Hi All,

This is going to be a somewhat long and technical post, so buckle in or perhaps skip over if long posts are not for you...

I'm currently with Bulb (yes, that Bulb, that's in the news... ) and have been musing getting a smart meter install for about 6 months and possibly switching to Octopus, but I never got around to it as taking a day off work to get a meter installed is a waste of precious annual leave IMO.

In the last few months Bulb have been nagging me by email and text to get a smart meter installed literally 3 times a week so when a day came up yesterday where my work is closed on an otherwise normal business day giving me a free day off I thought fine, lets do this, as SMETS2 meters are portable and can be switched to another provider if (likely when) I switch in the next few months. Bulb has been nagging me for so long to get one so why not take advantage of it even if I have plans to leave them ?

I was broadly aware of how Smart meters communicate before booking the install - here in Scotland the electricity meter (or more precisely the "hub" that sits on top of it) doesn't use 2G/3G, it uses a long distance RF network run by Arqiva (the "WAN" or wide area network) then between the hub and the IHD (in home device) and the gas meter the Zigbee protocol is used. (the "HAN" or home area network)

One complication of my installation is that our electricity meter cupboard is just inside the front door, with the meter only about a foot off the floor, while the gas meter is in the boiler cupboard at the back of the house which is a bricked in cupboard in the back porch which backs off the kitchen. Total distance between them on a diagnoal through the house is about 8 metres (so less than the "10 metres" that Bulb asks you about) however there are two solid walls for the signal to go through, both brick and plaster, so I knew the signal between the electricity meter's hub and the gas meter could be marginal depending on the method of comms used.

On the other hand I have an Evohome system which has two wireless relays and a cylinder temperature sensor installed in the boiler cupboard near the gas meter, these communicate back to the main controller in the same hallway the electricity meter is in, maybe 1.5 metres nearer, but passing through the same walls, and that has no problems at all with signal strength, operating on the unlicensed 868Mhz spectrum.

Additionally, I used to have a Loop energy monitor with both gas and electricity sensors, (sadly the legacy system with gas sensor was shut down a year ago) the gas sensor used to sit on top of the analogue gas meeter and transmit back to the receiver in the living room - whilst in a slightly differnet location to the electricity meter its a similar distance and is still going through the same two solid walls. It also used 868Mhz and received a reasonable "3 bars out of 5" signal.

So this was my first mistake - without looking into it more deeply I naively assumed that the link between the hub on the electricity meter and the gas meter would be using 868Mhz, because nobody would be be stupid enough to design it to work at higher frequencies like 2.4Ghz right ? Wrong!

Install day came yesterday and as soon as he saw the distance he said it was unlikely to work. "What they don't tell you is you have to subtract 1.5 metres for every wall, which would make it 7 metres", when the actual distance is 8 metres. To be fair the guy did give it a try - he installed the electricity meter first and then attempted to pair the gas meter while it was sitting in the boiler cupboard - no go at all, presumably the signal was just too weak. (But see later...*)

I was pretty disapointed to be honest - I used to get hourly/daily/weekly/monthly gas usage data from loop up until the legacy loop product was discontinued, but for the last year I've had nothing but a bill at the end of each month for gas an no real way to track my usage.

I then did some research that I probably should have done before booking and found out that Prior to mid 2020 all Smart meters being installed including SMETS2 meters used only 2.4Ghz Zigbee not 868Mhz Zigbee. Anyone who knows a bit about radio transmissions and propogation can tell you that 2.4Ghz will struggle to get through walls that 868Mhz will easily pass. All the downstairs walls in this house are solid plaster on brick and WiFi coverage for the house has always been an issue - despite being a 2 bedroom fully detached bungalow with loft conversion I need 3 wireless base stations to adequately cover the house especially on 5Ghz, but even on 2.4Ghz.

In short, the 2.4Ghz Zigbee used by most Smart meters to connect from the hub on the electricity meter to the gas meter is, in my opinion, not fit for purpose for any installation where the meters are not very close to each other, within say 2 or 3 metres of each other and definitely not if there is more than one solid wall in the way. The "up to 10 metres" claim made when you book a smart meter installation could be considered akin to the NEDC range claims for EV's... hopelessly optimistic.

