec together and get 3 written quotes from local electricians against your spec. Don't be tempted to do any of the physical work yourself, that will just be an excuse for the Sparks to increase the cost against rework.
Probably resign yourself to no grant for this job, but console yourself if you get the charger installed with no major redecorating costs.
Give a shout out if you need help putting a spec together. Mostly it will consist of marked up plans, the model number of the charger you have selected, reference to key British Standards, a list of the documents you want handed over such as a copy of the DNO notification etc.
Great, thanks for the advise. The installer is going to give me a ring to discuss.

As mentioned, those two boxes at the front near the drainpipe look suspiciously like electric and gas meter boxes. If they are then the solution would be simple. The new car point feed can be split off after the meter into its own mini CU and it would be a simple round the corner run from there.

And up to the ceiling and across in conduit to the other side if that's what you want.
Unfortunately, it's the supply for the street light and the gas supply is just next to this.

Yes, but you have to ensure that all cable runs can be inspected, as the electrician has to sign the EIC to say that he/she has phsyically checked and that all the cables are adequately sized, derated/protected as required if run in insulation, they all run within the safe zones proscribed in BS7671:2018 and that the cables have adequate provision for prevention of premature collapse in the event of fire. This means leaving all the runs exposed for inspection in practice, and also means understanding the relevant parts of the regs that apply.



Yes, but as above, in this instance the prevention of premature collapse needs to be carefully considered, as the cables may need securing with fire resistant clips at regular intervals along such a run, and also as above, all DIY cables have to be able to be physically inspected




That price doesn't seem to far adrift from the prices being normally charged. especially as it's before the grants.
Thanks for the advice. It's actually a pretty straightforward run if it goes through the living room ceiling, the route out of the cupboard is easily accessed by 5 down lighters in a row with no joists in the way. It appears we have steel joists in the void. After reading into some of the regulations (in no way am I qualified to or will take this advice to do this) but I read that the ceiling void the cables don't need to be secured as there is no possibility of premature collapse of the cables as the ceiling would need to have already collapsed before this is an issue.

Nice looking house, pity the developer didn't consider installing a suitable cable.

As you'll see from @freddym and @Jeremy Harris above, in theory you can do the work yourself but in practice you'll struggle to get the work signed-off as by the time you have convinced the Sparky that it all meets regulations then they may as well have done it themselves. A direct connection from the tails after the meter will reduce the cable run but add the issue of protection.

Out of interest, what is the construction of the roof terrace? Is there even an accessible void between the ceiling finish of the carport and the floor of the roof terrace?
Thanks! It's a shame there is no provision for chargers in new developments (the house is only 5 years old) but I think for even brand new builds there is still no provision for this...

The carport has a steel frame with a tongue and groove wooden roof with a void above.
 

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Thanks for the advice. It's actually a pretty straightforward run if it goes through the living room ceiling, the route out of the cupboard is easily accessed by 5 down lighters in a row with no joists in the way. It appears we have steel joists in the void. After reading into some of the regulations (in no way am I qualified to or will take this advice to do this) but I read that the ceiling void the cables don't need to be secured as there is no possibility of premature collapse of the cables as the ceiling would need to have already collapsed before this is an issue.
All that matters is that there is a fire resistant means to prevent premature collapse that is compliant with Section 521.10.202 of BS7671:2018, and that can be met by a variety of methods. It depends largely on the judgement of the electrician signing off the work as to whether they believe any particular method meets the requirement. It also depends on the location of the run, as the intent behind this regulation is to reduce the risk of firefighters getting tangled up and killed in collapsed wiring, as has happened a few times, perhaps most notably at the Harrow Court fire back in 2005.
 

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The box by the downpipe is actually power for the street light. Would have been ideal if it was our supply.
So they buried your own meter under the stairs along with the CU? For a long time, they have been adamant that meters must be accessible from outside so that they can be read even if the owner is away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
So they buried your own meter under the stairs along with the CU? For a long time, they have been adamant that meters must be accessible from outside so that they can be read even if the owner is away.
Yeah it鈥檚 next to the CU
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Quick question on this, does anyone know if the EO Mini Pro 2 supply cable can go in the top of the unit. I checked the installation instructions and it says to keep water tightness the supply cable should enter from the bottom but my unit will be installed under cover would it be an option to run the supply cable straight in the top?
 
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