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Discussion Starter #1
Taken from Purchase of Batteries - Twizyowners :-

In the german forums (vectric-forum.de or twizy-online.de) there has been some discussion about buying the battery. As Renault/RCI doesn't offer this possibility, some forum member has contacted Kreisel (a firm that specialises in conversions, and for example offers a VW Caddy with 350km range).

After some mails, they have made a firm offer. If they get 10 purchasers, they will develop a 13kWh battery, including BMS and weighting about 70kg (original Twizy has 6.1 usable or 7kWh total, in 100kg). The price would be 6900 Eur, I think before taxes. It would come with warranty; the battery will keep above 80% of it's original capacity for at least 180000km.

There is also a second option. Another forum member, which already has developed and used a range extender and added extra chargers to his Twizy, has revealed that at his company they are also developing a new battery. Probably they will let you choose a capacity (12 or 17kWh) and they will also offer a new charger that can charge with 3 or 6kW instead of the 2.2kW that the original charger does. A type 2 plug (Mennekes) would be an option, too. Price is unknow for now, but it is expected to be somewhat cheaper than the Kreisel one.



All sounds good if a little expensive at £5k + VAT
 

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Discussion Starter #3
@Brads OVMS - up the power then especially if the battery is twice the size. However there have been some Renault battery failures on Twizys where the Regen has been boasted too much.:eek:
 

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I'm more interested in 22kW/43kW charge over Mennekes Type 2 than extra range (though I'll not turn it down).

Would a Type 2 AC - Level 2-3 charging Twizzy be possible? If so we'll talk money.
 

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It only costs you about £2500 to buy the current Twizy battery of you wanted to, can't remember the exact figure in the RCI contract but its not far off that.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
It only costs you about £2500 to buy the current Twizy battery of you wanted to, can't remember the exact figure in the RCI contract but its not far off that.
But this isn't an option. The only way you can buy the battery in the UK is as you suggested default on your contract.
 

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I don't know if anyone has ever phoned RCI and asked if they can just pay the insured value and own the battery. In theory they should be happy with that as it remove their liability if the battery goes wrong - whether their systems allow it or not is a different matter.
 

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They don't have that liability because they 'buy' a product and rent it out, just as any other consumer 'buys' it. It is Renault who honour the warranty not RCI. RCI don't seem to be able to make money from a situation, they prefer to stick to the letter of the original terms, come what may.

There is already some software update to release more power, so that part is not an issue AFAIK. Being able to buy a battery to get twice the range would mean I might even start looking at it seriously for my motorway commute!

Sounds great news.

Also great to hear is that companies are prepared to consider bespoke battery manufacture if there is enough interest, hinting at the future where companies will be in competition to offer 3rd party battery packs to EV owners.
 

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They must have that liability, they have an agreement with the customer to replace the battery if it drops below a set level of usefulness. We have no idea what agreement they then have with Renault on the batteries but this doesn't matter to the consumer as it is RCI's responsibility to fix it. Taking it to the extreme if someone ran a Twizy for say 12 years and the battery then dropped below the set level I should think Renault would turn round and say yeah thats to be expected so RCI would have to buy a new battery for the consumer.
 

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It doesn't work like that. RCI are a customer of Renault, and RCI are liable in so far as they would pass the responsibility for the battery replacement back to Renault.

Any lease company is 'responsible' for the items they lease out, but in the event of any warranty problems they will return it to the vendor they bought it from. RCI is no different, it is merely a fully owned subsidiary providing financial services.

When my Fluence went back due to its motor failure, there was still an outstanding month or so. That had to be covered, it could not be written off. As a good will gesture, Renault UK paid off the amount to RCI. There was no question that RCI would 'write off' anything, the two companies acted totally independently.

(I would just like to say that in my situation, Renault UK were absolutely beyond question the most helpful and reasonable they could possibly have been. I am very grateful to them for their courteous and well considered handling of the situation and would not hesitate to rate them as 'high performing' when it comes to trying to achieve customer satisfaction. I loved the Fluence and would like to see them get that product right and produce something of similar size and quality. The only issues I had was with RCI, whom, errrr..., I might hesitate to rate highly! ;) )
 

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While the battery is in warranty I would agree, but after a period of time Renault UK won't be covering the battery anymore as they would be expecting it to start losing its capacity. At this point RCI would have to replace it out of their own pocket - this is the whole reason for the battery rental, obviously RCI are taking the gamble that when it comes to this point they have recouped enough money form the battery rental to cover the costs. I am assuming they would also get a rebate for "returning" the degraded battery to Renault for it to be recycled/repaired.
 