Our house is not large by any means - someone who genuinely does have a larger house where there is a significant separation between meters through one or more walls is simply not going to get it to work, so whoever originally speced out use of 2.4Ghz all those years ago needs a bit of a kicking to be honest. Devices have been making use of the unlicensed 868Mhz spectrum for these type of reporting uses for more than a decade - hell even my outdoor weather station uses 868Mhz and has a strong signal from outdoors on the garage roof through multiple walls into the living room.

It seems I'm not alone in thinking this use of 2.4Ghz is wholely inadequate:

Dual Band Communications Hub

Enabling millions more British homes to benefit from smart metering.

www.smartdcc.co.uk

Their own statistics show that 2.4Ghz Zigbee used on a so called "Single Band Comms Hub" is only usable in 70% of premises in the UK due to inadequate range and/or building pentration ability to reach a gas meter that is significantly separated from the electricity meter where the hub is installed. This to be blunt, is hopeless.



Here is another site with similar information:

UK Electricity and Gas Smart Metering

Gives details about Smart Meters being installed for electricity and gas in the UK.

www.smartme.co.uk

Great - so there are now hubs available since January 2021 that do both 2.4Ghz and 868Mhz, allowing better penetration and a successful connection between the two meters for up to 96.5% of premesis - where do I sign up ? Well, it seems I can't, at least not with Bulb...

Here is the meter they installed:

View attachment 153424

And here is the installation manual I found online:

https://www.edmi-meters.com/europe/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/EDMI-420-Comms-Hub-User-Manual-Rev-1.0.pdf

This is a model released in 2019 (so prior to the introduction of Dual band HAN) and the manufacturing date on this specific meter is October 2020 so the meter is about a year old as well. So needless to say it is definitely 2.4Ghz Zigbee only, and apparently Bulb are installing year old stock of smart meters of a design that is a couple of years old now.

To add some confusion to the mix, the IHD which uses the same 2.4Ghz Zigbee signal that the gas meter would does get a usable signal in the boiler cupboard next to the old meter:

View attachment 153425

It shows 2 bars out of 4 and seems to give updates without an issue. The signal is probably marginal though and maybe the gas meter isn't as sensitive so I can see why the installer would be reluctant even if the gas meter had paired correctly, as they don't want to install something that may be marginal.

I think it's fair to say though that if the IHD can get a weak but usable signal on 2.4Ghz in the boiler cupboard, a smart meter operating on 868Mhz should have no trouble.

So what are my options ? While I now have what I need for dual rate tariffs for EV charging I still really want proper gas monitoring as gas is a huge percentage of our energy bill in winter and needs to be closely monitored.

Has anyone else had problems getting a connection between distantly located electricity and gas meters ? Has anyone been offered a "Dual band" (DBCH) hub for their smart meter to get around this issue, if so which provider are you with ?

I haven't contacted either Bulb or Octopus yet but does anyone know whether Bulb can offer a Dual Band hub if requested (I'm guessing no, from what I've read online) or whether Octopus can do so ?

Hypothetically speaking, if another provider such as Octopus can supply smart meters with a longer range Dual Band Hub, would they be willing to swap out the existing smart meter to allow installation of the gas meter or are they likely to say no because I already have a smart meter ? I quite like the IHD Bulb has supplied, partly because it has built in CAD functionality to allow integration with services like Samsung Smartthings and I understand some IHD's don't have this, so if they did swap my meter I could end up with an inferior IHD.

Do I just have to put up with manual readings for gas for another year or so until Dual band Hubs become more common and then pester whoever my supplier is by then to get them to swap it so I can finally get an adequate signal to get a smart gas meter ?

I suggest that you contact smart@octopus.energy and ask. IMHO, Octopus has one of the best smart meter teams in the Country. For example, they were quick to acknowledge that there are reactive energy issues with a combination of a Powerwall2 and the L&G E470 100mm SMETS2 meter. They replaced all the impacted meters with a Kaifa M120 meter only to find 3 months later that the meters started sending empty XML data files. This took Kaifa 7 months to resolve. Billing was tricky as Octopus uses HH usage data for its time of use tariffs.

