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Sounds about right to me. Exciting times.

Funny how for all the research that went into the article they didn’t bother to actually Google Tesla Model Y to find out what it is, but I think that may say more about how far down this rabbit hole I’ve got, rather than the author.
 

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Renault Zoe ZE50 GT-Line Rapid Charge
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Sounds about right to me. Exciting times.

Funny how for all the research that went into the article they didn’t bother to actually Google Tesla Model Y to find out what it is, but I think that may say more about how far down this rabbit hole I’ve got, rather than the author.
It's likely that the Model Y was skipped over by the BBC as it won't be sold here until Tesla's Giga Berlin site is up & running.
 

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I was pleased to see a better BEV outlook from the BBC but dismayed that there was a section on the romanticisation of the ICE - the noise, etc. Without mentioning the pollution, the noise, the cost, the heat, the climate impact.
 

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Sounds about right to me. Exciting times.

Funny how for all the research that went into the article they didn’t bother to actually Google Tesla Model Y to find out what it is, but I think that may say more about how far down this rabbit hole I’ve got, rather than the author.
Did you read the article? The model Y is mentioned specifically:

That's certainly what Tesla's self-styled techno-king, Elon Musk, believes.

Last month he was telling investors that the Model 3 has become the best-selling premium sedan in the world, and predicting that the newer, cheaper Model Y would become the best-selling car of any kind.
Also, I don't recall the Y being cheaper than the 3? The same spec model Y seems to be about $6k to $7k more than the model 3 in the US according to: Tesla Model 3 vs. Model Y? Which One Should You Buy?

It's strangely worded. Is this a mistake by the BBC author or is it a (currently) false promise attributed to Musk?
 

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2021 Tesla Model 3 LR
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Did you read the article? The model Y is mentioned specifically:
Didn’t you read my post? The model Y is indeed mentioned specifically - as being smaller (it isn’t) and cheaper (it isn’t), hence my suggestion that they might have considered googling it.
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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"We're on the verge of a tipping point, says Ramez Naam, the co-chair for energy and environment at the Singularity University in California. He believes as soon as electric vehicles become cost-competitive with fossil fuel vehicles, the game will be up. That's certainly what Tesla's self-styled techno-king, Elon Musk, believes."

I don't think anyone doubts it.

It's pretty tautological/oxymoronic (take your pick). That'd be like saying diamonds are on a tipping point and people will buy them for Christmas decorations once they are cost competitive with glass.

But £30k list for an electrified £16k Clio. £14k buys a lot of petrol and avoids the up front heavy investment.

Seriously, I really don't get how so many people have £30k~£40k sitting around to buy a car outright with. It's a completely different world to 'real life' average folk.

"Most importantly, everyone needs to be able charge their cars easily and cheaply whether or not they have a driveway at their home."

Yup, and no sign at all that there is any extra co-ordination or intelligent thought being put into this to make it a reality, any more than was the case 8 years ago since when nothing much has happened other than charging in public has become enormously more expensive. (I mean .. it used to be free ... do we still remember?)

So, let's say at least 8 years, and maybe manufacturing costs have become competitive with ICE by then. Or maybe they'll keep going up due to mineral resource demands?
 

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Seriously, I really don't get how so many people have £30k~£40k sitting around to buy a car outright with. It's a completely different world to 'real life' average folk.
95% of all private car purchases are on PCP/PCH arrangements - so virtually no-one stumps up the cash. If you're already used to paying say £300 pm for a new car every 2-3 years, then having to pay £350 pm isn't such as big extra expense for a whizzy EV.
 

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We tend to underestimate the rate of change, which is the whole point of the article. All the manufacturers talking about ending ice by 2035…. My personal bet is that will be brought forward.
Yes, right now, a Zoe will cost you much more than a Clio and that cost difference buys a lot of petrol. This assume you care about such things. I recognise many here do. Some just want to stop burning stuff and right now that costs more but is worth it.
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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95% of all private car purchases are on PCP/PCH arrangements - so virtually no-one stumps up the cash. If you're already used to paying say £300 pm for a new car every 2-3 years, then having to pay £350 pm isn't such as big extra expense for a whizzy EV.
Man maths, on the never-never.

