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Discussion Starter #1
Evening all,
I'm starting to get interested in Vehicle to grid options, but struggling to find a list of suppliers who support V2G or are running trials. From Google and searching around here, I've found the following:
1. Ovo
2. Octopus Power bundle (but only if you live in an area supplied by UK power networks, I live in a Western Power Distribution area so this option is out)
3. EDF, but only for business users

Any others I've missed?

Also, when pulling energy from the vehicle, are you paid for every unit of energy taken from the vehicle, or just what is exported to grid after you subtract whatever power you are using in the home?

Many Thanks in advance!
 

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Sorry, I cannot help with the specifics but can I ask why the interest? From what I have read on V2G/H, the reason that this hasn't taken off is because most EV manufacturers are just not interested. This link is worth a read:


Any electricity that you export to the Grid from a battery - be it a Powerwall or EV battery - will attract a SEG payment. I think that the present fixed Octopus rate is 5.5p/kWh: they also offer a variable rate. It is also worth pointing out that there is c.20% kWh loss when you charge and discharge a battery; put simply, you need to put 1.2kWhs in to get 1kWh out.

To get the SEG, you will require a SMETS2 smart meter. The supplier will apply for an export MPAN.
 

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It looks like OVO may be your only option OVO Vehicle-to-Grid Charger | OVO Energy. Register your interest and they will call you back. Ideally you'll want to have your car available to discharge between 1600 - 1900. I spoke to them but it didn't make financial sense for me, the Octopus Go tariff I'm on is so cheap. On the plus side, at the end of the trial you get to keep V2G charger.

More info here too OVO V2G trial update
 

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Just thought you may be interested in my calculations (in which I keep making errors, so check!) I'm on Octopus Go at present, and signing up for V2G. I have a leaf 30 at present, going to a leaf 62. Present is on a pcp, new one will be leased over 4 years. I'm not particularly bothered about battery degradation, but I suspect that the limitation of draw to grid to 18kWhr per day will mitigate that. I imagine that OvO include the SEG payments.
My calcs are for a 20 week period, but spreading solar income evenly over the year. We have a fairly high electricity use, since all our energy use is electric. We buy guaranteed renewable, so we're zero carbon on current account, except for flights - grandkids in Canada. I emphasise that this is my example - yours will be different. I reckon we will halve our energy costs. Similar savings might arise from the use of the equipment on V2H with a tariff like Octopus Go.
OVO V2G -v- Octopus Go
Octopus Go.

1 Oct – 14 Fb Day 5292 units £736
20 weeks Night 1874 £89.44
SC £32.61
Solar per annum £500 pa, 2650 units. @ 16.2p, deemed export [email protected] 5.38p
Solar proportion 20/52 x 500 = £192
Total 736+89.44+32.61-192= £666.05
Total 20 week electricity cost under existing £666.05
OvO

All units 14.4p 1031.90
SC 140x 23.31 £32.63
Solar FIT payment 20/52 x 2650x16.2=159.50
Income from export 100 units/week @26p = £26x20 = -£520
Less “round trip losses 20%” – 20x14.4x20weeks/100 = £57.60
Income from Solar export say 2000 x 20/52 = 769 [email protected] = £199.94
Less deemed export 1325 x 20/52 x 5.38 = £27.41
Total 1031.90+32.63-520-199.94+9.74 – 159.50 =57.60= £270.08
If export actually 80 units per [email protected] 26p = 26x80x20/100 =£416, then total =£373.29
Total 20 week electricity cost under Ovo V2G £373.29
Plus at a minimum avoid cost of Type1-Type2 adaptor £190
Sell my Chargemaster wall point - £100-200??
 

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Re your question about export being reduced by that which you might be already using, it is the case that if the amount you are drawing will subtract from the amount exported. Our big draw is for the heat pump, which has an 8Kw output, so can make a hefty draw. Since our house has enormous thermal capacity - concrete floors, block walls, I'm going to get a long overdue enhanced control for the heat pump, to actually turn it off between, say 5 and 7 in the evening, or whatever time the most draw to grid takes place.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks for the replies everyone.