Sadly, the UK smart meter rollout is a mess. Suppliers have no levers to pull. Meter manufacturers are responsible for firmware updates, and the DCC is responsible for comms hubs and the network.

 

Sadly, the UK smart meter rollout is a mess. Suppliers have no levers to pull. Meter manufacturers are responsible for firmware updates, and the DCC is responsible for comms hubs and the network.

This. ^^^^ I have found Octopus helpful but unable to resolve my HAN issues (our IHD only works in our bedroom so is pointless as you have to make a special trip to check on things), and there's no date available for any of the alternatives which apparently exist in a standalone project (aka kicked into the long grass). It's disappointing that there are no "range extender" options but I guess that would risk the security of the system.

 

Arqiva's LRR system is a good solution but poorly implemented. The DCC are a complete joke. 2.4GHz Zigbee is, as you've discovered, fundamentally unsuitable for the task. Then there's the problem of the meters still having a contactor inside that can be used to disconnect the supply - simply should not be there.

The system is broken. Octopus have done more than any other company to date to make use of the half hour metering data the system should be capable of providing, and I'm sure they have some level of influence in the direction of future developments, but no more so than other large suppliers.

If it works, it works. If it doesn't, it won't... and unless/until the DCC sort their act out the issue of properties where the technology fundamentally doesn't work will just keep on raising it's head.

The key point is nobody cares and nobody will help you fix these issues. There's nothing you can do about it. The separation of responsibilities means the only part of the system that can fix this is the DCC. They will, eventually, ratify different comms approaches. That should take about six months but expect it to take several years.

 

Arqiva's LRR system is a good solution but poorly implemented. The DCC are a complete joke. 2.4GHz Zigbee is, as you've discovered, fundamentally unsuitable for the task. Then there's the problem of the meters still having a contactor inside that can be used to disconnect the supply - simply should not be there.

I presume that's there for Pay as you Go metering but yeah, it's a bit uncool that there is the potential for an error (or malice) to cause your power to be remotely shut off, especially in this uncertain time of suppliers going bankrupt. Smart meters certainly have their upsides and downsides, but it's too late for me to go back now.

The system is broken. Octopus have done more than any other company to date to make use of the half hour metering data the system should be capable of providing, and I'm sure they have some level of influence in the direction of future developments, but no more so than other large suppliers.

Bulb have offered an EV charging tariff taking advantage of HH metering for a while now - although I don't think it's as good as Octopus's offer because the day rate is significantly higher.

In my area Varifair is now 20.38p (at the start of the year it was around 14p) but if I switched to the EV tariff its 6.9p from 2am to 6am but the day rate goes up to nearly 24p. So I need to measure what the balance is between charging and other household use first to see what the potential gains might be when there's an increase in the day rate.

Maybe it's changed but last time I checked Octopus Go had the same day rate as their single rate tariffs so there was essentially no penalty for switching to Go.

If it works, it works. If it doesn't, it won't... and unless/until the DCC sort their act out the issue of properties where the technology fundamentally doesn't work will just keep on raising it's head.

Which wouldn't be so bad if the government and suppliers weren't trying to ram smart meters down everyone's throats whether they're useful to the individual or not. (Bulb were literally emailing me and sms'ing me on average 3 times a week for months offering a smart meter install and rang me once as well - when I told them during the phone call that I wasn't interested at that time the emails and sms's still kept coming...)

For a lot of people the only real benefit is automatic meter readings, and that's only a benefit if it works reliably and both electricity and gas meters can be commissioned. In my case I'm still going to have to do manual gas readings so it doesn't really automate much for me.

The key point is nobody cares and nobody will help you fix these issues. There's nothing you can do about it. The separation of responsibilities means the only part of the system that can fix this is the DCC. They will, eventually, ratify different comms approaches. That should take about six months but expect it to take several years.

According to what I've read and linked in my original post, they started trialling the dual band 868Mhz support in June 2020 and started a widespread rollout in January 2021 - so the kit to solve this problem for me already exists.

The issue seems to be whether specific electricity suppliers are willing to install that kit given that its new, a bit more expensive, and they probably have a lot of stock or contracts to sell prior models that don't support it - for example the meter provided by Bulb has been sitting on a shelf for over a year based on the date of manufacture on the front.

