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I'm a relatively new Leaf40 owner but I've obviously read up on battery tech. I had an interesting run in with a old Leaf24 or 30 owner who appeared at the Nissan dealership for a charge a few minutes before me. I noticed that this person start the charge at 49% and therefore I thought it would be relatively quick before I did a rapid charge (I was on 14%)

SEVENTY minutes later I ask if this person if they have finished ... oh no, they are just at 91%. I then told them that for the charging speed they were getting they'd be better to use the adjacent 7kW as they are on trickle charge now (or their battery is in really poor shape)

Needless to say, she (sorry - I can't be THAT politically correct any longer) refused to give way as she wanted 100%. I drove away.

Had the roles been reversed I would have given way at 80% and trickle charged / finessed the battery at home.
 

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Here we go again, hard hats on!

You're probably right, it would have been a sensible swap but you can't insist on someone surrendering the charger they are on for your benefit. Not everybody understands or cares to understand the technical details involved so they may just have been thinking, "yeah right, pull the other one mate!"

Just put it down to experience, it'll happen from time to time when you drive an EV, enjoy the drive and lose more stress than you gain. The general rule is when you've had enough, move on but like so many things in life, there are people who want more than their fair share and don't give a damn about anyone else.
 

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Thanks @Gif . No accounting for decency it seems.

@JeffG I didn't see, but it MUST have been less if she trickling past seventy minutes .... even on a 30kW Leaf.

I've had an ignorant taxi driver once fail to tell me he had finished charging, but this woman was ignorant on many levels. Perhaps the solution is for dealerships to invest in more chargers !
 

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I popped into Cherwell today and hooked up to the CCS and went inside to catch up on some web stuff and after about 30 mins I spotted a parking up on the other CHAdeMO/AC pump so I went out to relinquish the CCS/CHAdeMO that was on FV but when I got back to the car an Outie had pulled up on the other side of me obviously waiting for me to finish so I couldn't give it to the Leaf, anyway had a bit of a chat with the Leaf driver then disconnected so the Outie probably waited about 10mins before he could jump on.

My question, is it really worth spending time on a charger and why would you wait to get on a charger in the first place, I am aware they do something like 166 MPG but my i3 is still using the fuel I put in last June/July so I must be into the 1000's MPG:rolleyes:
 

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Another reason for no chargers to be free, as it just encourages this sort of thing, as people think they're entitled to as much free stuff as they can get.
 

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My local dealer has a customer who parks her Leaf there every day, hogging one of their 7kW units. I guess she is perfectly in her rights to utilise the 'free charging' at Nissan, but its a rather selfish attitude
 

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They should configure the charger to cut out at 80% and refuse to charge over that level. I seem to recall Ecotricity ones were like that some time back, they would cut out around the 80-85% mark. Really helped with abandoned Leafs at IKEA.
 

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My local dealer has a customer who parks her Leaf there every day, hogging one of their 7kW units. I guess she is perfectly in her rights to utilise the 'free charging' at Nissan, but its a rather selfish attitude
I am sure Nissan have a "fair use" in their T&Cs so they could probably deny her if they chose to.
 

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They should configure the charger to cut out at 80% and refuse to charge over that level. I seem to recall Ecotricity ones were like that some time back, they would cut out around the 80-85% mark. Really helped with abandoned Leafs at IKEA.
The thing is that my 24kWh e-NV200 can still be pulling a decent amount at 80-85% and on long journeys I usually need to get to 90% to get to my next charging stop, I usually get to around 95% in 45 minutes from flat.

Rapids really aren’t suited to ikeas, and never were, the use case would better suit a load of 7kW posts that people can abandon their cars on for a couple of hours while they navigate the maze.

People should be considerate of other users and only charge to a level they need to continue their journey. I’ll hapily move off a free vend charger if I have enough to continue my journey, but will stay the full 45 minutes on an EH pump if I need to get those few extra kWh.
 

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Treat rapid charger like petrol stations. Turn over speed is of essence. If your charging speed has slowed to a crawl, vacate if there's people waiting.

It's that simple.


Different battery and cars have different percentage where charging speed tapers. I think a very simple solution is to have auto cut-off and auto cable unlock on rapid charger (after all, the cable belongs to the charger), slower than 8kW? The rapid stall ends your session, releases the cable.

(of course, must place 32amp Type 2 sockets nearby, if sessions has ended that way, rapid should display instruction to use those 32amp chargers for the uninformed)



Edit: the underlined way of rapid charger cut-off/unlock also solved the PHEV misuse problem, plus educates the drivers. 3 birds with 1 stone!
 

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The problem around here is that the sales staff don't explain charging to outie owners. I fear they don't know what they are selling so are unable to pass on the info! Why does an outie need a Chademo anyway?
 

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The problem around here is that the sales staff don't explain charging to outie owners. I fear they don't know what they are selling so are unable to pass on the info! Why does an outie need a Chademo anyway?
Are you saying you don’t want Outlander PHEVs using rapids? They are rapid-capable so what’s the issue?
 

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P
Thanks @Gif . No accounting for decency it seems.

@JeffG I didn't see, but it MUST have been less if she trickling past seventy minutes .... even on a 30kW Leaf.

I've had an ignorant taxi driver once fail to tell me he had finished charging, but this woman was ignorant on many levels. Perhaps the solution is for dealerships to invest in more chargers !
You may have dodged a bullet as some Nissan dealers have rapids that are knobbled to no more than 40amps as their sites can't support it! It takes the pee but hey what can you do?

If you look at the charger screen you can workout with an online calc what rate it's at as it will show volts and amps. She must have been at very low amps for most of that charge.. was it Preston??

