[DrDave]

Dear All,

Tale of woe here. Recently bought my Model3 and took it to Bishop's Stortford supercharger for a fill up. On arrival all of the FOUR stalls were busy and I had to wait (that's another story of shortage of stalls for another day!). Grabbed myself a coffee and every waited about 40 minutes for a charge. Eventually got on and spent about an hour on there - possibly more as the battery was cold plus other tesla next to me. Thought nothing more about it.

Through the post today I get a penalty notice fron ParkingEye with a £100 penalty (dropping to £60 if paid within a fortnight). I didn't see the 2 hour max stay notices at all on entering the area.

Do I have any recourse to claim that as I was about to charge/charging that there should be no charge, or do I just suck it up and put it down to experience ?

Thanks in advance!

 

[davesul]

According to ZapMap, the parking at the Tesla Supercharger is free, so which area has the penalty charge?

 

[DrDave]

Their issue was the time that I spent there. They've allegedly got a 2 hour limit (didn't see the sign), which ordinarlily wouldn't be an issue, except that there are only 4 stalls and it is very well used (well the two times that I've been!) This meant that by the time I got onto charge, then charged, and got back out again, it was 2hours 21 minutes. I've submitted an online appeal to ParkingEye and we'll see what happens.

Anyone got any advice if I need to go to POPLA ? Anyone successfully defended a charge while charging ?

 

[Hitstirrer]

Only a local authority ticket when parked at a 7Kw post to charge. The car park had a free 30 minutes tariff before costs incurred. I was only intending to be there 20 minutes but plugged in anyway. Then found that it was broken. I put the cable back in the boot as it wasn't secured due to the post being out of action. Went off for 15 minutes.

Came back to a ticket. Then discovered that the rule about a penalty being charged if not charging trumped the free 30 minutes rule ffs.

The unimpressed warden shrugged and said that if I had left the cable attached he wouldn't have known that it wasn't actually delivering electrons and walked on by. Then the world's expert in customer relations rubbed salt in by saying I should have moved to the adjacent non EV bay to be eligible for the free 30 minutes. Oh joy.

The appeal was accepted with a stern warning that I wouldn't get away with such a heinous crime next time.

 

[toscal353]

I would suggest getting some good photos and footage of the area if you intend to make a case of poor/ inadequate signage.
POPLA are little more than a trade body for the parking cowboys who fund them. They are not truly independent.

If you feel you have a strong case either because the signage was inadequate or because the time limit did not apply on the charger while charging then you could wait for the County Court procedure but the costs will escalate if you loose.

 

[Mike From Manchester]

Not too dissimilar circumstance and POPLA individual assessors seem independent enough.
It was a retail park car park with the argument being signage related to the shopping opportunities and not the charging facility. There were no signs readily available at the charge location to reinforce the time limits.

Good Luck

 

[Petriix]

There are minimal costs if you lose, and you almost certainly won't lose if your defence is correct. Read the Money Saving Expert forum for exactly how to deal with it.

 

[DrDave]

Not too dissimilar circumstance and POPLA individual assessors seem independent enough.

Mike, thanks for the pdf - the POPLA adjudicators do indeed sound fair.

I've appealed directly on the ParkingEye website and if unsuccessful (as I reckon they aren't going to throw my £100 away) I'll reach out to POPLA.

Now if only Tesla has more than FOUR charge bays at Bishop's Stortford then life would be a little easier / less stressful !

 

[cah197]

I have successfully challenged a ticket at this exact location, when I was waiting at the Supercharger to pick someone up from the airport.

I argued that the Supercharger site was under a separate lease to the rest of the site. Hence they weren’t legally allowed to fine me.

 

[UKTechie]

A fair explanation on appeal but hard to judge which way it could go, you would hope they would let you off once, good luck

 

[Hitstirrer]

I have heard of numerous anomalies over the use of chargers in commercial car parks where disputes have arisen over whether a car is there for fuel alone or for parking that happens to coincide with a fuel visit. Neither the charger signage nor the parking signs give clarity in situations where parking is nominally free of cost but with an overstay sting that is easy to miss. The lesson to be taken away is to always carefully study parking signs even if it means searching around to find one. Then comply.

 

[Petriix]

That's not great advice. For a contract to be binding and enforceable it has to be clear, fair and balanced. There should be no emphasis on one party having to search for, interpret and comply with ambiguous or contradictory signage.

There is a good reason why 99% of cases (when properly defended) are rejected in court. Receiving a PCN doesn't mean you've done something wrong or that you owe anyone anything; it just means that a predatory company is attempting to enforce a tenuous 'contract' which they claim you are party to.

The best advice is to behave 'reasonably' but never pay a PCN unless you genuinely were aware of and agreed to all of the conditions or instructed to pay by a judge.

 

[toscal353]

And remember it's not a fine, just an invoice made to look as legal, officious and threatening as possible.

 

[DrDave]

Can I take a moment to thank everyone that has given advice here. It is very much appreciated. I'll post what happens, as it happens .... better than watching East Enders !

 

[toscal353]

Anything & everything is better than Eastenders!! good luck.

 

[Hitstirrer]

I think that we have a forum member with a lot of experience in helping people to dispute such Parking Eye invoices. I won't publish his details here until I have PM'd him to ask if he wants to become involved. If so he might pitch in on this thread if he can help.

 

[JohnK]

According to ZapMap, the parking at the Tesla Supercharger is free, so which area has the penalty charge?

But the Tesla SC map does say "Free for 2 hours"

Still worth having a go at getting the charge dropped. Surely a reasonable argument that time spent charging is not time spent "parked" hence less than 2 hours "parked"

 

[ElectricIan]

I think that we have a forum member with a lot of experience in helping people to dispute such Parking Eye invoices. I won't publish his details here until I have PM'd him to ask if he wants to become involved. If so he might pitch in on this thread if he can help.

Goodness talk about building me up. Haha. I have successfully defended many cases against these leeches under varying scenarios. Presently about 50 - 0 in my favour. Although I have never actually had one myself.

It will take some active input from yourself @DrDave and it will drag on. Remember this is their business model. They are not in the business to actively manage car parks. If there were no transgressions they wouldn't earn a penny.

I will tell you now they won't accept your appeal regardless of how much merit it has. They are unscrupulous.

Unfortunately you shouldn't have even appealed to them as you have now almost certainly told them you were the driver. Under the Protections of freedoms act 2012 (POFA 2012) they can only legally persue the driver initially. Only then if unidentified they can persue the registered keeper. This however brings into play many strict conditions and timescales that they need to comply with and often fail in this regard.

Let me do some digging.

But first off, have you admitted being the driver? Are you the RK? What date was the alleged infringement and when did you receive the NTK (notice to keeper). I guess it was via post rather than a physical ticket.

 

[ElectricIan]

@Dr Dave if you prefer to PM then feel free.

 

[Hitstirrer]

It will take some active input from yourself @DrDave and it will drag on. Remember this is their business model. They are not in the business to actively manage car parks. If there were no transgressions they wouldn't earn a penny.

Thanks for pitching in @ElectricIan - any help to fight these leeches is welcome. I hope this is #51 success for you.

There is one thing though. There seems to be two Dr Dave's as forum members. One is the OP - @DrDave and another who joined much later whose forum name has a space between the r and the D - as in Dr Dave. And you just named the second one in post #19 - which will no doubt confuse him lol.