I'm primarily interested in V2G from a financial perspective. We have a Leaf 30 which we typically operate daily between 90 and 50% or 80-40. The car is on the drive from 3.30pm onwards most days. We have economy 7 and was interested by OVO's feed in offer of 30ppkwh (we don't have solar).

We are currently on a great EDF tariff for a few more months (about 4.5p overnight), however I see that there aren't any unit rates that good and the comparison sites are suggesting that the best of the current deals are likely to be an extra few hundred a year. I was interested to see if the V2G schemes could have a meaningful impact on the bill, which it looks like it could do from David's calcs above.

If the feedin rates are likely to settle at 5-6ppkw, then I agree there will be no financial gain and only a risk to long term battery health. However, if the OVO trial rate of 30p was to become permanent (which may be possible between the peak hours in the early evening, I gather wholesale prices are around that unit price), then the potential profit could be worth the strain on the battery.

If OVO is my only option, then maybe this question might be best placed there; I presume you can limit the extremes of charge which the system takes? I wouldn't want it taking the battery below 20pc or much above 90pc on a regular basis to minimise the battery impact.
 

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...

If OVO is my only option, then maybe this question might be best placed there; I presume you can limit the extremes of charge which the system takes? I wouldn't want it taking the battery below 20pc or much above 90pc on a regular basis to minimise the battery impact.
The V2G charger definitely stays within these limits. It's very considerate of the battery and there's some early reports that it might even extend the battery life (remarkably!).
 
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The V2G charger definitely stays within these limits. It's very considerate of the battery and there's some early reports that it might even extend the battery life (remarkably!).
I presume you've seen the V2G Trail thread?
Coincidentally Mike S just posted the app configuration page here:
OVO V2G trial update
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It looks like OVO may be your only option OVO Vehicle-to-Grid Charger | OVO Energy. Register your interest and they will call you back. Ideally you'll want to have your car available to discharge between 1600 - 1900. I spoke to them but it didn't make financial sense for me, the Octopus Go tariff I'm on is so cheap. On the plus side, at the end of the trial you get to keep V2G charger.

More info here too OVO V2G trial update
Thanks, I've been doing a few more sums and I'm not sure it makes financial sense for me either, I see that you can't take part in the OVO V2G trial with an economy 7 tariff. Moving onto a standard OVO tariff adds about £1000pa to the bill compared to the cheapest Eco 7 tariff. I'd need to export somewhere between 15 and 20 kwh per day, every day, to make that back, which isn't feasible with a 30kwh Leaf (and that's before any consideration of premature battery aging)
 

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Just thought you may be interested in my calculations (in which I keep making errors, so check!) I'm on Octopus Go at present, and signing up for V2G. I have a leaf 30 at present, going to a leaf 62. Present is on a pcp, new one will be leased over 4 years. I'm not particularly bothered about battery degradation, but I suspect that the limitation of draw to grid to 18kWhr per day will mitigate that. I imagine that OvO include the SEG payments.
My calcs are for a 20 week period, but spreading solar income evenly over the year. We have a fairly high electricity use, since all our energy use is electric. We buy guaranteed renewable, so we're zero carbon on current account, except for flights - grandkids in Canada. I emphasise that this is my example - yours will be different. I reckon we will halve our energy costs. Similar savings might arise from the use of the equipment on V2H with a tariff like Octopus Go.
OVO V2G -v- Octopus Go
Octopus Go.

1 Oct – 14 Fb Day 5292 units £736
20 weeks Night 1874 £89.44
SC £32.61
Solar per annum £500 pa, 2650 units. @ 16.2p, deemed export [email protected] 5.38p
Solar proportion 20/52 x 500 = £192
Total 736+89.44+32.61-192= £666.05
Total 20 week electricity cost under existing £666.05
OvO

