[Rob211]

Progress is a good thing - we just need to update British parking space sizes to keep up and globally as well as with car sizes.

I agree, the solution is to make parking spaces bigger to accommodate the bigger cars on the roads today. But that brings its own problems - a lot of car parks in town centres, or at railway stations, can get full at busy times. So if you take 10% of the spaces away in order to make the other 90% bigger, where do those cars who can no longer get a space park? Or take residential parking - if there are eight homes and eight parking spaces, who gives theirs up to make the other seven wider?

 

[simcity]

I agree, the solution is to make parking spaces bigger to accommodate the bigger cars on the roads today. But that brings its own problems - a lot of car parks in town centres, or at railway stations, can get full at busy times. So if you take 10% of the spaces away in order to make the other 90% bigger, where do those cars who can no longer get a space park? Or take residential parking - if there are eight homes and eight parking spaces, who gives theirs up to make the other seven wider?

Personally Rob I’d rather fewer spaces but at least of a decent size. No point having say 10 basically unusable spaces compared to 9 comparably usable ones. A challenge yes, but we’ve had worse 😎

 

[Rob211]

Personally Rob I’d rather fewer spaces but at least of a decent size. No point having say 10 basically unusable spaces compared to 9 comparably usable ones. A challenge yes, but we’ve had worse 😎

Yeah, perhaps it is the lesser of two evils. In the short term, simply changing the standards for new parking spaces would help - in my example of eight flats with eight spaces, they just stay as they are and continue to manage. But if a new block of flats is built they should have eight proper sized spaces.

 

[donald]

It’s got a sign of car directly on top of the canopy, so nowt wrong with parking there.

It's got a sign that appears to show it is for trolleys.

Are you claiming an A30 isn't 'a trolley'!!

 

[donald]

The problem isn't new! What you need is a car like my Midget. It's based on the A30/35 and it's tiny, especially in width. I can touch the outside of the passenger door while sitting in the drivers seat with my right arm on the door - great for squeezing through gaps!

This isn't mine but shows the comparison...

View attachment 180815

I think there is a very good case for narrow cars. Improve aerodynamics, thus reduce energy consumption, etc..

In general, it is the modern desire to have comfortable personal space in a car that is at play here, space enough not to be bumping shoulders with your passengers.

There are solutions such as staggered seats, but it is a tad too unconventional for some people.

 

[simon-g]

There was a new shopping centre where I lived 20 years ago, and a quirk of the structural design meant not enough room for full sized spaces by the entrance on each floor. So they made them "supermini" spaces, just under 4m long, in the most convenient place. Fines for overhanging. I'd love to see more of that - generous spaces in the least convenient and less used areas, more smaller spaces in the more favourable areas.

I think the only way to really control car sizes though is the Japanese way - you can't buy a car bigger than the parking space you have for it (many in cities rent a space, they come in various sizes, have to be within 2km of your house). Public parking is often charged by size too. Overnight street parking is generally not possible in cities. We have an imported Honda Stepwgn and despite being an 8 seater (6 realistically) it's narrower than a current Fiesta and shorter than a Focus estate. Cars have got bigger here because they can.

 

[TomH]

If you start to apply wider bays retrospectively you could get dramatic improvements in width in old multi storey car parks. Where there were four bays between columns there will now be three bays 33% wider! Total carpark capacity reduced by 25% though.

10% improvement cannot be done!

 

[Zomb]

10% can be done on top level. I'd like that: people with monster cars unfit to go into those city centre multi-storey get sent to the roof. Doesn't work quite as well for underground multi-storey, but well...

 

[Bigmike20VT]

I think there is a very good case for narrow cars. Improve aerodynamics, thus reduce energy consumption, etc..

In general, it is the modern desire to have comfortable personal space in a car that is at play here, space enough not to be bumping shoulders with your passengers.

There are solutions such as staggered seats, but it is a tad too unconventional for some people.

don't EVs help here (I know my car is an EV and is still a mammoth (truth is I was somewhat ignorant of exactly how large my car was on buying. I didn't buy a model S because it was too damn big .

but IME if you take a modern ICE car and an EV with the same outside dimensions.... once you get inside the EV will be the roomier car.

there is a limit of course.. they are not the TARDIS so a Zoe is not going to comfortably fit 5 adults in..... but an ID3 does have more room than a golf

 

[Nebulous]

I drive a van - and like all vehicles it involves compromises. The trade off for all the loadspace and towing capacity is that I need to be careful where I park it.

Our local carpark has some long spaces and I can generally get one of those. In a supermarket I park it in an empty row, well away from the door, it helps that we often shop at unfashionable times. I've never had it in a multi-storey car park. Height barriers are an issue. It is 198 cm tall so a 2 metre height barrier can be a challenge, but a lot of them are 2.1 metres.

When camping in France / Spain a lot of campsites have good cycle tracks running near them, so we can park up on site and cycle into town.

 

[SLR]

If by that you mean 99% of the country isn't road or car park, and therefore won't see those cars, I'm with you. If you mean 99% of the population won't see them, I disagree. If what you mean is 99% of the population won't own any of those in the near future, then I probably still have to disagree.

Sainsbury's in Alperton have changed their car park to accommodate current cars. That reduced the number of parking spaces by quite a bit (I'd imagine between 10% and 20%), but makes the place much nicer to visit. On the photo below, look on the right hand side to get a good idea of how the spaces now look on the car park. I wish more car parks used that design, similar to what @Abercol mentions above.

My local Sainsburys did that a few years ago during a refurb. It's a much better design!

