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Discussion Starter #1
Tesla touchscreen wiper controls land driver with fine after crash.

Tesla's touchscreen car controls should be treated as a distracting electronic device, a German court has decided.
A driver found himself facing a road ban after being involved in a crash in the rain.
The Tesla automatically started its wipers - but manually controlling the speed was done through the large central touchscreen, rather than a lever on the steering wheel.
The driver was punished under the same rules as using a phone while driving.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53666222

Always wondered how car manufacturers thought they would get around the common mobile/touch screen law now in many countries??
 

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We’ve done this to death.

The driver got sentenced because he crashed the car. He tried to blame it on the controls.

It’s about the same as saying ‘I crashed because I was trying to tune the radio’.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
It is nothing remotely the same. turning a radio knob isn't against the law; operating a touch screen is.
So, the charge(s) will probably be different - perhaps undue care an attention for both plus operating distracting electronic device for the second.
 

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turning a radio knob isn't against the law; operating a touch screen is.
I can't speak for your 5 year old golf, but a lot of new cars have touch screen radios.

(Or rather they have a multifunction touch screen console that includes the audio system.)
 

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2020 BMW i3S 120Ah BEV
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Touch screens in cars is a dumb idea, no question, and it's one of the things I really like about the i3 that it doesn't have one, and in fact it has lots and lots of differently shaped and textured buttons to use for each function, all easy to find blind. The world likes touch screens though because they're cheap.
 

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It is nothing remotely the same. turning a radio knob isn't against the law; operating a touch screen is.
So, the charge(s) will probably be different - perhaps undue care an attention for both plus operating distracting electronic device for the second.
You could still be prosecuted for ‘turning your radio knob’ if that was deemed a factor in your crash.

Whatever interface your car uses for vital functions, and however good or bad you think the implementation of them is, it’s still up to you as the driver to operate them in a way that doesn’t endanger yourself or others.

Driving is one of the most skilled activities that most people undertake, I think it was mentioned in the other thread that’s it’s just pushing a screen instead of a button, not deep menu diving, so shouldn’t be beyond most ordinary people.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
My Golf multi display is knobs, single push buttons and touchscreen. Radio presets easy to spot on radio screen. Don't have to delve into menus. And when I do have to, I'm well aware it is a seriously bad idea, completely unsafe and dangerous.
Perhaps when manufacturers start getting unhappy customers with criminal records, they might have a rethink.
 

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You could still be prosecuted for ‘turning your radio knob’ if that was deemed a factor in your crash.
You can't - I'm pretty certain it isn't against any law to turn a knob. It might be an additional factor to support undue care and attention or similar charge.
 

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You can't - I'm pretty certain it isn't against any law to turn a knob. It might be an additional factor to support undue care and attention or similar charge.
Are you saying it is against the law to use a touch screen when driving? If so I'd very much like you to tell us which law exactly that is?
 

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You can't - I'm pretty certain it isn't against any law to turn a knob. It might be an additional factor to support undue care and attention or similar charge.
Which is exactly what the German driver has been prosecuted for, eg doing something distracting in the car when he should have been concentrating on not crashing.

Just because he claimed the windscreen wiper interface was complex as a defence doesn’t mean it’s true.

Have you actually driven a Tesla and used the wipers?
 

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Well, I was going to bring up that some cars control the headlights by a knob by the steering wheel rather than on the stalks, so would require you taking a hand off the steering wheel to operate and I would class that an essential operation (I know gear changes are as well, but I mean more in this context). The touchscreen thing in the Tesla has always been a critism of mine. My personal preference is that touchscreen should be limited to the multi-display; it shouldn't be for stuff like the climate control.
 

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My Golf multi display is knobs, single push buttons and touchscreen. Radio presets easy to spot on radio screen. Don't have to delve into menus. And when I do have to, I'm well aware it is a seriously bad idea, completely unsafe and dangerous.
Perhaps when manufacturers start getting unhappy customers with criminal records, they might have a rethink.
Because the radios and controls of the past with all the tiny buttons where much better?
 

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My Golf multi display is knobs, single push buttons and touchscreen. Radio presets easy to spot on radio screen. Don't have to delve into menus. And when I do have to, I'm well aware it is a seriously bad idea, completely unsafe and dangerous.
Perhaps when manufacturers start getting unhappy customers with criminal records, they might have a rethink.
No knobs in site on my 2018 egolf entertainment unit (discover pro?), its all touch screen. Are you saying its illegal to change my volume?
 

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The difference between a radios controls and wiper controls is that you can tune a radio control at your own time during a safer part of a road, where as wiper controls generally need to be done at a specific moment in time which may not be an ideally safe moment when driving i.e. Coming up to congestion or junctions and visibility is impaired.
 

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The difference between a radios controls and wiper controls is that you can tune a radio control at your own time during a safer part of a road, where as wiper controls generally need to be done at a specific moment in time which may not be an ideally safe moment when driving i.e. Coming up to congestion or junctions and visibility is impaired.
In that scenario the wiper button on the end of the indicator stalk is used.
 

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In that scenario the wiper button on the end of the indicator stalk is used.
This is what I like with Mercedes and by extension Tesla's wiper button.

On most other car, you can change frequency setting with the stalk. But that is a pointless setting to put on the stalk, it's supposed to be a set and forget setting. What is important is when I just want a wipe right now. To do that on most cars with wiper stalk, you have to change to 1 speed higher and change back, totally pointless and distracting. On Merc and Tesla, it's a single press on the left stalk.
 

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On most other car, you can change frequency setting with the stalk. But that is a pointless setting to put on the stalk, it's supposed to be a set and forget setting. What is important is when I just want a wipe right now. To do that on most cars with wiper stalk, you have to change to 1 speed higher and change back, totally pointless and distracting. On Merc and Tesla, it's a single press on the left stalk.
I’m not sure about most cars, but everything I can remember driving for years always had an easy way to get an instant wipe.

On the VAG group cars, frequency/sensitivity is a wheel atop the right stalk, push down for an on command wipe.

However you have to do it, it’s only remotely distracting if you haven’t bothered to educate yourself on your cars basic functions.

If anybody struggles with such basic controls, they probably shouldn’t be driving.

The guy in the OP had a crash, of his own making, and when trying to excuse himself said ‘but look, screen etc’...
 

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You can't - I'm pretty certain it isn't against any law to turn a knob. It might be an additional factor to support undue care and attention or similar charge.
Exactly. It's not against the law in itself but if you're doing it when you have an accident you're in trouble. The guy who crashed into the back of my dad's car a decade ago was charged with dangerous driving because he admitted he was distracted due to operating his radio controls at the time. No touch controls there, good old fashioned knobs.
 
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