[Appmacguy]

Just an idea... How about the government wave VAT on EV purchases? The VAT free EV would certainly make a good campaign and would show they really support green transportation. Yes, there is the grant 'thanks' but they still skim the VAT into the treasury coffers.

The base cost of the Tesla a Model S would be reduced by £10,000!

 

[Dales]

By allowing 100% first year writedown allowance on EVs for businesses, they are effectively allowing a saving of 20%+. The forthcoming hike in 'benefit in kind' rates slightly reduce the overall benefit but still a significant perk for company car fleet decisions.

 

[Edd Beesley]

For the purchaser, not the user! If your company uses a fleet management company your company doesn't necessarily see a benefit from that.

 

[markweatherill]

As a taxpayer I think not. Although such a measure might make second hand EVs more affordable by driving down their value.

 

[Jimbo]

Well this was very successful in Norway last year, making the Model S the best selling car over there.

 

[jontracey]

I agree it would make a huge difference, we want the case for EVs to be so overwhelmingly good that there is no way a ICE car can compete. Make every effort to make it a one sided decision, either through removing taxes and providing massive incentives or making the purchase of the ICE car less attractive.

 

[Edd Beesley]

I agree it would make a huge difference, we want the case for EVs to be so overwhelmingly good that there is no way a ICE car can compete. Make every effort to make it a one sided decision, either through removing taxes and providing massive incentives or making the purchase of the ICE car less attractive.

50% "engine" tax if it's got a liquid fuel hole?

 

[jontracey]

50% "engine" tax if it's got a liquid fuel hole?

it would be nice for once to see incentives rather than taxation as a way to make the population move in the desired direction, we have proven taxing people out of behaviour does not work

 

[Edd Beesley]

it would be nice for once to see incentives rather than taxation as a way to make the population move in the desired direction, we have proven taxing people out of behaviour does not work

I dunno, when you buy a car you can choose a V6 or a 1.4L and w choose the 1.4L because the fuel is so expensive, and that's primarily because of tax. People might not believe it has changed their behaviour (and for some it doesn't, they want a V6 at any cost) but as a "herd" it does.

I do believe those who choose to smoke would smoke more if it were cheaper.

 

[markweatherill]

OK, hands up who would happily pay more income tax in order to subsidise EV takeup. And no, existing EV owners are not exempt.

 

[jontracey]

OK, hands up who would happily pay more income tax in order to subsidise EV takeup. And no, existing EV owners are not exempt.

how about we cancel trident, save £24 billion and start with that, the answer is not always pay more tax

 

[Appmacguy]

Well it was just a thought and I am sure the majority here would be in favour and it would certainly result in a boost in EV sales.

 

[Edd Beesley]

OK, hands up who would happily pay more income tax in order to subsidise EV takeup. And no, existing EV owners are not exempt.

I think the average wage is about £23k, about 13k of that being taxable. 0.5% of that, £65 a year, £5 a month. That raises about two billion pounds a year. I would definitely vote for that to come in for one year and bash is some amazing infrastructure an dish out some EVs to people with any change.

 

[smartie]

But then why not an extra 1% for the NHS, schools, roads, long term care etc ?

EVs are not top of most people's list for spending taxpayers' money. Despite that, at least there still is fairly significant funding through Olev. Unfortunately it has been spectacularly badly managed and much of it has been wasted, particularly on overpriced slow chargers and on the likes of Chargemaster to make a quick buck.

I think the average wage is about £23k, about 13k of that being taxable. 0.5% of that, £65 a year, £5 a month. That raises about two billion pounds a year. I would definitely vote for that to come in for one year and bash is some amazing infrastructure an dish out some EVs to people with any change.

 

[Edd Beesley]

Nah, for that I'd rather see an extra 10p a litre on petrol and diesel every year forever.

 

[markweatherill]

Nah, for that I'd rather see an extra 10p a litre on petrol and diesel every year forever.

So the cost of everything that has to be hauled to a supermarket - or Ikea - or anywhere - goes up, and sorry EV drivers are not exempt from that!

 

[richardglover]

I think incentives are a mixed blessing.
The biggest factor in the take up of ev is public desire for the products on offer.
And that is in the hands of the manufactures.

 

[Edd Beesley]

So the cost of everything that has to be hauled to a supermarket - or Ikea - or anywhere - goes up, and sorry EV drivers are not exempt from that!

Yes, and our shiny new charging infrastructure has the power to support rapid charging electric HGVs. Lets think about that for a moment. An HGV can pull about 8mpg with a decent load. with diesel holding 42kwh per gallon that's about 5.25kwh/mi. Of course their diesel engines are (lets be generous) about 40% efficient, so they're using ~2.1kwh/mi to move. Lets say we can make an EV drivetrain for them that's matching the 2.1kwh/mi. I believe the driver is limited to 11 hours driving per day, and can do a max of 56mph. 56 miles*2.1kwh = 117kwh, if you wanted 11 hours NON STOP driving you need 1,293kwh.

A Model S pack is 600kgs for 85kwh, 7kgs per kwh, 9127kg for 1,293kwh, so the tractor unit (minus it's liquid fuel and engine, exhaust etc) would be something like 60% heavier, but that's not a technical impossibility, it would just be expensive. And that's for 11 hours non stop. Give it 4 hours before it needs a drink (470kwh) that's only about 3,300kgs of battery, I don't think there would be much increase in weight over the diesel truck, again it would just be expensive.

Of course they need a couple of megawatts for their rapid charger, which needs better infrastructure, back to point 1. Hopefully by this time everyone is happy there's enough volume of power being used that we can charge 30p/kwh and make a profit, while being boatloads cheaper than diesel. Yay! prices in shops go down! and ecotricity become our biggest power company...!

 

[Julian Thomas]

I would rather see a VAT exemption (or discount) than the £5k subsidy. I get the feeling that the subsidy encourages manufacturers to inflate their price by £5k, knowing that HMRC will pick up the extra.

 

[Parax]

I would rather see a VAT exemption (or discount) than the £5k subsidy. I get the feeling that the subsidy encourages manufacturers to inflate their price by £5k, knowing that HMRC will pick up the extra.

But a VAT exemption would do the same.. as soon as manufacturers know there is anything they will up the price. even if the car was getting a discounted electricity and was cheaper to run they'd up the price!

Also if you discount VAT the whole EU will want to buy here..(other nations would not be pleased at vat loss) it'd have to be a residency based grant thing to be UK only.


How about a conditional grant to the manufacturer? IF the EV version of the car costs the same or less than the petrol version THEN the manufacturer gets the grant. We get good comparable prices. - works with thinks like Outlander or Prius not with Leaf or i3...