I guess I could contact Bulb to complain that they've basically only done half a job and point out that the kit to deal with longer distance connections has been available on the market since January 2021, and are they willing to replace the hub with a dual band hub to fit an 868Mhz gas meter, and suggest that if they can't I'll be forced to switch to another supplier who will do this for me. (I presume being dual band they won't have to replace the electricity meter as the dual band hub should be able to service it on 2.4Ghz, and the IHD should work on 2.4Ghz as well - only the gas meter needs to connect at 868Mhz)

I think I have a 9 out of 10 chance that they'll say sorry, can't do anything (especially given that they're in administration now) but I suppose it can't hurt to try.

 

I have gas and electric meters on opposite sides of my property, and diagonally too, so probably over 10m, 3 or 4 brick walls depending on exactly where the line of sight falls. Originally I only had my electric meter upgraded so I could access EDF's 98 hour off peak EV tariff. Once I switched to that tariff, my online measurements disappeared and they suggested I should get the gas meter updated too. I did this, and of course it was a waste of time since it couldn't connect.

So now I'm stick with a dual rate smart meter which I have to take readings off every 6 months (and a super cryptic way to display the 'other' meter - Hold B for 5 sec, then press A). I'm lucky that I do at least have a tariff which is good enough.

 

Octopus deploys the Chameleon IHD/CAD6 but, at the moment, it doesn’t support the CAD side of it. There are rumours on the Octopus Smart Forum that this is about to change.

 

There's some good information at this site about meters

UK Electricity and Gas Smart Metering

It sounds like it's working correctly.

I've connected my Octopus version to Bright so we'll see which gets data first.

 

There's some good information at this site about meters

UK Electricity and Gas Smart Metering

Ah, you mean the page I linked to in the original post ? I hadn't notice the flashing guide though so well spotted.

It sounds like it's working correctly.

I'm not so sure now. After watching it for a couple of minutes the flash rate is very erratic.

It will flash once every 5 seconds for maybe 20 seconds, (normal state) then it will sometimes flash 1 flash per 2 seconds, (transient state, making a connection) and sometimes it will flash twice within a second. (error state)

So it's all over the place and my gut feeling is it hasn't connected yet and/or it's not going to connect due to a configuration error.

How long should I wait for data to appear at Bulb/Bright before calling Bulb up to check things ? I get the impression the meter installers don't want to stick around to check that it does actually connect...

 

Perhaps there is manual intervention required at Bulb to switch you over, and given the situation that they are in that may not be as reliable as previously?

 

I'm sure there is some intervention needed at Bulb to complete the switchover. They may be a bit busy at the moment to be sure...

 

And another update in the Bright app - this time polled at 8am. I wonder if they poll DCC every 3 hours for the data shown in the app* ? It doesn't provide any real time or near real time data but the presentation of historical data in the Bright app looks pretty good, and I like the fact that it's independent of the IHD and the energy supplier. If I understand it right even if I switch energy provider the Bright app will continue to receive data without interruption, and it also doesn't rely on the IHD or my internet connection to continue to receive data.

Presumably data is timestamped so that if there are delays in the smart meter sending the data or Bright polling it the usage data time is still correct so accuracy of delayed data is maintained. Also I notice when I zoom into the graphs it does indeed show a resolution of 30 minutes showing that the smart meter is keeping and sending usage to a 30 minute granularity.

On the other hand the Samsung Smart things app relies on the IHD and my internet connection, and in testing it doesn't seem to make use of any timestamp information, instead just using frequent (one minute) polling - so if the IHD loses WiFi for 30 minutes (which I tested on purpose) once the connection is up again the Smart things app just shows a 30 minute period of no energy usage followed by a big spike at the time of reconnection instead of accounting the usage to the correct time periods, so clearly these usage records are not timestamped and just assumed to be current at the time the IHD sends them to Smart things... not ideal, and certainly not good enough for checking billing etc...

On the plus side the Samsung App has a near real time (within the last couple of minutes) display of usage and a granularity of one minute, so useful to see what's going on "now".

Edit: after posting this message the latest data in Bright is now 10am. So they seem to have data that is current within a few hours.