 

[Bigmike20VT]

I am back having a car I actually care about (I had forgotten how stressful it is.nnthere is a lot to be said for a car just as a tool to get you from A to B and nothing more. I looked after it mechanically but didn't sweat the small stuff.

but why is it (and perhaps am going a little off point but it is related.... I know my car is big so I tend to accept i park at the far end of car parks out of the way.... but why is it that even in a half empty car park where i park away from everyone..... as many times as not some bugger comes and parks right next to me giving me only a few inches to open mine - and theirs - car door?

 

[Parkwood]

but why is it (and perhaps am going a little off point but it is related.... I know my car is big so I tend to accept i park at the far end of car parks out of the way.... but why is it that even in a half empty car park where i park away from everyone..... as many times as not some bugger comes and parks right next to me giving me only a few inches to open mine - and theirs - car door?

This point cropped up in another thread a few months back with some suggesting people do it to be bloody minded would never surprise me. But it is true it does happen like that. I also park well away from others as much as possible and have experienced the same, it is bit like why can you travel miles on an empty road yet you will meet another car and a cyclist all at the same spot, or there is always a lorry on an empty motorway just at the point of the exit you want to take, somehting to do with a certain Mr S and his law😆

 

[cliffcoggin]

.... but why is it that even in a half empty car park where i park away from everyone..... as many times as not some bugger comes and parks right next to me giving me only a few inches to open mine - and theirs - car door?

Cars are a threatened species so the Darwinian instinct of flocking together gives them safety in numbers.

Humour aside, the idea is not so far fetched as I first thought. If you parked your car at a certain position you must have believed it had some advantage over all the other positions so I'll park my car as close as I can to yours.

 

[Paul4A]

I think there is a very good case for narrow cars. Improve aerodynamics, thus reduce energy consumption, etc..

In general, it is the modern desire to have comfortable personal space in a car that is at play here, space enough not to be bumping shoulders with your passengers.

There are solutions such as staggered seats, but it is a tad too unconventional for some people.

I suspect it’s partly down to a desire of car companies to make world cars ( the same design everywhere) including the USA where they like big fat cars. I had a mk1 Ford Focus which I loved ( kept for 11 years) and the replacement later design of Focus was about five inches wider. That extra width added frontal surface area which reduced mpg and weight which did the same. Internal wise it did nothing particularly better. What they later did to compensate was lower the roofline which reduced frontal area but made it harder to get into. I‘m quite long / tall in the spine and there’s quite a few cars I struggle to get into with any sort of elegance or comfort as I have to tilt my head right over with the low roofline. My friends modern Corsa for instance is terrible to get into but there‘s plenty of others.

Cars have become fat and bloated and not everyone wants an SUV. Have you seen the width of the current Nissan Micra for instance, it looks almost as wide as it is long. I’m fed up with just about every road test comparing boot size. Not everyone wants a five seater with loads of luggage. Give me an EV the size and width of say a Ford Fiesta that I can get into with ease and I’d be very happy. I tried a Renault Zoe which seemed tolerable for size but because the battery extends up under the front seats they’re very high. My line of sight is therefore partly obscured by the top of the windscreen so it wouldn’t be comfortable on a long trip. I’ve noted that its replacement, the Renault 5 recreation is …. much wider.

 

[Mkultra]

10% can be done on top level. I'd like that: people with monster cars unfit to go into those city centre multi-storey get sent to the roof. Doesn't work quite as well for underground multi-storey, but well...

Is fair enough. Is what I elect to do freely anyway. It's just about being reasonable.

There's a natural progression here anyway .... drop & pick up bay, disabled spaces, family with kids spaces, normal spaces. It's not so much of a stretch to add .... spaces for folks with large units at the top of the end (or top level) of the car park.

There will sometimes be ways to circumnavigate that ... like valet park at airport as mentioned earlier. But the car owner needs pay for the privilege. Many with choose not to and park on the top deck or far end.

Strikes me as a reasonable and natural evolution for those taking larger cars.

 

[CanAmSteve]

Of course cars have become much safer and that required them to be on average larger to make space for extra reinforcement and airbags, etc. While the UK housebuilders still seem to think the average car is a 1970 Mini, so they can offer a (useless) garage, there's no excuse for shopping centre/grocery store parking lots to be so narrow. It's not as if they operate at 100% capacity. While I also owned a 1971 MG Midget, and today have an MX-5, I'd prefer to have a shunt in the MX-5, which is considerably larger but offers if anything less usable space

 

[FDR]

It’s one thing making spaces in large car parks bigger but something I don’t see mentioned is the problem of parking on streets. Some of the streets in the towns hereabouts used to be comfortably driven with cars parked at the side but now it’s getting to be a bit of a squeeze.

 

[Rob211]

It’s one thing making spaces in large car parks bigger but something I don’t see mentioned is the problem of parking on streets. Some of the streets in the towns hereabouts used to be comfortably driven with cars parked at the side but now it’s getting to be a bit of a squeeze.

Especially for larger vehicles. The street I used to live on was Victorian terraced houses with no driveways. People park on both sides of the road. There are regular complaints about the bins not being emptied. The council say it's because the bin lorry can't get through between the parked cars. The residents then stop complaining about the bins, because the only viable solution would be to restrict parking on one side of the road.

 

[simcity]

The residents then stop complaining about the bins, because the only viable solution would be to restrict parking on one side of the road.

Sounds sensible. If you can’t get a bin lorry through the street, then fire and other emergency services might struggle too.