Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner

1 - 20 of 45 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
865 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
From Fleetnews.co.uk:

Renault has decided to stop offering the new Zoe with a battery lease option after the car was awarded class-leading residual values by Cap.
Calculated over three years and 30,000 miles, the car is expected to retain 42% of its original purchase price.
The French manufacturer said such strong residuals mean the customer offer is “significantly improved”, therefore the battery lease option is no longer required.

In a statement, Renault said: “The offer of only a Full Purchase option simplifies the choice for customers and is in line with the rest of the Renault ZE range and the UK electric vehicle market. As more consumers choose electric cars in the UK, residual values of full-electric vehicles have improved considerably, with the Zoe at the forefront of this trend, meaning they are more affordable than ever.”
One of the main reasons that the battery lease option was initially introduced was to lower the initial purchase price of a Renault EV to be as close as possible to that of an equivalent diesel vehicle, in line with Renault’s aim of ‘Sustainable Mobility For All’. The recent improvements to the residual value on the new Zoe in the UK mean that this financial gap has now been reduced and we are able to offer a simplified choice to consumers.



From Carbuyer.co.uk

As you can no longer lease the Renault ZOE’s battery, the range now starts at £25,670

Renault has axed the option to lease the battery when you buy a new Renault ZOE. Buyers will now need to buy the battery as part of the whole package, rather than paying less for the car and then leasing the battery separately, which effectively increases the base price of the car by £7,000 to £25,670. Up until now, Renault had offered both choices, but class-leading residual values has led the French firm to simply its offering.
The ZOE may now start at £25,670 after the Government’s £3,500 grant but you no longer have to pay a monthly fee to lease the battery. Having to buy the battery is no more expensive than leasing it if you consider the cost as a whole, and a PCP finance offer available for the ZOE means the cost of buying the battery can at least be spread out over the course of the two-year deal.

Renault is offering a deposit contribution of £562 and, after a £2,995 deposit, the monthly payments come to £269 over two years. The current deal is set at 0% APR.
The trim levels available now mirror those of other Renault models, so the entry-level Play trim starts off the range at the advertised £25,670 price. The updated ZOE can be ordered later this month, with first deliveries starting in January 2020.
The Play model is the entry-level ZOE but features plenty of equipment as standard. LED headlights, air-conditioning, DAB radio, cruise control and auto headlights are all fitted, and there’s a seven-inch touchscreen with Apple CarPlay and Android Auto.




From pushevs.com :

When modern li-ion batteries are protected by a good TMS (Thermal Management System) and BMS (Battery Management System) they can and should outlast most expensive parts of an electric car. In the Renault ZOE’s case it’s a lot more likely to have to a serious problem with its motor or on-board charger than with its air-cooled battery pack made with LG Chem cells.

Moreover, with a battery lease you abandon one of the most appreciated benefits of electric cars, their extremely low running costs.

Anyway, in Portugal car dealers have a lot of difficulty in selling used electric cars with battery leases attached to them. For this reason some have decided to outright the batteries from RCI (Renault’s financing arm) and sell used Renault ZOE units with battery included to customers. You can find some examples of Renault ZOEs from 2015 sold with battery included for less than 12.000 euros at Standvirtual. In Spain some electric car dealers also adopted this method to move used Renault ZOEs out of their lots.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
I noticed that the GFV of the ZE40 battery owned was increased towards the end of its life, making it similar to the lease in terms of PCP figures.

Also worth noting that list (and in turn PCP figures) are lot lower than quoted above given additional discounts available.

For example, on a top spec GT Line with CCS and metallic paint, I was quoted ~£26k, with a 48m/6k mile PCP working out around £300per month with £3k down. Not a massive jump from the previous ZE40 signature, even under the lease guise.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,779 Posts
So all those articles from a year or so ago that slated Zoes for suffering terrible depreciation were just a load of complete tosh?

* is shocked *
I think they all made the mistake of taking the headline price and comparing it with the resale value, which was low partly because RCI said it was.

In reality no-one was buying Zoes for anything like the RRP. Over two years we paid £3,600 for our first one, including battery lease.

Good times.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,037 Posts
Renault says 'One of the main reasons that the battery lease option was initially introduced was to lower the initial purchase price of a Renault EV (...) The recent improvements to the residual value on the new Zoe in the UK mean that this financial gap has now been reduced'

Is this 'reasoning' just Gallic 'spin', or am I misunderstanding? The residual value after three years could be 0% or 99% and the financial gap between a new Zoe and an equivalent ICE would be ...the....same...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,779 Posts
Renault says 'One of the main reasons that the battery lease option was initially introduced was to lower the initial purchase price of a Renault EV (...) The recent improvements to the residual value on the new Zoe in the UK mean that this financial gap has now been reduced'

Is this 'reasoning' just Gallic 'spin', or am I misunderstanding? The residual value after three years could be 0% or 99% and the financial gap between a new Zoe and an equivalent ICE would be ...the....same...
It’s because they get the forecast residual values from third parties. They’re not talking about actual residual values.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,192 Posts
There are a few threads already discussing this, might be worth merging?

The GFV on the ZE50 are almost £5K more than ZE40 battery owned at 4 years. This certainly helps them offer a better monthly PCP but is smoke and mirrors as there will be little or no equity at end.

The pre-reg DSG ZE40 offer with lower GFV (£7331) is good as there should be a grand or two equity at end.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
There are a few threads already discussing this, might be worth merging?