All units 14.4p 1031.90
SC 140x 23.31 £32.63
Solar FIT payment 20/52 x 2650x16.2=159.50
Income from export 100 units/week @26p = £26x20 = -£520
Less “round trip losses 20%” – 20x14.4x20weeks/100 = £57.60
Income from Solar export say 2000 x 20/52 = 769 [email protected] = £199.94
Less deemed export 1325 x 20/52 x 5.38 = £27.41
Total 1031.90+32.63-520-199.94+9.74 – 159.50 =57.60= £270.08
If export actually 80 units per [email protected] 26p = 26x80x20/100 =£416, then total =£373.29
Total 20 week electricity cost under Ovo V2G £373.29
Plus at a minimum avoid cost of Type1-Type2 adaptor £190
Sell my Chargemaster wall point - £100-200??
David
Excuse me if I have missed something, but have you included the cost of buying the extra units before you then export them?
My man Maths couldn't make the figures work when we were on Go and both driving to work. The effective sale price for exporting units was only 15p (30-15), but because our usage for commuting of around 30kWh/day was on the Go off-peak of 5p the increase in cost for that element meant that we would have to export 20kWh/day to offset that. Hence it didn't work for us at the time. Of course if we had done it we'd likely be doing well at the moment as we are now both WFH....
Clearly you benefit from the solar export rate being so good
 

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If Western Power is your DNO there’s a new V2G trial launching. Electric Nation | Your electric vehicle - Your smart charge
Thanks for that. I have pre-registered and advanced to next stage.

Serious doubts whether I'll actually decide to take part though. One of the proposed conditions is that they might want to allocate my account to a different supplier. Have only just joined Octopus Agile (& got paid to top car up this morning !) and certainly wouldn't want to move to a more expensive supplier for an outside chance of making some money from the V2G trial.

I also need to clarify whether the V2G charger is also able to act as a V2H system. If it does, it might be a useful way of avoiding the 4pm - 7pm peak rates from Agile and come in handy during power outages but if not I wouldn't find it a very attractive long term prospect.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I also need to clarify whether the V2G charger is also able to act as a V2H system. If it does, it might be a useful way of avoiding the 4pm - 7pm peak rates from Agile and come in handy during power outages but if not I wouldn't find it a very attractive long term prospect.
I was wondering the same, it doesn't look like the Western Power V2G incentives (£10 per month) are going to be as good as the V2G trials in other parts of the country where people are paid generously for exported power, so the main incentive would be to keep the V2G charger at the end of the trial, if it could be used for V2H. I'd only need to use a couple of kw per day to get me through the peak, then Agile (or maybe even Go) would be great for us.
 

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I was wondering the same, it doesn't look like the Western Power V2G incentives (£10 per month) are going to be as good as the V2G trials in other parts of the country where people are paid generously for exported power, so the main incentive would be to keep the V2G charger at the end of the trial, if it could be used for V2H. I'd only need to use a couple of kw per day to get me through the peak, then Agile (or maybe even Go) would be great for us.
The issue will be controlling it, as during the trial WPD would be in control. After the trial will it be nothing more than a slow DC charger? Perhaps @Mike Schooling may wish to comment?
 

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I too have registered for the Western Power trial and have passed the initial hurdles. On Thursday I was told that they would call me withn 5 days to take the matter further.

I too am on Agile and if Octopus is not one of the 5 companies they plan to use in the trial then it will be very unlikely that I take part - unless their companies have amazing prices.

From their website blurb I believe that yes you can use V2G system to power your house rather than take power from the grid.

One other 'big' thing is that you must connect you car to the V2G charger from 6pm to 5am at least 10 times per month or you will be taken off the trial. If you are taken off the trial for no compliance or you ask to be taken off the exit fees are draconian(up to £2000) One question I have for them is this - if my car was stolen or involved in an accident or broke down - either of which resulted in me being unable to connect for the required minimum 10 charges per month - would I be subject to the exit penalties? If the answer is yes, then no matter what, I will not become involved. Thats a risk I am not prepared to take
 

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Well its 7 working days since their email told me that they would call me within 5 working days. No call!

Anyone else had contact from Electric Nation?
They rejected me within two working days, no appeal allowed, just go away.
 

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They called me within 24 hours, but I was one of the first to register and could send them all the extra info. they needed immediately - copy of V5 and MPAN number I think. Have you had that email? If not, check your junk mailbox.
 
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