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Discussion Starter #1
Scenario; Sun 8th, depart New Mills (200m) on 100%, steep down to c140m, then long steady climb to Rushup Edge at 428m, short v steep down Winnats Pass, trundle along Hope valley to 148m, left up through Bamford, Ladybower, to Moscar Heights 360m, uplands lanes then steep descent to Dungworth, at c200m. Carols at the pub, then reverse journey. SOH c90%, 2people, forecast 5-7c, 70% chance of rain, aircon, recirc, heat 16c (ie. min, but passenger may want higher on return), so that's 4 big climbs and, says ZapMap, about 59 miles. Is it doable, or should I be ringing the Nat Park vis centre at Castleton to ask for a granny-cable +12m extension shortish emergency charge on our return, just before the brutal Winnats ascent? (Or perhaps Speedwell Cavern mine?) Xmas lights in Castleton, VC open till 6pm, likely carpark rammed! Its a chargepoints desert on ZapMap. Thoughts? Thanks. Charging at friend's in NM is overnight granny lead plus12m heavy-duty extension.
 

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According to Google maps it's only 12.6 miles by the direct route, so total journey, 59 miles outward plus 13 miles return. 72 miles in a 30 Leaf should be a breeze.
125361
 

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'Abetterrouteplanner' site with all parameters heavily loaded says it's still OK in a Leaf 30. The settings were put at zero degrees C in heavy rain and snow, with a 15mph headwind - both ways - and with an extra load of 250kg on board. It says that the journey would still result in arriving home with 23% charge left as long as the average speed was kept to around 45 mph.

 

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Just for reference, once I did the following in my Leaf 24 (SoH <89%) without any range issue:

Oldham (near broadway), climb to Grotton, drop to Greenfield, A635 to Holmfirth, to New Mill, Cumberworth, Shelley, Kirkburton, Penistone rd then Dalton Bank Rd to J25 M62, over the top to J21, then past hollingworth lake and to Todmorden.

I suspect that includes more vertical feet than your trip (climb from Lees to Grotton, Greenfield up onto the top, Holmfirth to Shelley, Brighouse to the M62 summit, Littleborough to Summit).

I really don't think you'll have any bother at all.
 

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Have cycled that route having been brought up in Sheffield and gone to University in Manchester.

For my 24kWh Leaf, I find hills borrow about 3% SOC for each 100m of climb, but give most of that back on a subsequent descent (providing I don't need the friction brakes), so for planning calculations I look at the mileage plus the difference in height between the start and finish of the journey (or the height of any high pass just before reaching the destination).

For your journey, starting with 100% SOC at New Mills, you will not get any regen on the first descent to 140m asl, also you should not plan on getting any regen on the steep section of Winnats Pass between the 400m contour and Speedwell cavern at 300m, so you would probably need an extra 6% SOC over what you would require on a flat journey.

As the pub at Dungerworth is at about 200m asl, provided you get there with at least 56% SOC (say 60% SOC to be on the safe side) you should be OK for the return journey. Any chance of chatting up the Dungerworth pub to let you plug in the granny cable and extension lead while you are at the carols? (The earlier you can get any extra charge [once you know you will need some] the better as it saves worrying.)

Drive in B mode for most of the jouorney, and IGNORE the GOM - the hills will drive you it crazy.

Let us know how you get on.
 

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An EV drivers' fear of hilly territory is understandable but is very often a bit misplaced. If it involves a round trip then all height gains have to involve an equal height drop in order to get back to the starting spot height. To an experienced EVer that can be used to regenerate some of the extra power used to gain height.

Of course, not all can be regained as there will always be a loss in the conversion. But in a route involving a large gain and loss of height, it can often only cost an extra 5% over the power needed to drive the same distance on level ground. In contrast, in bad weather, a loss of 20% is not uncommon, which when combined with a hilly route can catch people out.

There isn't much to be done about poor weather, but with care, the hilly aspect can be mitigated by employing a few hypermiling techniques. In my bev Ioniq, I find that the 'coast' ability by zeroing regen can be better than trying to regen all the time. Much distance can be gained in moderately hilly country with neither power or regen used. The trick is to not waste energy by heating brake discs. People misunderstand the coasting method and try to regen as much as possible. But gaining distance without expending or recovering energy is always the most efficient way to drive if maximum efficiency is the aim due to range issues.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
  • Thanks to all for your very helpful input. I phoned around various caravan sites, pubs, Nat Park Visitor Centre, Youth Hostel, in both Hope and Castleton, to secure a contingency charge option for the return journey. Nowt. And then re-checked ZapMap, spotted Goosehill Holiday Cottages type2, just before the 1 in 3 Winnats climb, and just through Castleton. Great people, willing to assist if needed, and if it's borderline I'll take up their offer, give us a chance to enjoy the christmas lights of Castleton! Will keep you posted.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks Hitstirrer, excellent advice, I've found "D" feels more free-flowing, with only 1 green regen blob, then click to "B" as approaching moderate to steep descents, gives up to 4 green regen blobs, clicking again to revert to "D" at the base. Takes me back to late '60s momentum conservation doing 206miles rides on Honda 50 step-thru, and then 400cc Citroen 2CV! And of course, cycling.
 

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I've found "D" feels more free-flowing, with only 1 green regen blob, then click to "B" as approaching moderate to steep descents, gives up to 4 green regen blobs, clicking again to revert to "D" at the base.
Yes. The Ioniq makes it easy to coast as it has a regen setting with the paddles to do that. But in all EVs it's possible to do that using a very delicate and educated foot on the throttle to discover that place where energy isn't being used and regen isn't slowing the car down. It takes a lot of practice but can be quite satisfying to allow the car to glide along gaining distance like a soapbox cart. This isn't like simply knocking the car into neutral though as it is always in gear and under control.

In a Leaf, your description of switching from D to B and back to D in undulating territory is the perfect way to maximise range. But also, although appearing to be counter-intuitive, sometimes it's best to press the throttle slightly when going downhill to negate the regen effect, in either B or D, and coast a lot further that way. In effect gain distance using gravity and neither expend or recoup energy until road speed needs to be increased again. People naturally think that regenerating as much as possible from gravity is the best way, but as that inevitably leads to the car slowing down then distance is lost and has to be regained by the use of energy. Coasting cuts out that inefficient 'middleman'.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Ha ha, it went way better than I anticipated, 58% for 55miles. Outward Chunal Head, Glossop, Snake, Dungworth. Return Bamford, Hope, a1hr contingency Type2 with the v helpful folk running Goosehill Hall holday eco-cottages, nice cafe in Castleton, then up Winnats (5 power blobs) and into v strong headwind along Rushup Edge, down A6, sorted. Could have easily done it without the stop, which added c13%. Used 17-19c heat, aircon, recirculate. Thank you all for your input. Climbing as gently as traffic would permit helped!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Yup, cheers i-s. Travelled home to Yorkshire yesterday, after another granny-lead overnight, Glossop, Torside, Crowden, Woodhead, A628.
Glad I'm not trying to cross today, a curtain-sided semi trailer, both bits presumably unladen, blew over on the Woodhead Pass, see "glossop online", excellent resource.
 
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