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Any recent AIRA heat pump experiences?

2.7K views 20 replies 8 participants last post by  Mark m  
#1 ·
We had a chap from AIRA out the other day. On the face of it theirs looks like the best system for us; I like the look of their outdoor unit which will be in full view right in the middle of the house back wall, they could fit everything into our airing cupboard, the price was very reasonable and it looked like a decent solution. The only thing that is putting me off a bit was that although the warranty is 15 years that's only if you take out their all inclusive plan which is £19.90 a month, or £240 a year, which is a bit steep! If you don't take this out you get a basic 5 year warranty, which is fine, but they're not clear about what affect this has on other things like the app or remote monitoring.

Has anyone got one of these systems? What do you think of it?
 
#6 ·
Thanks, that's a very informative read. It sounds like they have been developing fairly rapidly given the recent changes in hardware, software and collaboration with other organisations like Octopus, HeatGeek and British Gas. One thing I was a bit confused about was their 15 year warranty and maintenance contract; it sounds like this was free until this January, but now it's not and it's quite expensive instead. Bah...

The install is slightly more expensive than Octopus but not by much. Octopus couldn't fit a tank without making our airing cupboard bigger and I wasn't keen on how their Cosy 9 would fit in the garden because of its funny shape. Aira can fit a tank in the airing cupboard (they are specifying a 200L tank instead of a monster 300L tank that Octopus proposed), they are swapping more radiators and their outdoor unit looks a lot nicer imho and has a much smaller footprint than most others I've seen.
 
#5 ·
I started a thread asking a similar question in the last year or so and didn't get any responses with experience of a fitted system.

I went through to the detailed heat loss survey stage, during which they determined that they couldn't fit the system in our existing boiler/cylinder location due to height and/or width of the water tank, also that the outdoor unit wouldn't fit where initially suggested and we'd have to position it elsewhere, the options not great or expensive with a bit of extra work (trenching).

Ultimately not being able to fit in existing location was a dealbreaker and we didn't go ahead.

I am currently getting a quote from a more independent installer who can access more options of kit to try and find something to fit, sadly though it will be much more expensive, the Aira quote was <£6k with optional 0% finance whereas the indie will be closer to the £10k and no 0%!
 
#7 ·
What did you go with in the end, if any decision was made, Phil?

I just had initial free survey done by Aira as result of chatting to them in Everything Electric London.

It's quite expensive at just under £9000 after grant. Without radiator upgrades (I think they should be fine) just the system cost is still £7540.

Octopus' website quick and guessing quote is saying £3850 turbo or £4700 eco install.

How come there is such a huge difference?



But I can't get Octopus appointment due to no indoor space. Aira are happy to install a smaller 150l tank in my loft, which would be my preferred location anyway. Is 150l enough for 3 people?

I can't find much info on Home Assistant integration with Aira, seems to be a smaller player compared to likes of Daiken. The survey person has shown me FB group of someone getting data (no controls) into HA.

I like the design of Aira's outdoor unit, but not sure why are they so expensive and lack of HA integration kills it.
 
#8 ·
I've paid the full survey fee, that's happening tomorrow, so assuming all is well I do intend to go down the Aira route. It was more expensive than Octopus but not by much, certainly not the huge jump yours was! Our Aira quote is cheaper than yours at £7900, but our Octopus quotes were a lot more at £7100 and £6000, which is a bit weird...

I much prefer the look of the Aira outdoor unit, being tall but not as deep it's a good shape for my preferred location whereas Octopus couldn't put theirs there at all (I'm not sure why, though) and Aira can fit the tank in the airing cupboard whereas Octopus couldn't, so for us it's an easy choice between Aira and Octopus.

I haven't really considered anyone else that seriously because I doubt it could be much cheaper and where the outdoor unit is going we're going to have to look at it all the time so I value the Aira one being (imho) much nicer looking than anything else I've seen, and it doesn't stick out from the wall as much.

I would have preferred Home Assistant integration but I'm not that bothered if it doesn't have it. We have a few A2A units which do have HA integration but half of the point of this is that I want to mostly ignore it; the A2A units are very finicky and need fiddling with all the time, so the HA integration has been invaluable, but I don't want to have to do that. Controls would be nice, electrical consumption I can do anyway, so I'm easy about it if HA integration never arrives. They are very new though, and their app has been developing rapidly by the looks of it, so maybe in the future...?

IIRC MCS require 45L of tank per person who could live in the house (I assume that's basically number of rooms + 1?), and 35L if the heat pump is over 8kw as it assumes it can reheat fast enough to make up for any shortfall. I would have thought in that case 150L for three people should be fine, but you might have to press the "override" button if you've got lots of people staying and they all want showers...
 
