Solar quote

8868 Views 72 Replies 17 Participants Last post by Zarni, Sep 22, 2021

Coe123

Discussion Starter · Apr 29, 2021

I got a quote through SolarTogether and sort of assumed it is a good quote. It is part of a group buying scheme by the council, I thought it is probably as good a value I am going to get - plus a vetted supplier. But I have had some great responses to my other question and somebody pointed me to a Youtube channel "The EV Puzzle", where Nigel talks about a 14 panels system costing only £4K in the video from earlier this month. The quote now doesn't seem good at all, so I thought what people think.

The installer has quoted nearly £3.7k for 8 panels (includes everything incl. installation over slate tiles) and jumps to £4.3k for 10 panels. There is a quote for battery too but I am not keen on getting that just now.

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Hermit Dave

· #21 · Apr 29, 2021

Ultron said:
Trust me no way an installer ( the two blokes that actually go on the roof and do the nuts and bolts) is going to work from one of those. If they fall they are in trouble.

I did small single install on kitchen extension last year. Height wasn’t an issue as it’s single storey - but not sure about doing out on main roof. Was trying to rope a roofer who wasn’t interested

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Coe123

Discussion Starter · #22 · Apr 29, 2021

Johnny Read said:
Why no upload a photo just showing your roof+orientation and get some more feedback from here...

Here is the photo of the roof. It is 30 degrees west to south facing. The length 5.5m is purely an approximation on my part, the entire length of the house is just over 8m and width is 6m (5.8m is allowing for Chimney etc). This is in N.E. London

I need to get repointing done for the entire back section so looking to set-up scaffolding anyway, looking to do this together.

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Zarni

· #23 · Apr 29, 2021

Blimey, panels are getting damn cheap these days.
Just so you can feel smug about getting a good price I paid around £11.5k for my 3.5kW array of 12 panels.

To claw back some smugness, that was over 9 years ago though so I get the top FIT rates

Reactions: 3

Johnny Read

· #24 · Apr 29, 2021

If my understanding of your photo is correct, you'll have a fair whack of shading off that chimney. Is it shared with the neighbour? If it's not in use, why not suggest to have it taken down before you commence on PV. If you directly contract the scaffolding, then you won't be beholden to asking for a favour from the PV installer. You'll win on no shading, reduce your heat loss, and avoid future issues with water ingress around the flashing. Just a thought.

Reactions: 2

James Watson

· #25 · Apr 29, 2021

Was thinking the same re the chimney and shading.

we paid £6,200 in Sep 19 for a 6.2kW system. Q cells and Solis inverter. Carbon Legacy. Unshaded south facing so no optimisers. 18 panels.

SuperLeaf

· #26 · Apr 29, 2021

IF you're interested in my input:

Why only 8 panels on such a big roof?
I wouldn't bother for 8 panels, but go straight to 12 or up to 15 panels.

Can you charge your EV in a garage?
If so, I'd even put panels on the ESE 120 facing roof.

Why not put a couple on the garden shed as well?

The chimney is not a biggie, that's where you work around. In the summer the sun shines high, so you'll only have shade in the morning but you'll have the sun the rest of the day.

Also, I suggest to have a look at

Your Longi 360Wp panels are really only 300Wp equivalent of a better brand panel.
A better brand panel will last you a lifetime.
The Chinese stuff, who knows how long they'll last and if they'll be around to honor warranties.

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cah197

· #27 · Apr 30, 2021

SuperLeaf said:
The Chinese stuff, who knows how long they'll last and if they'll be around to honor warranties.

Your phone is probably made in China.

Please take your prejudices somewhere else.

James Watson

· #28 · Apr 30, 2021

When I got mine I went for Chinese stuff. Our roof is large and no need to pay double for the highest yielding panels. Same for inverters, the brand leaders can be twice the price. We all know the inverters will last 10 years give or take so why pay more unless there is a specific need like shading. Under SEG the payback is bad enough, without making the payback time years more. The Chinese stuff has a 10 year warranty and they are massive companies. Our Solis inverter actually failed several months after install. The solar company said that if an inverter is bad they fail quickly like this. Despite being “Chinese” it was swapped for free in under a week.

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cah197

· #29 · Apr 30, 2021

76% of solar cells are made in China, with most of the rest in the Far East.

www.statista.com

Regional distribution of solar PV cells production | Statista

In 2021, China was the leading country in terms of solar photovoltaics cell production, with a share of 81.2 percent worldwide.

www.statista.com

You'll probably find that the 0.2% made in Europe is for very specialised applications, such as space - so won't be used for domestic applications.