You're still talking about a select fraction of the population that have hundreds of pounds spare a month to pay for a car.

If you did have that cash, and only just have it (so to speak), you could buy a nearly new approved used ICE, with a 2 year warranty, for the equivalent of £250 pm (23+9) and at the end of the 2 years .. errr ... you keep the car! You could throw it away and it'd still be cheaper than leasing a BEV at £300pm.

My point is, until the prices are ICE-competitive then one has to deliberately buy into BEVs and be flush with some extra cash. To say that this will all change when the prices are cost-competitive is like, DUH! Of course they will! It is saying nothing of material content.

Wake me up when they cost the same!

(I mean, one could argue that a few years back, it was true. But not now.)
 

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I'm not crazy, the attack has begun.
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The idiots are those that sink capital into a depreciating asset.
I've always supported PCP/lease when the cost is right.

But one has to look at the overall figures. Outright purchase avoids a load of hassles, and my point there is that one can buy a used ICE without having any concerns about how small the fuel tank has shrunk by.

I'd put it a different way to the above journo-opinion, it is that BEVs will be 'here' and make a difference once they are embedded into the 2nd hand market and one can choose to buy a BEV of any age, right up to the point where they have just a few months more of life left in them.

Once there is a functioning 2nd hand market in BEVs and the pricing of those has settled down to something sensible (e.g. no-one is trying to sell a used car for more than the new car costs to buy) then we will have turned the corner.

Other 'signs' that the world has turned;-
  • we will have a choice across price categories of BEV convertibles available
  • we will have a choice across price categories of BEV estate cars available
  • what else?
 

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Interesting.... So, you rent your TVs, computers, cameras, domestic appliances, furniture (indoor and outdoor), carpets, tools, garden machinery (lawnmowers, hedge cutters etc)? Even property can go into negative equity...
These are de-minimus items.

I'm just saying, if you sink £30k into a car, you probably don't have anything very interesting to do with your money.
 

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The idiots are those that sink capital into a depreciating asset.
By that standard, I must be "an idiot".

However, like many other OAPs, I have my life savings sitting at very low yields but an income rather lower than I'd got used to when working.

What sort of idiot would pay interest on the cost of a car under those circumstances ?
 

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VW ID.3 1st Edition & Tesla M3 LR
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By that standard, I must be "an idiot".

However, like many other OAPs, I have my life savings sitting at very low yields but an income rather lower than I'd got used to when working.

What sort of idiot would pay interest on the cost of a car under those circumstances ?
I wouldn’t get hung up on it, does it matter?

Other people are in different circumstances, they may have a good pension but not much of a lump sum.

Some of the lease deals are very good, and can work out cheaper than the depreciation on a privately purchased car, or certainly not much more.

Each to their own, and do what works for you.

It’s still pretty unusual for people to purchase new cars outright though, it has to be said.

It’s still early days, EVs will get better and cheaper, used ones will flow into used system, company EVs have taken off this year more than others.
 

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I wouldn’t get hung up on it, does it matter?

Other people are in different circumstances, they may have a good pension but not much of a lump sum.

Some of the lease deals are very good, and can work out cheaper than the depreciation on a privately purchased car, or certainly not much more.

Each to their own, and do what works for you.

It’s still pretty unusual for people to purchase new cars outright though, it has to be said.

It’s still early days, EVs will get better and cheaper, used ones will flow into used system, company EVs have taken off this year more than others.
You're right, it doesn't matter in the slightest and I'm certainly not "hung up on it". However, I was replying to the ignorant comment that anyone buying a "depreciating asset" outright must be an idiot.
 
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