#11 ·
Our Aira quote is cheaper than yours at £7900, but our Octopus quotes were a lot more at £7100 and £6000, which is a bit weird...
Is your Octopus quote online just by entering address (where I got my numbers), or after a proper survey?

Octopus wouldn't speak to me when I answered "no indoor space". Can't they put it into the loft!??!

What's your Aira system may I ask? It feels like their prices are fixed.

My proposed Aira system is the 6 kW outdoor unit, indoor "Hydrobox" directly replace current combi boiler, CH buffer tank and 150l hot water cylinder into the loft. Taking away radiator replacement costs, the system would have cost £7540.
 
#10 ·
Yes. Their reasoning is that because their whole system is designed to include one it doesn't have the same potential performance hit that seems common with buffer tanks; certainly the performance figures of the few systems I've seen don't seem to have been unduly impacted. There must be some logic to it given that every single system of theirs is basically exactly the same.
 
#12 ·
Our Octopus quote was after a proper survey, I paid the deposit but got it back after they couldn't make the tank fit in the airing cupboard, and there basically isn't anywhere practical a 300L tank can go, and that's the only size they would fit. We did talk about the loft but it sounds like a tank big enough for the house wouldn't fit through the hatch besides anything else so they ruled that out.

Our Aira proposal is an 8kw external unit and separate 200L tank, 100L buffer tank and hydrobox. The tank will be in the airing cupboard, the buffer tank will be in the loft above, I'm not sure where the hydrobox will go, I think they said that was in the loft too...? Our airing cupboard is not large. They said it would require 7 radiator changes.

They do seem to do it a weird way round... they quote based on basically guesswork, then do a survey, and if it's actually simpler the quote can go down but won't go up... which would surely mean a high risk of the initial quote being artificially high?
 
#13 ·
Thanks, indeed it feels like a funny way of doing quotes. Even a bit fishy akin to some solar installers. May be they have experienced low initial quotes and now are quoting more expensive than before?

Your quote certainly seems to be better value (more stuff, cost less) than my quote. And it includes 7 rad replacements!!
 
#14 ·
Wonder why they think they need a buffer tank. Modern heat pumps can ramp up and down thus don't need a buffer tank to reduce cycling, and the volume of water in the system with large radiators should be enough to cover the defrost cycle? I would be asking serious questions!
 
#15 ·
I happened to notice that IKEA in Germany are selling heat pumps now, and the unit in the picture looked familiar...




They have partnered with "Svea Solar", who say on their website they get their heat pumps from Aira.

I am cheered by Aira becoming a bit more mainstream, as them being so new was one of things I was slightly nervous about.

I am less cheered by their picture showing the outdoor unit, erm, indoors...
 
#16 ·
So we did it.

Over four days in the third week of June three or four guys made a colossal mess of everything while they replaced 9 radiators (including two extremely heavy column radiators in the bathrooms that I had bought separately), removed the gas boiler, put a hot water tank in the airing cupboard and heat pump bits outside and in the loft. Either I misremembered the power of the outdoor unit or it changed at some point in the process but it's a 6kw unit, not an 8kw one as I wrote before. This pretty closely matches the heat loss from the surveys we've had, so it's unlikely to be oversized, I guess we shall see in winter if it's undersized, hopefully not!

They said it would take four days which seemed optimistic, especially when it seemed to take a long time to get the pressure relief valves piped to the outside world from various places, which felt like the most disruptive bit of the whole process despite being nothing at all to do with the heat pump! They sort of did it though; on the last day, a Friday, they were here until gone 7pm instead of the normal 4pm and they seemed a bit rushed towards the end, but one guy came back for a few hours on Monday and sorted a load of little things out. He also went round showing me what everything was in pleasantly surprising detail, over the whole system, much more than a quick poke at the controller.

We had one important but also minor snag depending on your viewpoint; to start with everything worked fine but the airing cupboard door slightly touched the tank before closing properly so it took a visit to shuffle the tank back a bit, then that caused a small leak with an old pipe joint that we didn't spot for a week. Everything was sorted pretty quickly though, so I'm happy with how it went.

The main install also happened during one of the heatwaves and it got above 40 degrees in the loft and low 30s outside, but they still worked like trojans throughout. The front and back doors and loft hatch were open pretty much all week so it was difficult enough trying to keep the house cool, but I can't imagine what it's like in winter with doors open and no heating for days...

I guess nobody completely finishes all the touch up jobs required afterwards so I've got a short list of small painting, filling and sanding jobs to do and I have a feeling some of the loft insulation has not been put back properly which needs checking before it gets cold again. We've certainly had tradesmen who have done smaller jobs but left more finishing up to do, so I'm not too bothered about that. I also need to find a home for all the stuff that used to live in the airing cupboard that seems to be now 1/3 free space, 1/3 water tank and 1/3 pipes going everywhere. Ours is a pretty small airing cupboard (hence the tank/door problem) and there's not as much space above the tank as I thought there would be due to an expansion vessel and random pipes (there are so many pipes compared to a combi) but I can make some shelves that fit in the space that is left.

