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BMW i3
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
We're on Eco7 with Bulb at the minute, but it's not a competitive tariff so looking to switch.

Octopus have quoted the following rates for Go, and this would be approx usage:

Off-peak unit rate (00:30-04:30): 5.00 p / kWh x 1750 kWh = £87.50
Peak unit rate (04:30-00:30): 13.80 p / kWh x 3000 kWh = £414
Standing Charge: 25.00 p / day x 365 = £91.25

TOTAL £592.75

We have 4kW solar PV with solar diverter (to hot water tank) plus an EVSE with a "solar switch" - with the car at home more these days we can get a fair bit of free charging from say April to Sept. The only off-peak usage of any consequence would be the EV (don't have any home automation and not sure my wife would want dishwasher etc running in the middle of the night - her mothers caught fire once!).

Attractions of the Go tariff are that it's simple, but how would Agile folk say it compares? Could I save enough to make it worth my while?

I wouldn't be averse to minimising usage between 4 and 7pm (apart from the oven!) and happy to try and put dishwasher/ washing machine etc on when an app suggests it's prudent to do so.

Car is an i3 with around 30kWh battery - so not going to be able to fill my boots that much when they pay you to do so, how often is that and when do they typically pay you to take electricity off their hands? Sunny days? Windy nights? Sunny, windy days?!

There is also the Ohme cable option - but I don't know much about it, perhaps I should download the app. Guess if it's a sunny day and I'm exporting electricity I'd simply tell the Ohme to "charge now". £199 also buys a fair bit of juice at 5p/kWh or so!

Apologies for the ramble, but any advice welcomed. Thanks, Dan

PS have emailed Octopus to ask about timescales for smart meters, Bulb keep asking me if I'd like a SMETS2 meter so might be quicker to get them to do it then switch.
 

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Right now Go is better for most use cases because wholesale prices are unusually high. Worth keeping an eye on your usage and prices using the API because you can switch once a month I believe.
 

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BMW i3
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Right now Go is better for most use cases because wholesale prices are unusually high. Worth keeping an eye on your usage and prices using the API because you can switch once a month I believe.
Thanks, I found this which may help check:

 

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We have economy 7 with Octopus but our usage on 7 is only around 10% of total although that didn't include home charging.

I want to go on Octopus go as it seems to be a lot cheaper . But we don't have a smart meter, I want one fitted but we have a triple phase supply. As far as I am aware they are not installing triple phase smart meters currently .

Interested to hear opinions on this....
 

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jim5452
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367 Posts
As already pointed out AGILE is not competitive at the moment, as well as GO there are various versions of GO FASTER which are BETA TARIFFS and are not publicised, basicaly a choice of 12 different tariffs and priced at 3 different levels 4.5p,5p and 5.5p per KWh. Inorder to get on one of these tariff you will need an invitation, which can be obtained by requesting one by email
 

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Ampera aka IGOR
Tesla Model 3 P
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I'm basically in the same boat. Moved from E7 on Bulb to Octopus Go. 4kW solar with a diverter for the immersion and a smart charger, zappi2. The last few days I have managed to have a full tank at 60c (not a particularly big tank but not small either so probably average for a 3 bed). The car (Model 3 with 75kW battery) has charged up from about 40% to 82% with no use due to working from home. One thing to think about is (I think its a standard of the charging protocols) that the car will not take a charge unless it is over 1.4kW. With the zappi it seems to need to see 1.4kW for a certain minimum time before it will start offering a charge to the car. There are a few times that I have seen a reading of over 1kW heading back to the grid. My intention is to fit a battery to soak up all this stuff between when the tank is up to temp but there is not enough to direct it to the car.
 

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jim5452
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>>>With the zappi it seems to need to see 1.4kW for a certain minimum time before it will start offering a charge to the car.<<<<
This time is programable perhaps you have the time set to long, also according to my Zappi it will continue to charge at 1.3 kw then cuts out at any lower, which then goes to the HW cylinder
 