One reason I check the screen when I first rock up, it may look rude but at the end of the day if your trickling along you should bugger off home! If I'm past 85% on a FB unit somewhere or a polar I'll move off it if someone is next to me, and if I'm out of the car I'll be back at it in 30mins after plugging in as that's more than enough for me.
 

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Are you saying you don’t want Outlander PHEVs using rapids? They are rapid-capable so what’s the issue?
Outlander owners have proven unable to use them responsibly. At least now they charge for them they are discouraged.

I remember when they started charging, and someone was on the radio moaning that they bought it thinking they would get free fuel and now it was being taken away.
 

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OK sorry. I got it wrong.

The Outlander PHEV has a type 1 and Chademo sockets. To quote from Zap map charging guide:-

Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Charging Guide - How to charge a Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV "DC charging from a rapid unit is available, though at a limit of 22 kW, rather than the charge point’s usual 50 kW DC maximum".

After reading (or possibly misreading) other posts I mistakenly believed the Outlander driver could have been charging from the adjacent 22kW AC outlet and left the Chademo free for those vehicles which can take the full 50kW. (Me and another Leaf drivers who arrived within a few minutes of each other!) But I now know that the Outlander PHEV is fitted with a 3.7kW on-board charger for Type 1 AC charging. In other words 17% of the maximum 22kW obtainable from the Chademo.

I connected to the 22kW AC outlet for 30 mins which allowed me to get home. Incidentaly the Type 2 to Type 1 cable I have is second hand and was sold to me by an former Outlander owner. :)
 

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Outlander owners have proven unable to use them responsibly. At least now they charge for them they are discouraged.

I remember when they started charging, and someone was on the radio moaning that they bought it thinking they would get free fuel and now it was being taken away.
There are as many selfish PHEV and BEV drivers around who seem to want to freeload off the free charging infrastructure while it is still available (and finding 3.5kW AC Type 2 PHEV users plugged into rapids is the worst example).

The people who bought Outlanders and tried to drive on the motorway for free were just loons! I don’t know how they managed to get anywhere spending so much time charging (and they must have stopped at every service station during their journey).

As both a BEV and a PHEV owner I see both sides, so I’m quick to defend responsible charger use, whether PHEV or BEV, and am just as quick to highlight selfish/ignorant behaviour too (again whether BEV or PHEV).

I see just as much selfish use of chargers by Leaf owners, not because they are inherently selfish, but simply because they are more common than almost any other BEV, so you get a similar minority of selfish owners just like you do for Outlanders, which makes them stand out.

We could all do with being more considerate to each other when it comes to using the charging infrastructure we have just now, unfortunately human nature just does not work that way for the majority!
 

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Rapids really aren’t suited to ikeas, and never were
Sorry to rubbish that but back when they were first installed there were very few other options available. Truly very spread out. EVs also had a much more limited range than available now. What would have been the point of driving 40+ miles to your nearest IKEA in your Leaf 24 and not be able to get home?
People sometimes imagine problems that don't exist for others! Usually it's their own impatience or lack of negotiating skills (e.g. rudeness) that's the issue. Just sometimes you have to give way and if need be hang on to finish the charge once it's free again. Cost of using the charger is nothing to do with it.
 

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OK sorry. I got it wrong.

The Outlander PHEV has a type 1 and Chademo sockets. To quote from Zap map charging guide:-

Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV Charging Guide - How to charge a Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV "DC charging from a rapid unit is available, though at a limit of 22 kW, rather than the charge point’s usual 50 kW DC maximum".

After reading (or possibly misreading) other posts I mistakenly believed the Outlander driver could have been charging from the adjacent 22kW AC outlet and left the Chademo free for those vehicles which can take the full 50kW. (Me and another Leaf drivers who arrived within a few minutes of each other!) But I now know that the Outlander PHEV is fitted with a 3.7kW on-board charger for Type 1 AC charging. In other words 17% of the maximum 22kW obtainable from the Chademo.

I connected to the 22kW AC outlet for 30 mins which allowed me to get home. Incidentaly the Type 2 to Type 1 cable I have is second hand and was sold to me by an former Outlander owner. :)
The Outlander will usually take around 20-25 mins to charge from 0% to 80% (although at a displayed 0% it still has roughly 30% capacity for use to boost the ICE), and automatically shuts off before tapering kicks in.

I know it’s annoying to arrive at a charger and find it in use, no matter what vehicle might have got there before you, but you should never have to wait too long for an Outlander to finish (as any responsible BEV/PHEV owner should be present to move their vehicle as soon as they have finished charging or taken enough for their needs).

Anyone using a Type 1-Type 2 adapter to plug their PHEV into the Type 2 AC rapid cable deserves all the condemnation they receive, just like any other non-rapid Type 2 AC user plugging in directly.

I wonder if we will shortly see small battery BEV owners also complaining about Tesla/I-Pace/Niro/Kona owners blocking chargers as they can take more than an hour to take a decent charge in a 43/50kW rapid. And then there is the issue of 40kWh Leafs slow charging if they are on their 2nd/3rd rapid charge of the day - would you expect them to give up the rapid if they were pulling less than 20kW too even if they needed a decent charge to continue or will we see these users castigated for “blocking” other users from charging much more quickly?

Charging infrastructure is still a very limited resource, so with PHEV/BEV sales increasing we’ll continue to face these issues for a while yet (and with more charger congestion in busy areas) and there are no simple answers in the short term while we wait for the charging infrastructure to catch up. Hopefully ignorant users will eventually get the message, but selfish users are unlikely to change their ways!
 

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Away from home I rely on rapid chargers but charging stations are few and far between around here so with an older Leaf 24 I like the reassurance of being able to charge at a 22kW or 13 amp outlets if it becomes necessary to which end I keep a Type 2 to Type 1 cable and a second hand granny charger in the boot.

(My english teacher would be proud of that sentence! :rolleyes:)
 
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