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Hi, i have just joined the forum though see this is a while back.

I am setting up a new bussines using Twizy's and i would be interested in this. I will have at least 20 and could juutify the reasonable cost of such a battery life extension.

I understand from Renault that there are weight issues regarding the vehicle to comply with its current classification as well as cooling issues hence no longer life battery option or fast charge are available.

Thoughts and interest gratefully received.


While the battery is in warranty I would agree, but after a period of time Renault UK won't be covering the battery anymore as they would be expecting it to start losing its capacity. At this point RCI would have to replace it out of their own pocket - this is the whole reason for the battery rental, obviously RCI are taking the gamble that when it comes to this point they have recouped enough money form the battery rental to cover the costs. I am assuming they would also get a rebate for "returning" the degraded battery to Renault for it to be recycled/repaired.
Taken from Purchase of Batteries - Twizyowners :-

In the german forums (vectric-forum.de or twizy-online.de) there has been some discussion about buying the battery. As Renault/RCI doesn't offer this possibility, some forum member has contacted Kreisel (a firm that specialises in conversions, and for example offers a VW Caddy with 350km range).

After some mails, they have made a firm offer. If they get 10 purchasers, they will develop a 13kWh battery, including BMS and weighting about 70kg (original Twizy has 6.1 usable or 7kWh total, in 100kg). The price would be 6900 Eur, I think before taxes. It would come with warranty; the battery will keep above 80% of it's original capacity for at least 180000km.

There is also a second option. Another forum member, which already has developed and used a range extender and added extra chargers to his Twizy, has revealed that at his company they are also developing a new battery. Probably they will let you choose a capacity (12 or 17kWh) and they will also offer a new charger that can charge with 3 or 6kW instead of the 2.2kW that the original charger does. A type 2 plug (Mennekes) would be an option, too. Price is unknow for now, but it is expected to be somewhat cheaper than the Kreisel one.



All sounds good if a little expensive at £5k + VAT
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Hi, i have just joined the forum though see this is a while back.

I am setting up a new bussines using Twizy's and i would be interested in this. I will have at least 20 and could juutify the reasonable cost of such a battery life extension.

I understand from Renault that there are weight issues regarding the vehicle to comply with its current classification as well as cooling issues hence no longer life battery option or fast charge are available.

Thoughts and interest gratefully received.

Heavy Weight Quads have to be less than 550 kg and the Twizy with Renault battery is 480KG. Plenty of headroom.
Take out the current battery and return to Renault dealer and get RCI to stop charging as you don't have a battery.
 

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Isn't the Bertie going to be the final nail in the coffin for the Twizy? The Bertie has a good range, flexibility with spec options, great price, and no complicated battery grief like you get with Renault.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Isn't the Bertie going to be the final nail in the coffin for the Twizy? The Bertie has a good range, flexibility with spec options, great price, and no complicated battery grief like you get with Renault.
Only if they make it available in the UK and not like the G-Wizz and Mahindra E20 only for the south of england or just London.
 

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@osbrook the guy on the Bertie thread confirmed it was available in the UK. Only a single English dealer option I am sure, but they will deliver it to Scotland or anywhere in England. Not sure about N.Ireland.

I thought the other significant advantage the Bertie has is no draughts, no splashing.

The Twizy still looks cooler though :) A real Shame the Twizy is so niche and had the battery hangup.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Not sure I understand the splashing bit. Had mine nearly 5 years and used daily all weather and never got wet driving. But the Battery rental is a major issue.

Fine getting it delivered around the UK but what a servicing and repairs.
 

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I thought the Twizy was prone to draughts and splashing in the worst weather as have been told that before. Maybe that is just re the door/window options though?

Agree, that servicing is certainly a question mark with the Bertie.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I have doors but never had windows. I did fit the much more necessary mud flaps on the front mud guards. That stops the spray.

Servicing the Twizy is still an issue as there are few EV service centres that are in range of the Twizy. At least the Twizy fits inside a Transit van to get it about. Recalls are another area that would require a return to supplier for updates/fixes.

Renault appear to have stopped the Twizy in the UK and so the second hand price has hardened a bit. This should help the Bertie if they can make it National.
 
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