The indoor circulation pump is where the old boiler was, and it is quieter than the old boiler, but because everything else is now silent the noise of that does stand out a bit. Some anti-vibration pipe mounts and a bit of acoustic insulation might hopefully improve that a bit, I'm not quite sure why they don't install those by the pump as standard.

I still like the look of their outdoor unit, I much prefer it over any other I've seen. When their salesperson first came round they had an app that could show a mockup of what it would look like; actually it's quite a lot shorter than that showed (and how I measured it too; as standard it's on quite tall feet, but ours isn't) so it fits under the kitchen window better than I thought it would. We're having some garden work later in the year so hopefully with that and a few plants nearby it will fit in well enough.

We haven't used the heating yet obviously but when they were testing it the radiators and pipes were a lot quieter than they used to be with the gas boiler. The wait for hot water to come through is greatly reduced from the old combi, and the flow rate is much higher too; my daughter has had a few really deep baths recently when I've forgotten that the bath fills up a lot quicker than it used to! It was a 37kw combi but the flow rate is much higher from the tank, I'm not really sure why. Having hot water without having to listen to the boiler slowly cranking up is generally a much more relaxing experience.

The app is pretty basic but seems to do everything it needs to. I wouldn't complain at all if they added Home Assistant integration at some point but it's far from a deal breaker, and I've got a shelly unit on its mains supply so I can compare it to previous years. The app gives some basic energy consumption / heat production statistics; it says the COP for hot water this month has been 3.6 but with the various visits and how much the system has been played with I don't know how representative that is yet, or what you would normally expect from a half height tank that presumably has a fairly small coil. Either way, on cheap rate electricity and with no gas standing charge any more that's a tiny fraction of the cost of gas so I'm not that fussed about it. It can do clever things if you tell it the details of your TOU tariff, but when I tried that it ran a hot water cycle mid morning one day so I've set it all up manually instead and haven't looked into any of that since. The app has had one fairly large update in the time I've had it, and to start with it showed a different amount of hot water remaining in two different places which it doesn't seem to any more, so there seems to be quite a lot going on behind the scenes in that regard.

Octopus seemed to stop billing us for gas, including the standing charge, from the day I emailed to ask about removing the meter; it was physically removed about a week later. What can you do with an old gas meter cupboard? :)

Roll on winter and we'll see how well it works when we need some heating. It must make it very awkward for installers to do loads of installs when the weather is nice and not really be able to test them properly until they all get tested in anger when the first cold snap comes...

I'm happy with how it went and the system we've ended up with. I think we did quite well on price so I'm not sure how valid that comparison would be but after our experience I would recommend them.
 
#18 ·
Awesome. Apart from the leaky hiccup sounds like went smoothly. Look forward to SCOP updates in the future :)

shelly unit on its mains supply
Shelly have so many similar ones, can you point me to which one that can monitor 6 kW heat pump (it would draw up to 10 amps?)
 
#20 ·
It is a Shelly EM device, mounted in a surface mount box and powered through a standard plug, with a 50A clamp. I have a few other shelly devices so while as Jeremy says it was a bit pricey I knew it would work. That said, it was a bit worrying for a minute because the cable the clamp was to go on had a sleeve which made it thicker, so the clamp only just went round it! I don't know if the 120A clamp is any bigger, but if the heat pump ever draws over 50A then we've got bigger problems...

The shelly has been useful already because I didn't know the system does some kind of flow calibration or something when first set up; it runs the pump for hours even though it's perfectly warm. The shelly was a good way of keeping track of this, and was what prompted looking into what was going on, which led to spotting the pressure gauge reading zero and the leak.

I was impressed by the service people in particular; the leak was behind the tank, visible only through a 2cm gap between the tank and the door; the tank would have had to come out completely, but instead the guy basically performed "keyhole soldering" by going in through the other side of wall through the back of a plug socket. It took a fraction of the time and was far less disruptive than it would have been otherwise, and from what I can see the join looks as good as any other I've seen. I suppose if soldering needs to be done dry, doing it through a plug socket is an excellent incentive to make sure there's definitely no water about...

The most disruptive thing of the whole process was the drain from the pressure relief valves... I knew they needed access to the loft and the airing cupboard, so I put pretty much everything from both places into the spare bedroom; they weren't changing that radiator, so I figured it would be out of the way. Guess which room they needed to take the floor up to put the drain under...