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That's nothing to do with a second vehicle - that's just the effect of charge rate tapering. He's at around 56% SOC so 70kW is the max the battery can take at that level of charge.

See e.g. one of Bjorn's SC timelapse videos - great for finding out what the typical charge rate is at different battery levels etc:
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
... dropped to only 70kw, almost double the usual chademo rate :D
Sure, but still less than the driver wanted/expected... that's my issue here... overselling by Tesla and 'tesloids' that will harm the adoption of electric vehicles.
 

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Sure, but still less than the driver wanted/expected... that's my issue here... overselling by Tesla and 'tesloids' that will harm the adoption of electric vehicles.
No other EV can use a supercharger, so don't see how that is anyone else but Tesla's problem..?

Nice that you care enough to warn fellow Tesla owners of the generic symptoms of tapering!
 

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So question is, what charge rate did second car achieve? ~21kW like my Birmingham experience?
Well initially it would be anything from 0-50kW based on the SOC of its battery. About 5 minutes after that tweet he would have dropped to 60kW (so the other car would then get access to up to 60kW if it wanted it) and then after a further 10 minutes he'd have dropped to 50kW leaving 70kW for the other car.

Sure, but still less than the driver wanted/expected... that's my issue here... overselling by Tesla and 'tesloids' that will harm the adoption of electric vehicles.
70kW is exactly what the driver should have expected. It's the maximum rate at which you can charge a Model S when its battery is at 55%. The other car at the SC was irrelevant to his charge rate.

However I do completely agree that Tesla's marketing message of "half a charge in as little as 20 minutes" is too simplistic and creates false expectations - statements like "up to 24Mbps broadband" do precisely the same (well, actually they're worse, because at least every Model S owner can hit full speed sometimes; whereas most broadband customers will never see the advertised rate).

What do e.g. Nissan say about the speed of rapid charging a Leaf, and is it true in the real world? (that's not rhetorical; I am genuinely interested to know how they position it)
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well initially it would be anything from 0-50kW based on the SOC of its battery.
I understand the theory but do we have any evidence to support that? My experience (and that from some German drivers I met in Spain recently) is very different at ~21kW.

I keep asking for some real data from UK Tesla drivers and all you do is tell me what 'should' happen not what actually happens :rolleyes:
 

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@Kevin Sharpe I've only ever supercharged once at a site where a second car was already plugged in (in Bristol). I saw the same charge rates I would have expected if I'd been there on my own, which suggests the other car was already mostly charged (it might even have completed charging entirely) so it's hard to be sure what to infer from that.

So the simple answer is I have no first-hand experience, sorry! I'll be at the Hyatt in Birmingham tomorrow lunchtime though so fingers crossed there'll be someone else there and I can get some data. Not sure what my wife will say if I decline to go inside for lunch because I have to stay in the car and video the charging session though :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Just a reminder thas Tesla website implies charge rate is 'flat' from 0% to 80% (40 minutes). I'm not sure why we should expect a driver to know the reality is different.

image.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I'll be at the Hyatt in Birmingham tomorrow lunchtime though so fingers crossed there'll be someone else there and I can get some data. Not sure what my wife will say if I decline to go inside for lunch because I have to stay in the car and video the charging session though :)
@mgboyes be carful to avoid the transition from lunch time to tea time at that hotel because service drops off a cliff. Also allow 40 minutes if traveling in from the M5 motorway (I was in brum again recently and it was very slow).
 

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Just a reminder that the human eye / visual processing is really bad at discerning between shallow curves and straight lines, because a huge part of how vision works is about spotting patterns :)

 

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@Kevin Sharpe thanks for the tip. We'll be coming in from the M6 down the A38(M) (assuming the satnav doesn't suggest something else). Done it once before on a Friday evening and had a really easy trip. Expect this will not be nearly as pleasant, though 23/12 is such an atypical day I suspect it could go either way.

I offered my wife the choice of Northampton (with lunch at the Campanile) and Birmingham (with tea at the Hyatt) and she chose the latter!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Just a reminder that the human eye / visual processing is really bad at discerning between shallow curves and straight lines, because a huge part of how vision works is about spotting patterns :)
Correct, but just the sort of thing a judge (human) will question when they review it during the class actions... the very fact a Model S owner can question this tells you something is wrong in the data being given to customers.

Much like my experience of charging for ~1.5 hours on a Supercharger from ~50-98% the reality on the ground is very different.
 

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I will happily test the rapids if someone gives me a model S for a few weeks :p I wonder what percentage of Model S owners that live in London don't have somewhere they can park and charge?

I still think this bias towards London is unfairly skewed and would prefer to see 6 and 8 stall chargers off the motorway enabling long distance use of the Model S, its hardly Ecotricitys fault? and had Tesla not been so sneaky about it they could have shared the sites.

Locating the chargers in the middle of Birmingham and London is impractical, with a car that has a range of 250 miles the charger doesn't have to be in the city centre, seems weird to me.

I like the Model S but am loosing faith in Tesla, I was set to hit the button on one and then Kevin's issue, the lack of degradation guarantee in the warranty and now the peace-meal roll out of the superchargers is holding me back, when they start to take it seriously I will.
 

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@knoxie I (and I assume all of us here) have no idea of the details of what has gone on between Ecotricity and TM. That being the case I think it's a bit of a stretch to say "it's hardly Ecotricity's fault". I mean, on one level it's entirely their fault - they took out an injunction whose specific purpose was to prevent the rollout of superchargers at motorway service stations. Of course I am sure they felt they had legitimate grounds to do so (and a judge clearly agreed) but I don't think we can paint anyone as a completely innocent party without a lot more knowledge of the specifics. Ultimately this sort of squabbling hurts the entire EV market and it's deeply disappointing that it hasn't been resolved by now. Neither Ecotricity or Tesla look good here IMO.

Tesla have only been selling Model S's in the UK for 6 months. Today there are 19 confirmed SC sites (15 live, 2 admittedly mothballed by the Ecotricity dispute, and 2 more that have been spotted under construction). There are rumours of even more coming, of tie-ins with supermarket chains, and even TM's latest email to owners claimed that we'd see more before Christmas (though they're running out of time on this one!). That's a faster rollout of superchargers than in any country other than China. There are way more than I thought there'd be by now. And given that back in May TM were presumably expecting an effortless rollout of a largely service-station oriented network, I think the fact that they've found alternative sites in the locations they have is pretty impressive. More to do though, of course.
 
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