If you buy 'Italian' panels, you'll probably find that's just where they undergo final assembly and checking. They also add their sticker. But the cells will be from China.

Incidentally I called customer support for my Huawei Inverter and they were very good - I think the chap was in Romania.

Now LG support is out of Germany and is terrible. I'm still waiting for a battery system that works from LG!

Reactions: 1

RunningStrong

· #30 · Apr 30, 2021

cah197 said:
Your phone is probably made in China.

Please take your prejudices somewhere else.

It's not a prejudice. There's growing evidence that the supply chain for solar panels is routed in forced labour camps in Xinjiang.

However, due to the nature of polysilicon, it's quite possible that a panel made entirely outside of China still receives its raw goods from Xinjiang.

www.theguardian.com

Revealed: UK solar projects using panels from firms linked to Xinjiang forced labour

Investigation finds up to 40% of UK solar farms were built using panels from leading Chinese companies

www.theguardian.com

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cah197

· #31 · Apr 30, 2021

RunningStrong said:
It's not a prejudice. There's growing evidence that the supply chain for solar panels is routed in forced labour camps in Xinjiang.

But that's not what was stated.

In any case, see my previous post.

But be careful where you throw stones as silicon runs your computers and mobile phones. Or stating that anyone with a diamond ring support African child labour.

SuperLeaf

· #32 · Apr 30, 2021 (Edited)

It's not about where it's made, but where it was developed and which companies are behind them.

The cost of the panel is a fraction of the install cost, from 1/6th to 1/4th of the total cost of an install.
For instance, at wholesale, a Longi 370Wp panel costs less than £100 each.
For your reference: Panneau solaire 370W - MONO - Demi cellules - Longi

So it's worth considering a better panel with 25 years of warranty, labor included.
Also, as in the above video, it's important that the warranty is measured on each panel's performance rather than on an entire array, as a bad panel can be compensated by the rest of the array.

The higher output of a better panel more than makes up for the cost difference.
It will offer less degradation over the years.

What I'm saying is that there are great chances that a Chinese panel will put more money in your installer's pocket for no added benefits to you.
If it saves you big money compared to one of the best brands, then it may be worth considering, but you'll find out that a lot of the Chinese panels are priced at almost the same level as the better brands.
Saving 10% for 20% less output is just not smart.

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Trevor Larkum

· #33 · Apr 30, 2021

Ultron said:
I paid £6k in Feb 2019 for 14 high end 300w Italian panels and a "Solar Edge" Optimiser system that deals with a tiny shading issue in high summer, but is very very efficient. And this still in the FIT Era.

Contact Tanjent Solar , @Trevor Larkum runs it along with another great guy Jason. They did an excellent job for me. If you want a basic 4kw panels / invertor system not high end fancy i suspect they will get close to £4k now and certainly should be able to beat £3.7k for just 8 panels.

Solar & Battery Installed Together - Tanjent Energy (tanjent-energy.com)

I'm sure Trev will be along to say hi too.

Thanks @Ultron for the kind words! Yes @Coe123 we'd be very happy to give you a free quote to compare with what you've got, just click on that link. Our quotes include a full breakdown of every single component with individual prices so there's nothing hidden. And just FYI, our standard pricing for scaffolding is £660, though of course complex roofing arrangements will cost more.

Reactions: 2

cah197

· #34 · Apr 30, 2021

SuperLeaf said:
For your reference: Panneau solaire 370W - MONO - Demi cellules - Longi

Thanks for the link.

I'm slightly confused by your comments, as this link is for a Chinese manufacturer solar panel, developed by a Chinese company (Longi).

James Watson

· #35 · Apr 30, 2021

SuperLeaf said:
It's not about where it's made, but where it was developed and which companies are behind them.

The cost of the panel is a fraction of the install cost, from 1/6th to 1/4th of the total cost of an install.
For instance, at wholesale, a Longi 370Wp panel costs less than £100 each.
For your reference: Panneau solaire 370W - MONO - Demi cellules - Longi

So it's worth considering a better panel with 25 years of warranty, labor included.
Also, as in the above video, it's important that the warranty is measured on each panel's performance rather than on an entire array, as a bad panel can be compensated by the rest of the array.

The higher output of a better panel more than makes up for the cost difference.
It will offer less degradation over the years.

What I'm saying is that there are great chances that a Chinese panel will put more money in your installer's pocket for no added benefits to you.
If it saves you big money compared to one of the best brands, then it may be worth considering, but you'll find out that a lot of the Chinese panels are priced at almost the same level as the better brands.
Saving 10% for 20% less output is just not smart.

