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Has the Battery day passed SpeakEV by ?

Looks very good 1/2 price batteries and a £25,000 Tesla coming. Trouble is it's 3 years away. Or is this just reverse Tesla time AKA underpromise and over deliver.

 

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The threat of a $25,000 car is enough for other auto makers to start a countdown timer, as they know they've now got less than that to make a better car, with better infrastructure before they start haemorrhaging sales to Tesla in that price segment. $25,000 ~€21,300 makes it Zoe territory, I know what I'd chose if I was looking in a few years, which I am sure lots of folk will be.
 

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The threat of a $25,000 car is enough for other auto makers to start a countdown timer, as they know they've now got less than that to make a better car, with better infrastructure before they start haemorrhaging sales to Tesla in that price segment. $25,000 ~€21,300 makes it Zoe territory, I know what I'd chose if I was looking in a few years, which I am sure lots of folk will be.
Not sure you can convert the US price to euro / sterling and make assumptions - doesn’t the Model 3 start at $35,000 in the USA?

It would certainly be disruptive though as per usual. Cheaper entry to the Supercharger club :unsure:
 

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He confirmed the Cybertruck is going to be smaller in Europe :(

I want a full sized 6 seater pickup to rival the pig ugly ford transit ones!
 

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Not sure you can convert the US price to euro / sterling and make assumptions - doesn’t the Model 3 start at $35,000 in the USA?

It would certainly be disruptive though as per usual. Cheaper entry to the Supercharger club :unsure:
Nope $38k plus tax (VAT etc). The $35k + tax version is only available on request in the US and not on their website to order.
 

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Not sure you can convert the US price to euro / sterling and make assumptions - doesn’t the Model 3 start at $35,000 in the USA?
Yep, that's right. You have to add VAT, convert to GBP and add a little for transport. But this will probably be builtin Berlin (or somewhere in EU).

So wild arse guess would be somewhere around £24k-£25k for base spec.

I'd say the other manufacturers should be worried, but frankly we need all the EVs they can make. It will just mean there's a shortage of Teslas and high resale values.
 

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Has the Battery day passed SpeakEV by ?

Looks very good 1/2 price batteries and a £25,000 Tesla coming. Trouble is it's 3 years away. Or is this just reverse Tesla time AKA underpromise and over deliver.

$25000 Car. With production in Germany or China and zero import tarriffs should be £19500. Doesn't mention taxes though, with 20% VAT should be £23500 OTR , or less
 

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The threat of a $25,000 car is enough for other auto makers to start a countdown timer, as they know they've now got less than that to make a better car, with better infrastructure before they start haemorrhaging sales to Tesla in that price segment. $25,000 ~€21,300 makes it Zoe territory, I know what I'd chose if I was looking in a few years, which I am sure lots of folk will be.
Yep. was shocked with the new Vauxhall Mokka BEV price. Petrol version £20k RRP , BEV £30k AFTER £3.5k PICG, so really £33.5k RRP. £13.5k more than an ICE. This is what happens when you haven;t invested heavily in your own battery production.
 

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Not sure you can convert the US price to euro / sterling and make assumptions - doesn’t the Model 3 start at $35,000 in the USA?

It would certainly be disruptive though as per usual. Cheaper entry to the Supercharger club :unsure:
Erm, I converted it to Euro's as that is where the factory that build them will be.
 

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Haven't legacy manufacturers been selling at that price point for ages?

This is I suppose for people who want teslas at that price point.

Price aside the innovation is phenomenal. The sheer engineering effort is absolutely mind boggling.
 

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Haven't legacy manufacturers been selling at that price point for ages?

This is I suppose for people who want teslas at that price point.

Price aside the innovation is phenomenal. The sheer engineering effort is absolutely mind boggling.
Yes but when much higher running costs than EVs
 

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V interesting talk, well worth skimming through on youtube.

What impressed me was the scope of their improvements, right from the mining, through mfr & the recycling at the very end. There's a coherent vision here, and the drive to achieve it. Lowering the cost of batteries to around half what it is today is really going to accelerate takeup on a huge scale, not just cars, but ships, Grid backups, domestic batteries, planes, trains, you name it.

E.g take the simple way that the single connection tab on current batteries is dispensed with, and replaced by an almost continuous set of edge-tabs all folded over; this is going to hugely reduce thermal losses inside the batteries, both during driving, but especially during charging. So I think we can expect to see far faster charging on even small batteries. Today we're seeing e.g. 40 kWh batteries being limited to 50 kW, that kind of thing; Ioniq 28 kWh charging at around 70 kW is exceptionally fast! But I think we'll see these new batteries charging a 50 kWh at maybe 250 kW. Leafgate thermal problems are going to be a thing of the past and just a bad memory.