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2021 Tesla Model 3 LR
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I'm basically in the same boat. Moved from E7 on Bulb to Octopus Go. 4kW solar with a diverter for the immersion and a smart charger, zappi2. The last few days I have managed to have a full tank at 60c (not a particularly big tank but not small either so probably average for a 3 bed). The car (Model 3 with 75kW battery) has charged up from about 40% to 82% with no use due to working from home. One thing to think about is (I think its a standard of the charging protocols) that the car will not take a charge unless it is over 1.4kW. With the zappi it seems to need to see 1.4kW for a certain minimum time before it will start offering a charge to the car. There are a few times that I have seen a reading of over 1kW heading back to the grid. My intention is to fit a battery to soak up all this stuff between when the tank is up to temp but there is not enough to direct it to the car.
On the Zappi unit you can change the ratio of solar to grid required to start and maintain charge. I’ve got mine to kick in when I’ve got about 900W of solar, which it then tops up with 500W of grid. My man maths suggests that if a maximum of 1/3 of the electricity is from the grid then the maximum it will cost is less than Octopus Go’s 5p per kWh. It also means that when the sun goes in I’m still charging (April to September at least).
 

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We're on Eco7 with Bulb at the minute, but it's not a competitive tariff so looking to switch.

Octopus have quoted the following rates for Go, and this would be approx usage:

Off-peak unit rate (00:30-04:30): 5.00 p / kWh x 1750 kWh = £87.50
Peak unit rate (04:30-00:30): 13.80 p / kWh x 3000 kWh = £414
Standing Charge: 25.00 p / day x 365 = £91.25

TOTAL £592.75

We have 4kW solar PV with solar diverter (to hot water tank) plus an EVSE with a "solar switch" - with the car at home more these days we can get a fair bit of free charging from say April to Sept. The only off-peak usage of any consequence would be the EV (don't have any home automation and not sure my wife would want dishwasher etc running in the middle of the night - her mothers caught fire once!).

Attractions of the Go tariff are that it's simple, but how would Agile folk say it compares? Could I save enough to make it worth my while?

I wouldn't be averse to minimising usage between 4 and 7pm (apart from the oven!) and happy to try and put dishwasher/ washing machine etc on when an app suggests it's prudent to do so.

Car is an i3 with around 30kWh battery - so not going to be able to fill my boots that much when they pay you to do so, how often is that and when do they typically pay you to take electricity off their hands? Sunny days? Windy nights? Sunny, windy days?!

There is also the Ohme cable option - but I don't know much about it, perhaps I should download the app. Guess if it's a sunny day and I'm exporting electricity I'd simply tell the Ohme to "charge now". £199 also buys a fair bit of juice at 5p/kWh or so!

Apologies for the ramble, but any advice welcomed. Thanks, Dan

PS have emailed Octopus to ask about timescales for smart meters, Bulb keep asking me if I'd like a SMETS2 meter so might be quicker to get them to do it then switch.
1. We got our smart meter thru Bulb, then moved to Octopus a few months later (coincidental - wasn't looking at an EV when Bulb installed start meter, moved to Octopus when I got a PHEV, now BEV).

2. Tried Agile for a few months October to January this year - it was definitely cheaper than a standard tariff, but we found the variable constraints around not planning things like oven, dishwasher, washing machine use a pain - not for peak hours, they're always clear, but some days there are expensive peaks mid-morning or mid-afternoon, just when we "had" to use a large consumer.

3. Shifted to Go Faster end of Jan this year, and so far that has been even cheaper, plus, makes rest of life so much simpler. This is yesterday with a BEV charge overnight to this morning (well midnight on this chart. It doesn't calculate Go Faster % age, but it's 50% near as damnit);

143809
 

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I’ve been waiting til the end of my current outfox flat tariff to end, in the middle of switching to Octopus but will need a smart meter fitted, outfox wouldn’t supply. Still s withering between Go and Agile. Seen people rave about how agile is so cheap but for almost 2 months it’s not come any lower than about 0.5p cheaper than I’m on with my current supplier for about an hour a day if your lucky. Been tracking it on the Sheffield uni grid watch and it looks like it’s been due to the weather of late. We came off a very cold snap where expensive gas was being used to keep the generation up, right into some milder weather with virtually no wind at all for almost 3 weeks now! Gas has been running full pelt. That and there is quite a few nuclear reactors either off completely or on reduced capacity due to mandatory maintenence. So basically waiting for maintenance to even out, more solar going into summer and some windy weather, we’ll have a plunge before you know it.
 

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jim5452
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You do not need to decide which tariff to join as there is no exit fee and you can change tariffs after 30 days on any of the BETA tariffs AGILE and any of the GO tariffs, however to be on those you arec correct you need a smart meter, there is of course a TRACKER tariff which does not need a smart meter which you could go on until you get your meter
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for the replies, looks like Go is probably my best bet (or one of the Go Fasters) - might look at Agile in the future.