I can only go on the quotes I had but to have top quality panels with the highest yield and 25 year warranty, and a german inverter, was close to £9,000, so almost £3,000 more than I paid for the Q Cells and Solis. That £3,000 would probably be better off going towards a home battery. If I do get a bad panel in 10-15 years time, I would hope it would cost less than £3000 to get put right. £3,000 is an expensive extended warranty.

Coe123

Discussion Starter · #36 · Apr 30, 2021

Thank you all, lot of useful inputs.

@Johnny Read & @James Watson - Yes, the chimney can be removed, but I would rather not turn this into a big project, considering I am unlikely to be living here in 6 years time. I'll ask the builder when I get the repointing quotes but I suspect it is going to need a survey and neighbour to be onboard. I would rather not remove it unless it makes a huge difference

@SuperLeaf Longevity is not a biggest concern for me. Doesn't mean I'll go with the cheapest I can find, but good video above for things to ask the installers about. We do have Chinese to thank about scaling the solar and bringing down the costs for everyone (even without the labour issues)

@Trevor Larkum Thank you, I've sent a request yesterday, I liked some of the pictures you have shared on some of the other related post which came up at the bottom - your projects look good. Any thoughts on the number of panels, chimney (keep/remove),

@Hermit Dave We are at home all the time (work from for past 10 years) and can use most of what we produce during the day as our needs are limited. I'll have to weigh in the battery spend to see if that will make much difference - one thing for sure, it would mean we live off grid for most part of the year.

@cah197 Yes, will go for as many panels as possible, thanks for your inputs - I am now considering couple of panels on the east facing (smaller) roof too - I reckon I could do 14 altogether but only the survey can tell if I am correct.

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Leonids

· #37 · Apr 30, 2021

I've been looking at near-500W panels...

Product not found!

www.bimblesolar.com

And wondering if it's sensible to replace my 16x250W panels installed five years ago, when 4kWp was all you could install to keep within the highest paying FIT band.

Although the 500W panels are physically bigger, I've worked out I can squeeze in 24 panels on both aspects (east/west).

That would give me 12kWp to replace 4kWp!

Assuming the DNO and FIT supplier agree...

Hermit Dave

· #38 · Apr 30, 2021

roger davis said:
I've been looking at near-500W panels...

Product not found!

www.bimblesolar.com

And wondering if it's sensible to replace my 16x250W panels installed five years ago, when 4kWp was all you could install to keep within the highest paying FIT band.

Although the 500W panels are physically bigger, I've worked out I can squeeze in 24 panels on both aspects (east/west).

That would give me 12kWp to replace 4kWp!

Assuming the DNO and FIT supplier agree...

And here I was installing 7 year old 245W used panels

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

James Watson

· #39 · Apr 30, 2021

Wouldn’t you lose the FIT if you replaced the panels for higher yield ones. Not only as over 4kW but they might consider it a big enough component to no longer be considered the original installation.

James Watson

· #40 · Apr 30, 2021

Coe123 said:
Thank you all, lot of useful inputs.

@Johnny Read & @James Watson - Yes, the chimney can be removed, but I would rather not turn this into a big project, considering I am unlikely to be living here in 6 years time. I'll ask the builder when I get the repointing quotes but I suspect it is going to need a survey and neighbour to be onboard. I would rather not remove it unless it makes a huge difference

@SuperLeaf Longevity is not a biggest concern for me. Doesn't mean I'll go with the cheapest I can find, but good video above for things to ask the installers about. We do have Chinese to thank about scaling the solar and bringing down the costs for everyone (even without the labour issues)

@Trevor Larkum Thank you, I've sent a request yesterday, I liked some of the pictures you have shared on some of the other related post which came up at the bottom - your projects look good. Any thoughts on the number of panels, chimney (keep/remove),

@Hermit Dave We are at home all the time (work from for past 10 years) and can use most of what we produce during the day as our needs are limited. I'll have to weigh in the battery spend to see if that will make much difference - one thing for sure, it would mean we live off grid for most part of the year.

@cah197 Yes, will go for as many panels as possible, thanks for your inputs - I am now considering couple of panels on the east facing (smaller) roof too - I reckon I could do 14 altogether but only the survey can tell if I am correct.

If you plan to only be at the house for 6 years or less, is it worth doing? Not sure there will be a payback in that time, and debatable whether they will add enough to the house price to cover the costs of installing them.

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