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But the legislation surrounding the use of e-scooters (like much of recent legislation) has been ill thought-through at best. The Police do not have the time to go after e-scooters being ridden illegally, and the e-scooters themsleves have no form of identification making enforcement very difficult. The latter is particularly important to identify between legally rented machines and illegally used owned machines. A lot of the alledged anti-social behaviour wasn't even illegal under current rules.
It's not actual legislation is it? It's a set of regulation changes designed to fit e-scooters inside of an existing legal framework. It's not entirely surprising that vehicles that are not legal to ride in public places have no registration or means of identifying them. The same is true of the mini-motos that are a noisy nuisance at times around here. Fundamentally though, no-one has been enforcing the law and stopping people riding e-scooters or e-skateboards - I have personally seen people riding both past police stations, cars, and officers on a regular basis with no action being taken. So it's no surprise that they continue to ride these things rather than try to find a "legal" one to rent. It's a crap headline - "Law breaking people breaking more laws", but when the idea is to demonstrate that they are a beneficial addition to our transport mix (and it's the law that is wrong, not the responsible scooter user), it's not helpful.

I'd like the trial to succeed - I think they would be a good addition to our transport mix and would be particularly beneficial to the last mile type stuff. TBH, I would have preferred the trial the other way around - personal devices need to get some sort of proof of 3rd party insurance and you need to display it on your scooter. If experience with bikes is anything to go by, the "dockless" rental companies will clog up pavements with junk and drive each other out of business chasing non-existent profits (while trying to replace all the ones that end up nicked/in the river). Also, it seems to me that lots of reports of "anti-social" cycling are a result of conflict between cyclists and pedestrians on badly thought out shared paths. It is inevitable that if you add scooters into the mix, you end up with more conflict, even if no-one has done anything illegal or dangerous.
 

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But isn't the average number of people in a car on any journey like 1.2? You're being a bit disingenuous. Don't let Good be the enemy of Perfect.
But you're missing the point I was responding to, that EVs are "terribly inefficient".

Scooters and cars really aren't a comparison, so I'm unsure why my scenario was disingenuous when I set some simple parameters to the statement posed.

but you're right, I don't think scooters are a particularly effective way of carrying people and products.
 

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But you're missing the point I was responding to, that EVs are "terribly inefficient".

Scooters and cars really aren't a comparison, so I'm unsure why my scenario was disingenuous when I set some simple parameters to the statement posed.
An electric car carrying a person a mile uses 20x more energy on average than an e-scooter carrying a person a mile— by comparison the electric car is “terribly” inefficient.
 

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A Model 3 at 15 mph is about 200Wh/mile
11 times more, at 15 mph
the electric car @ 15mph uses 16.5x more energy per mile than the 15mph e-scooter -- (electric car) 200Wh/mile @ 15mph is the same as 5 mile/kWh, which is 16.5x more energy per mile than the e-scooter uses at the same speed (82.8miles/kWh e-scooter)...

82.8/5 = 16.56
^the e-scooter gets 16.5 times more miles (77.8 more miles) per kilowatt hour of electricity than the electric car at the same speed.


 

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If you want the best efficiency, walk or ride a bicycle. ;)
Arguing about efficiency is completely irrelevant if politicians think that legalizing e scooters is a vote loser. The point of the trial is to ensure that they can be used in a way that they won't be.
 

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Exactly, hence my approach of "playing the man rather than ball", local MPs are being wound up against e-scooters by the Daily Mail reading public who unlike younger people actually vote (particularly for the Tories) and are more likely to influence them than the users of the e-scooters. Add in a couple of fatalities from inappropriate use and their future is buried.
 

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If you want the best efficiency, walk or ride a bicycle.
Do you have the figures for the efficiency of metabolising food to create energy? I'll discount the efficiency of producing the food in the first place, since that would have to be compared with the efficiency of producing electricity, but I doubt food would win. :)
 

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Do you have the figures for the efficiency of metabolising food to create energy? I'll discount the efficiency of producing the food in the first place, since that would have to be compared with the efficiency of producing electricity, but I doubt food would win. :)
e-Scooters are being marketed as "active transport" which they are no more so than standing up on a train or tube journey. Active transport has the significant benefit of providing exercise to the user which is where bicycles, including e-bikes in the form of pedalecs as in the UK, win out.
 

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e-Scooters are being marketed as "active transport" which they are no more so than standing up on a train or tube journey. Active transport has the significant benefit of providing exercise to the user which is where bicycles, including e-bikes in the form of pedalecs as in the UK, win out.
Not totally comparable, you need to balance yourself on a scooter, maybe get off and walk occasionally, and of course pick the thing up and carry it for steps/stairs and if you own it to take it in and out of your house to charge
 

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I was careful to say standing on a train where you also balance yourself, and likewise you generally have to walk up and down stairs (although not carrying 20+kgs of e-scooter) to reach the platform and between platforms if you change lines. The key issue is that there's no equivalent of pedalling required on an e-scooter although it does speed the device up from rest and going up steep hills.
@metastable is using figures to demonstrate that an e-scooter uses less energy than walking, so if that is correct it is less active than that.

All of which reminds me of the advertising copy of a car from the '20's (1920's :p - an decade of very quick social change) that claimed it was cheaper than walking!

https://www.huntleyarchives.com/pix/AD/MISC/1001019_P.MP4

Being a nerd for such things I have to point out the con-rods on these engines which are forked but not articulated - the fork flexes twice per revolution but even after nearly 100 years they still aren't failing.
 

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Taxpayers can subsidize the cost difference between electric cars and e-scooters to compensate for the daily financial damages incurred by individuals as a result of the e-scooter ownership ban. If taxpayers want to ban the most cost efficient motorized transport they can simply pay for it.
 

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Two issues:
  1. There is no ban on ownership of e-scooters, just restrictions on their use like most means of transport in the UK.
  2. That will never happen given that no rights are being taken away and it is impossible to identify any actual loss.
If you choose not to live in the UK then you have no right to interfere in our politics. Go and put your house in order first - there is plenty to do in the USA.
 

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There is no ban on ownership of e-scooters, just restrictions on their use like most means of transport in the UK.
It can be shown that via restrictions on their use, UK citizens are suffering daily damages as a result of paying for more expensive alternatives. It would be equitable if these individuals were compensated for said damages, by the taxpayer.
 

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Taxpayers can subsidize the cost difference between electric cars and e-scooters to compensate for the daily financial damages incurred by individuals as a result of the e-scooter ownership ban. If taxpayers want to ban the most cost efficient motorized transport they can simply pay for it.
Or we can look at it the other way, if private interests want to legalise a new mode of transport then they can fund the costs of legislation, implementation and enforcement. Maybe just start by writing the standards for quality of build and safety equipment.

But it seems that's too much to ask of toy manufacturers.
 
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