In the meantime Bulb said they are fitting smart meters from next week, but claim that as I have economy7 and an immersion heater this complicates things! (and that I need an electrician to rewire my appliances).

I think they’re confused with the setup you might have in a flat where the E7 circuit powers night storage heaters/ immersion.
 

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Ampera aka IGOR
Tesla Model 3 P
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3,612 Posts
Thanks for the replies, looks like Go is probably my best bet (or one of the Go Fasters) - might look at Agile in the future.

In the meantime Bulb said they are fitting smart meters from next week, but claim that as I have economy7 and an immersion heater this complicates things! (and that I need an electrician to rewire my appliances).

I think they’re confused with the setup you might have in a flat where the E7 circuit powers night storage heaters/ immersion.
When I first bought my first EV I was with Sainsbury's Energy and moved from a standard single rate meter to an E7 meter. I then moved to Bulb and then to Octopus, had my smart meter installed and then moved to the Go tariff.
 

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There is an app "Octopus Go Agile" that compares your Octopus tariff (eg. GO) to Agile. It gives you monthly / daily breakdown which tariff is better for your usage.
Worth to try.
 

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Neither are accurate, only use your historical timed data.
There is a consumption shifting beta on compare Pro which makes it a bit better.
Agile and Go would command totally different usage patterns to be used properly, the tariffs are in no way similar.
I only need to spend 5 seconds looking at Agile current prices to know Go Faster is cheaper for us by a massive amount.
Most of today Agile is more expensive than our high rate on Go Faster so no calculator needed to work that one out.And for ages now its not got anywhere near our cheap rate .
 

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I only need to spend 5 seconds looking at Agile current prices to know Go Faster is cheaper for us by a massive amount.
Exactly, most of the calculators don't take account of shifting consumption which is critical to how the Agile and Go tariffs work. I've tried to make these comparisons myself, and it's pretty tricky to know how to shift consumption to accurately compare Go and Agile, especially if you're charging an EV.

But as @Chrisb says, at the moment it doesn't matter - Go is just cheaper across the board. We'll see what happens when wholesale / Agile prices come down. Luckily Octopus makes it very easy to switch. (That said, I'm really liking Go Faster - it was fun watching Agile prices for a while, but it's pretty nice to go back to a fixed schedule)
 

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Exactly, most of the calculators don't take account of shifting consumption which is critical to how the Agile and Go tariffs work. I've tried to make these comparisons myself, and it's pretty tricky to know how to shift consumption to accurately compare Go and Agile, especially if you're charging an EV.

But as @Chrisb says, at the moment it doesn't matter - Go is just cheaper across the board. We'll see what happens when wholesale / Agile prices come down. Luckily Octopus makes it very easy to switch. (That said, I'm really liking Go Faster - it was fun watching Agile prices for a while, but it's pretty nice to go back to a fixed schedule)
The only way to do it is to already have a smart meter whose data you can access, then shift your usage to off-peak as much as you can. You can then use that data to see what the cost would've been with various tariffs. If you don't have a smart meter whose data you can access, you just have to guess.
 

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Exactly, most of the calculators don't take account of shifting consumption which is critical to how the Agile and Go tariffs work. I've tried to make these comparisons myself, and it's pretty tricky to know how to shift consumption to accurately compare Go and Agile, especially if you're charging an EV.

But as @Chrisb says, at the moment it doesn't matter - Go is just cheaper across the board. We'll see what happens when wholesale / Agile prices come down. Luckily Octopus makes it very easy to switch. (That said, I'm really liking Go Faster - it was fun watching Agile prices for a while, but it's pretty nice to go back to a fixed schedule)
Octopus Compare app does this (shift consumption). Not sure of the calcs, but the graphs do show it moving expensive kWh to cheaper times on Agile in a logical fashion.

Agree on the Agile vs Go Faster - there is an initial fascination to seeing how much you can game Agile, but after a while it gets a bit tedious.
 

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Octopus Compare app does this (shift consumption). Not sure of the calcs, but the graphs do show it moving expensive kWh to cheaper times on Agile in a logical fashion.

Agree on the Agile vs Go Faster - there is an initial fascination to seeing how much you can game Agile, but after a while it gets a bit tedious.
I didn't realize Octopus Compare could shift consumption - I've just looked at it, and that does seem to be what it's doing. Excellent! I tried to do it myself, with my own smart meter data and some programming skills, but I could never get a satisfactory result. Looks like the Octopus Compare people have cracked it.
 
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