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Discussion Starter #1
and it's not cheap.
summary:

Monthly subscription fee: £4
plus
pay-as-you-go 3.6p per minute = £0.32/kWh if you have a 6.6kW charger, or £0.64/kWh if you have a 3.3kW charger.

not clear if 'pay as you go' means for non-members, or whether scheme members still have to pay for the per-minute charging fees.

fees only apparently payable on the new IER charge points, but all members will be due the £4/month from 1 January 2017.

source: New points and payment system for Source London network - Zap-Map
 

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Leaf e+ 62kwh https://share.octopus.energy/quiet-puma-274
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That's pretty good compared to Chargemaster in MK.. There's a £8 per month + 9p per Kw with 1st 6 Months subscription free... I think 9p per Kw is good but the £8 monthly charge after 6 months makes it very expensive if you don't use it much... Think they operate a PAYG system too but not sure on the cost of this..
 

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Discussion Starter #3
For some locations, it's good value, where you'd otherwise be feeding a parking meter at several pounds per hour; for others, it's steep, and bizarre when there's other charge points on their network in the same car park.

High Barnet tube station, for instance. £6 per day for parking, and the 22kW Siemens posts will likely be free, but the 7kW IER charge points will be chargeable per minute. Commuters just won't use them because they'll be parked there all day. 8am - 6.30pm is £22.60 in electricity costs.
 

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and it's not cheap.
summary:
Monthly subscription fee: £4
plus
pay-as-you-go 3.6p per minute = £0.32/kWh if you have a 6.6kW charger, or £0.64/kWh if you have a 3.3kW charger.

not clear if 'pay as you go' means for non-members, or whether scheme members still have to pay for the per-minute charging fees.

fees only apparently payable on the new IER charge points, but all members will be due the £4/month from 1 January 2017.

source: New points and payment system for Source London network - Zap-Map
They said they would email us with details when they changed the scheme, I've seen nothing yet. :(
The question of price per minute on top of the monthly subscription will be the make or break for me.
No way I will be paying 64p/KWh, or many other PHEV owners I would wager. :eek:
 

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Leaf e+ 62kwh https://share.octopus.energy/quiet-puma-274
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oh whoops, sounds like another case of no common sense and disjointed thinking:eek: but that's nothing new :rolleyes:... Are they 7kw chargers? If so then the idea of chargers at stations is a bit of an awkward one.. On one hand it would be great to plug in, go to work, come back at end of the day to a full charge.. On the other, the car will be charged in a few hours & stop others from using it for the rest of the day..
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Source London's preferred charge points are made by IER (part of the same Bolloré group), the IER 986, which has a 7.2kW type 2 socket, and a 3.6kW tethered J1172 type 1 plug on a reel, only one of which can be used at a time.
In locations where there's multiple bays, they tend to have one special feeder pillar that feeds multiple charge points, and the feeder pillar is also where the 4G/ADSL network router is.

I guess the tethered plug is primarily for their hire cars, so that they don't need to supply a charge cable that might go walkabout.

Regarding the tariff, I'd thoroughly expect any per-minute charges to be the equivalent of car parking charges; so in locations where you're already paying for parking, you wouldn't also be paying per minute for charging. Either that, or if charges for use within paid car parks to be capped at electricity cost plus a small markup.
 

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3.6p / minute is clearly to high, particularly for slow charging PHEVs. The POLAR Plus tariffs are far fairer.
They seem to be doing an Ecotricity with this, charging by time instead of by the KWh. :(
As these are destination chargers, not rapids, I think they have chosen the wrong model.
There is no way I will be paying 3.6p/min.

I need 3 hours @ 240V/15A to put the ~8.4 KWh back in my battery.
That would cost me £6.48 for ~30 miles of electric driving @77p/KWh. :cry:

Around town I think I get about 40mpg on petrol, so at current prices that would cost me about £4.95 x 30/40 = £3.72
Hmmm, what's it going to be, a polluting £3.72 or an eco-friendly £6.48 ? (plus the £4/month fee).

On my average 6000 miles of town'ish driving per year that could put up to an extra £600 on my fuel bill. :eek:
Tricky. :)
I forsee the use of an extension cable across the pavement a lot more frequently in the future. :sneaky:
 

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I guess they will email members before end Dec...

New charge points will be identifiable from the app, and current Source London members will continue to have free access to the network under the existing terms until Saturday 31st December.
 

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This is far worse than the Ecotricity or Polar models. I can imagine that usage will plummet. I don't use it enough to justify £4 a month and a per minute fee and there are much better options in most places in London.
 

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That's pretty good compared to Chargemaster in MK.. There's a £8 per month + 9p per Kw with 1st 6 Months subscription free... I think 9p per Kw is good but the £8 monthly charge after 6 months makes it very expensive if you don't use it much... Think they operate a PAYG system too but not sure on the cost of this..
It's £7.85 a month and most points are free. Only a few points (+ their rapids) charge the 9p/kWh.

Or you can pay £1.20 per go on the Polar instant pay as you go model.

I'm much more likely to keep my Polar card (especially as it works on a lot of the Source London ones).
 

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I think MK is the exception, most of there's are chargeable but the upside is no parking fees if your charging :) my only problem is I don't use em enough to make the monthly sub cost effective, once the free introductory period is up I'll probably just go PAYG...
 

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I wonder if they are obliged, under competition law, to charge themselves these prices for their rental cars?
 

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I think I saw something about charging included in the rental cost for MK EV rental scheme..
 

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That's the problem with the whole charge to charge system where it's gone from free to expensive over night, it's a shame they didn't introduce small costs 1st.. I don't think anyone expects it to be free ( I know I don't ) but it has to be at a price point that still entices us in, not puts most of us off :(
 

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It may also be common knowledge to some, but if you have a Mitsu PHEV you can charge the car via the petrol engine for less / kWh - which is a sad indictment of low emissions London...
Yes, precisely.
This whole charging for charging done by private infrastructure companies just feels wrong when we are trying to reduce pollution levels.
I think the infrastructure should really have been mandated from the start by government with a fixed vision (of reducing pollution). Pricing at or below the price of fossil fuels should have been written in.
It's always going to be problematic when private companies have to recoupe start-up costs, pushing the charges up way above the running costs.
 

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There are two issues.

1. People visiting London who need to charge. If it's more expensive than petrol and they need to do it regularly, they will take their ICE and it will slow adoption of EVs as their only vehicle.

2. People who live in London and need to charge their EV, but don't have off-street parking.
 
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