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Discussion Starter #1
Is this being discussed here? A simple search didn't come up with anything, but I find it impossible to believe!
For me, this is probably the #1 reason that I would not recommend someone buy a Tesla.
I'm even toying with the idea of trying to report it to whichever government body is responsible for road safety.
 

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All the automatic braking/adaptive cruise controls seem to have some level of false positives. It is there to try to catch the situations where you don't or to be faster than you and you need to be monitoring it and correcting it. My model 3 disliked certain narrow roads, double decker buses coming the other way and once or twice incorrectly thougth it was on a crossing 30mph road when it was actually driving under it on the motorway. I get broadly similar phantom braking with the BMW I3 and the Honda E. Just for good measure I know someone with a new high spec ICE Mercedes that has recently started refusing to move off at all at junctions due to an apparently invisible car in front.
 

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I had a Tesla using AP1 and it never phantom braked. My wife has a BMW 8 series and that never phantom brakes either, in fact its much better than the Tesla system at most things. This all seemed to start after Joshua Brown went under a lorry and they seemed to change the mix with significantly more false positives in the hope of reducing false negatives. Pictures or cars hitting fire engines suggests the change has not worked that well.

There's said to be a big update coming where they've made some fundemental changes so hopefully it will improve. When comparing other cars you have to be mindful of what those cars claim to do and what generation of hardware they have. The i3 mentioned above has a very crude early system and has at best a traffric jam assist feature. Even High Spec mercs can be using the older generation kit, like BMW only models released in the last year tend to come with the latest Mobileye systems. Hionda E is more of a surprise but I don;t know what it claims to do.
 

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My experience with genuine phantom braking seems to vary greatly depending on the AP version. Often, it is caused by the system's refusal to undertake. i.e. if you are in lane 2 and approach a slower-moving line of traffic in lane 3, AP will brake to prevent undertaking. The reason could be clearer in the system display, and it feels like phantom braking because it is unexpected.

Geninue phantom braking feels worse than it is. The car rarely loses more than a few mph before it recovers. Of course, it would be better not to have it at all.

Reporting to road safety org... why? If someone rear-ends you, it is their fault, whether it is because your car thought it was about to crash, or because you thought you were about to crash.
 

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I had a Tesla using AP1 and it never phantom braked.
My AP1 car did it. Passing a white truck seemed to set it off fairly reliably.

Recently it seems to have gotten worse on the AP2 car, but I wonder if sometimes this is part of the system alerting the driver to issues?
 

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Not really had any phantom braking on my Model 3 but then I only use AP on motorways and major A roads.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I also only use it on motorways and A-roads. I would say that it’s better on 2020.40 than the previous release.
The worst case I’ve had recently was in France overtaking a lorry. That was on 2020.36.x
 

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EGGY
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I get it regularly to the point where I've stopped using AP. Worse example was on a deserted, flat, dual carriageway in Italy, sunny evening no traffic visible in either direction, just slammed the brakes on
 

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EGGY
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As it happens .........

 

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EGGY
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And if you think the rewrite will solve all these problems ......

 

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Reporting to road safety org... why? If someone rear-ends you, it is their fault, whether it is because your car thought it was about to crash, or because you thought you were about to crash.
Err, No. Humans, like AP, are taught to drive based on more than just concentrating on the vehicle immediately ahead. Phantom braking is akin to brake checking and will work against the authorities allowing further increases in autonomous driving until a significant proportion of vehicles on the road are fitted with effective AEB. Given that the legacy manufacturers are struggling with this it will be a while yet.
 
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