Speak EV - Electric Car Forums banner
1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello. I’m looking to replace a Suzuki Scross with AWD with an EV. Tried and very much liked the Kona, however the sales team tell me it has no electronic diff lock or such system (ie braking applied to a slipping wheel).

is this true? I’ve had VW/Skoda cars for a long time before the Suzuki which have all have electronic diff lock for forever, as does the Scross.

I can probably cope without 4x4 but I do worry about a completely open diff as I can easily get stuck in muddy passing bays in winter where I live without any lock.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
As it’s summer here at the moment it’s difficult to find such circumstances. I had a VRS that would use the brakes to shift torque on cornering to avoid roasting the inside tyre, however most systems do not do that so it’s harder to replicate.

I see a lot of posts over the net about the Kona getting stuck on slippery inclines which seems to support the completely open diff scenario.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,466 Posts
We live in a rural area, where 4WD is a big advantage in winter, not so much for off-road driving, but because very muddy (as in inches of mud) wet lanes, and particularly passing places, can be more challenging than driving across fields. Very muddy passing places are often a serious problem, as the nearside wheels can have virtually no grip, yet the offside wheels may well still be on tarmac.

I've had two 4WD EVs, a Tesla Model 3 LR and now a Jaguar I-Pace. Both handle the above situation well, mainly because of the progressive accelerator control as much as anything else, I think. The Tesla would often spin one of the nearside wheels a bit, the Jaguar doesn't seem to do this at all. Not sure why, but it does feel as if whatever independent wheel brake application system it uses to stop this is a bit better tuned for low speed wheel slip prevention. AFAIK, neither had LSDs, maybe just independent wheel braking to try and limit one driven wheel from spinning too fast relative to the others.

This seems to be a fairly common feature on cars now, so perhaps worth testing a few to see how they cope. I know from having got my old Mercedes SLK stuck in a very muddy passing place once, for just this reason, that it can be a PITA when it happens.
 

·
Registered
Nissan LEAF30
Joined
·
8,469 Posts
Your usage is very much an edge case and not currently supported by small affordable EVs.
I see a lot of posts over the net about the Kona getting stuck on slippery inclines which seems to support the completely open diff scenario.
But as you are no doubt aware it is the tyre choice that makes the biggest difference to off-road traction so perhaps you need to consider the choice of tyres. I've seen plenty of Range Roonies get stuck on wet grassy slopes that I had no problems with my LEAF, and came closest to getting stuck in a 3WD STi Subaru with an open front diff but wide road tyres where even with the rear wheels going at the desired speed there was a lack of grip.
 

·
Registered
Renault Zoe 50
Joined
·
23,566 Posts
As it’s summer here at the moment it’s difficult to find such circumstances. I had a VRS that would use the brakes to shift torque on cornering to avoid roasting the inside tyre, however most systems do not do that so it’s harder to replicate.

I see a lot of posts over the net about the Kona getting stuck on slippery inclines which seems to support the completely open diff scenario.
Electric motors have different control systems and can control the power much better.

I didn’t have much problem driving the Zoe in mud, when other ICE we’re getting stuck.

I wouldn’t put all your faith in diff locks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Very muddy passing places are often a serious problem, as the nearside wheels can have virtually no grip, yet the offside wheels may well still be on tarmac.
This is the exact scenario, and every VAG group car with auto or DSG has had EDL for probably two decades, including the <£10k Fabia when so equipped. So it’s a concern for me.

maybe I need to make up one of those roller sets and take it with me to test drives! It’s surprising that manufacturers don’t seem to mention (or maybe include) such a useful feature.

The Jag unfortunately is well outside of my price range.
 

·
Registered
Mercedes EQC 400 4matic on order
Joined
·
245 Posts
We live in a rural area, where 4WD is a big advantage in winter, not so much for off-road driving, but because very muddy (as in inches of mud) wet lanes, and particularly passing places, can be more challenging than driving across fields. Very muddy passing places are often a serious problem, as the nearside wheels can have virtually no grip, yet the offside wheels may well still be on tarmac.

I've had two 4WD EVs, a Tesla Model 3 LR and now a Jaguar I-Pace. Both handle the above situation well, mainly because of the progressive accelerator control as much as anything else, I think. The Tesla would often spin one of the nearside wheels a bit, the Jaguar doesn't seem to do this at all. Not sure why, but it does feel as if whatever independent wheel brake application system it uses to stop this is a bit better tuned for low speed wheel slip prevention. AFAIK, neither had LSDs, maybe just independent wheel braking to try and limit one driven wheel from spinning too fast relative to the others.

This seems to be a fairly common feature on cars now, so perhaps worth testing a few to see how they cope. I know from having got my old Mercedes SLK stuck in a very muddy passing place once, for just this reason, that it can be a PITA when it happens.
Exactly why I will never buy a RWD only Mercedes living like you in the country with narrow lanes. Tractors take no prisoners around here! Hence why the only choice for me at the end of my lease was an EQC as Mercedes France do not sell a 4WD eclass hybrid estate. The new EQE is supposedly going to have a 4WD option so I hope to get back into the e class in the future but time will tell. I need the load length of the e which the EQC is just a bit short on but hope it will be bearable for 18mths.
 

·
Registered
GOLF GTE PHEV
Joined
·
3,851 Posts
Hello. I’m looking to replace a Suzuki Scross with AWD with an EV. Tried and very much liked the Kona, however the sales team tell me it has no electronic diff lock or such system (ie braking applied to a slipping wheel).

is this true? I’ve had VW/Skoda cars for a long time before the Suzuki which have all have electronic diff lock for forever, as does the Scross.

I can probably cope without 4x4 but I do worry about a completely open diff as I can easily get stuck in muddy passing bays in winter where I live without any lock.
What you describe is what Ford call Torque Vectoring and Alfa, an E-diff. They work well enough and my Guilietta climbed an icy steep single track Highland road much to my surprise. I just held the accelerator still and let the electronics do the work. I never found a need for a manual override. Just leave the electronics to it and be gentle.

Quite why EV's don't implement this is a puzzle: my Leaf has traction control but no E-diff. On the other hand I had no problems on the hilly single track roads (which are never gritted) on icy days in February due to the very smooth and gentle power delivery.

Impatient drivers get stuck first!;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: JP99
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top