Even their new way of extracting Lithium is impressive, assuming it scales up to industrial rates. Simply take Lithium-rich clay, mix with salty water & out comes the useable Lithium compound, at least that's how it looked to me. Sure there's need to be some purification etc. Elon says it's important for low cost to have the battery production v close to the source of the raw materials, and that makes sense to me. Doesn't bode well for the new Lithium mine dev't in Cornwall though, unless they can do a similar extraction & maybe source Nickel locally?
 

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Thermal management will be a much smaller issue than today, leading to cheaper cars.

I like the idea of making the battery a structural component too. And the reduction in wasteful manufacturing processes was just outstanding, I wish more manufacturers took the time to do this sort of thing.

Still, it wasn't clear what they were measuring the improvements against tho. Per cell, per pack, per kg?

Elon, not looking his best and still can't just let the expert in the room talk without interrupting. Also, the Plaid thing was clearly a jab at Lucid...
 

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The threat of a $25,000 car is enough for other auto makers to start a countdown timer, as they know they've now got less than that to make a better car, with better infrastructure before they start haemorrhaging sales to Tesla in that price segment. $25,000 ~€21,300 makes it Zoe territory, I know what I'd chose if I was looking in a few years, which I am sure lots of folk will be.
Only if Tesla can hit that price and produce it in high volumes. The $35,000 standard range Model 3 was quietly dropped at launch and even though that model has been in production for 3 years now, with the associated reduction in battery costs, there's still no sign of when it will arrive.

Given Tesla's claimed lead in battery technology and production costs, so far its actually the existing manufacturers which have a better record of launching affordable EVs. That may be smart, Tesla maximising its profits by selling premium models at premium prices, but it hasn't yet demonstrated its ability to produce high volume, low cost cars.
 

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Only if Tesla can hit that price and produce it in high volumes. The $35,000 standard range Model 3 was quietly dropped at launch and even though that model has been in production for 3 years now, with the associated reduction in battery costs, there's still no sign of when it will arrive.
Completely agree. I'm sure any saving in battery costs will be splurged on Auto Pilot hardware!
 

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Only if Tesla can hit that price and produce it in high volumes. The $35,000 standard range Model 3 was quietly dropped at launch and even though that model has been in production for 3 years now, with the associated reduction in battery costs, there's still no sign of when it will arrive.

Given Tesla's claimed lead in battery technology and production costs, so far its actually the existing manufacturers which have a better record of launching affordable EVs. That may be smart, Tesla maximising its profits by selling premium models at premium prices, but it hasn't yet demonstrated its ability to produce high volume, low cost cars.
The $35k M3 is available in the US by request. Their overall volumes will hit 500k this year.
 

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Only if Tesla can hit that price and produce it in high volumes. The $35,000 standard range Model 3 was quietly dropped at launch and even though that model has been in production for 3 years now, with the associated reduction in battery costs, there's still no sign of when it will arrive.

Given Tesla's claimed lead in battery technology and production costs, so far its actually the existing manufacturers which have a better record of launching affordable EVs. That may be smart, Tesla maximising its profits by selling premium models at premium prices, but it hasn't yet demonstrated its ability to produce high volume, low cost cars.
Elon stated for now they need to increase profitability as they are only running at 1% net. And as far as their car business goes, Tesla don't have the old, sell the car at a loss, and make profits on servicing, spares and parts of legacy ICE. You have to remember servicing on a Tesla is entirely optional, it wont affect any warranty claims. No Legacy ICE company offers this for their EV's. You still have to pay for a wasted service every year / XXX miles and cough up £150-£200+. I hate this about my 40kw leaf. They kick the tyres and say, computer says all is fine. A £20 1/2 hr on a ram drive though inspection is al that is needed. Don't service your BEV with legacy ICE, have a rare major fault 18 months in, sorry, claim void you didn't service they car so the fault is yours. Here is a bill for £10k.

So Telsa actually make their operating profit on the sale of the car. Hence why you will see a $25k model but probably not lower.

Legacy ICE just cant follow this model. Yes they will sell you a £15k BEV, but you will be locked in for 8 years of stealership servicing to maintain the battery warranty. A $25k Tesla will have a overall cheaper TCO.
 
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