The GFV on the ZE50 are almost £5K more than ZE40 battery owned at 4 years. This certainly helps them offer a better monthly PCP but is smoke and mirrors as there will be little or no equity at end.

The pre-reg DSG ZE40 offer with lower GFV (£7331) is good as there should be a grand or two equity at end.

The GFV on the i-ZE50 GT line after 48months is £12k. Given that you would be lucky to see a 3yr old Signature i-ZE40 for less than £16k, I think it's safe to say a GT-Line i-ZE50 is highly likely to have values well above the £12k mark. Unless you either think the market will be completely different in 4years, or that the value of the Zoe is staggeringly steep between years 3 and 4. Both seem implausible to me....

Of course lower GFV increases monthlies, so it depends what your view is. If your more geared towards total cost of ownership then that PCP on a used i-ZE40 wouldn't make sense either, as you might as well have £0 balloon and have loads more residual value and save on the interest costs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
774 Posts
There are a few threads already discussing this, might be worth merging?

The GFV on the ZE50 are almost £5K more than ZE40 battery owned at 4 years. This certainly helps them offer a better monthly PCP but is smoke and mirrors as there will be little or no equity at end.

The pre-reg DSG ZE40 offer with lower GFV (£7331) is good as there should be a grand or two equity at end.

This offer is no longer available. The 1k deposit contribution from Renault ended a couple of weeks ago, so the monthly is nearer 300, but the residual question will be how much will this model be worth in 4 years bearing in mind the new model is about to come out and may even have been superceded by another in 4 years time..
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,192 Posts
Personally I think the GFVs on ZE50 are probably what they will be worth. Yes I do think in 2024 values will have dropped as there will be lower cost new cars by then. Today we are in a weird space where demand is exceeding supply so used prices are very high - my ZE40 is worth more for a private sale than I paid for it. There is definitely a risk people will pay over £3K now (maybe their part ex) and have nothing left in car after 4 years.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
Personally I think the GFVs on ZE50 are probably what they will be worth. Yes I do think in 2024 values will have dropped as there will be lower cost new cars by then. Today we are in a weird space where demand is exceeding supply so used prices are very high - my ZE40 is worth more for a private sale than I paid for it. There is definitely a risk people will pay over £3K now (maybe their part ex) and have nothing left in car after 4 years.
RRP would have to drop by around £10k to result in residuals around £12k.

As nice as it would be, I don't see why it would happen. RRPs are going up, not down....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,716 Posts
I like to think of the cars as being in a market flooded by other EVs

that normalises my thinking

so would I pay £12k for a 4yr old clio? Nope ;)

if the EV car market is going to remain this expensive and the govt dictates we can’t buy new ICE cars then the uptake is going to be low and impact car companies massively

if those prices stay that high, it does make my leased Zoe look like it will keep its value :)

JJ
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,192 Posts
RRP would have to drop by around £10k to result in residuals around £12k.

As nice as it would be, I don't see why it would happen. RRPs are going up, not down....
Prices will come down as supply increases. VW will probably be the first with a <£25K ID3 (duty and exchange rate willing).

From above Renault are saying residual 42% of purchase price (less PICG certainly and maybe less discount?) after 3 years. Assume straight line and you are at 14% a year, so at 4 year value is just 28%. Let's be generous and say 33%, but even then £12K is possibly optimistic.

The reality is nobody actually knows what values will be in 2024. Past and current information isn't a good indication of the future. We all hope values will stay strong, but there is no guarantee.
 

·
Co-author of CanZE. Q210 nov 2013
Joined
·
4,277 Posts
Prices will come down as supply increases. VW will probably be the first with a <£25K ID3 (duty and exchange rate willing).
Caveats:
  • I fully confess I am biassed against VW. Way too expensive in general, hyped, diesel-gate.
  • In general I agree with virtually all your posts
  • Lets agree almost all car makers had to be dragged into the EV market kicking and screaming and still are
With that out of the way: Yeah right. Audi (VAG) announced 10.000 (10.000!!) layoffs this morning (50.000 German industry wide). Diesel collapsing and EV still not ready. Said the guy now happily driving a by many standards ancient ZOE. And still, still they manage, and loads and loads of people believe the "brace for when VW releases theirs" tag line. Cheap and great. My bum! ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,014 Posts
The reality is nobody actually knows what values will be in 2024. Past and current information isn't a good indication of the future. We all hope values will stay strong, but there is no guarantee.
Of course, but suggesting things will change so dramatically in the next 4 years requires some rather seismic shift. I agree with above, the possibility of a basic, lesser spec VW being released for maybe ~£25k doesn't convince me that things will change so dramatically...!

But I do hope your right! A 50kWh top spec EV like the Zoe in the second hand market for around the £12k mark would be great for EV uptake!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,192 Posts
Yeah right. Audi (VAG) announced 10.000 (10.000!!) layoffs this morning (50.000 German industry wide). Diesel collapsing and EV still not ready. Said the guy now happily driving a by many standards ancient ZOE. And still, still they manage, and loads and loads of people believe the "brace for when VW releases theirs" tag line. Cheap and great. My bum! ;)
I share your distaste for VAG but I begrudgingly accept that they are best placed to sell the EV idea to the wider marketplace over next 2 years. They have committed the budgets and hopefully will deliver on their promises. Let's see...

Although I wouldn't but a VW, I do encouraging family and friends to also consider the ID3. I don't have to let my values impact their decisions.
 
1 - 20 of 45 Posts
Top