 

This caught my eye:

CAD for SMETS1 Smart Meters

A low cost, Wifi enabled consumer access device (CAD) to bridge smart metering with value added services designed to benefit you, the energy consumer. Only suitable for SMETS1 meters that have been enrolled in the DCC and not manufactured by Secure. Features Real time electricity and gas...

shop.glowmarkt.com

The USB connecter is used for power only, giving you flexible options for where you install the device. If your smart meter is not that close to your home, this flexibility can be useful to get the CAD as close as possible to the meter for picking up the signal. The GlowStick can act as a Zigbee routing device, extending the range of In Home Displays (IHDs) and other smart energy devices.

 

This caught my eye:

CAD for SMETS1 Smart Meters

A low cost, Wifi enabled consumer access device (CAD) to bridge smart metering with value added services designed to benefit you, the energy consumer. Only suitable for SMETS1 meters that have been enrolled in the DCC and not manufactured by Secure. Features Real time electricity and gas...

shop.glowmarkt.com

My understanding was that you need cooperation from your supplier to extend the HAN with a routing device. I like the sound of the app though, it should make my meter readings a bit easier (just waiting for setup)...

 

I like it too, with one issue which I don't know who to blame for. The electricity pricing is single rate rather than the dual rate for GoFaster. This makes the 45kWh look like it costs £6 rather than £3.50.
I suspect that issue resides with Octopus as the IHD also shows a single rate. Does anyone know if Go or any dual rate is correctly shown?

 

Is Go faster the one where the cheap hours and/or rate vary on a daily basis ?

I don't think these systems (SMETS 2 meters, IHD's etc) are designed to cope with that. I think they can cope with a dual rate tarrif where the cheap hours and rate are fixed and known well ahead of time. (Like Octopus Go ? And Bulb's EV tarrif)

Having said that, Bulbs FAQ says that their Smart Things integration (which gets its data via the IHD/Cad over WiFi) does not currently get the night rate correct for their EV tarrif either.

You would have thought someone would have thought about day/night tarrifs being displayed correctly when these new fangled smart meters were being designed but maybe not!

I guess they just rely on the provider getting 30 minute readings and doing their own caculation of what usage falls within the cheap period and what to charge even if that rate information is not "published" back to the smart meter and IHD.

 

My Octopus IHD always shows the cheap rate. Octopus state there's no integration with IHDs and the tariffs.

 

For Go Faster and Agile, Octopus seems to have made the business decision not to populate the ESME with the correct tariff. When I was last on Agile, an equivalent/average unit price was set. For Go Faster, my ESME has been set to 5.5p/kWh. I use Octopus Compare / Octopus Watch to check my daily costs as these apps get the information from Octopus via API.

 

Just noticed this in the Bright app support, FAQ section:

Perhaps they can make a direct connection to Octopus to get the agile data for the bright app ?

 

Just noticed this in the Bright app support, FAQ section:

Perhaps they can make a direct connection to Octopus to get the agile data for the bright app ?

I think the Agile tariffs are public data so knowing your postcode then they can pull all the data they need.

 

I now have daily electricity data showing up in a graph on Bulb, also my latest statement includes the final meter reading of the old meter entered by the engineer (which looks correct) as well as 2 days readings from the smart meter.

So all is working on the electricity front without any billing screw ups (phew!) and it says I should be able to switch to the EV tariff in about 10 days.

No reply yet to my email to Bulb on Wednesday complaining about them not installing the gas meter due to providing 2.4Ghz only equipment when Dual band equipment has been available since January 2021. I've asked if there is anything they can do to install dual band equipment but I'm not holding my breath!

Yes they do say on their site they can't install smart meters if the distance is more than 10 metres, alluding to the likely hood that they supply 2.4Ghz only equipment, however my meter is actually only 8 metres away and the IHD gets a signal in the gas meter cupboard so as an end user I could still expect to be disappointed by only getting half an installation...

 

Yes they do say on their site they can't install smart meters if the distance is more than 10 metres, alluding to the likely hood that they supply 2.4Ghz only equipment, however my meter is actually only 8 metres away and the IHD gets a signal in the gas meter cupboard so as an end user I could still expect to be disappointed by only getting half an installation...

It is all too complicated, particularly when you add in the calculation of distance lost due to walls. To me the issue is having a solution that they say will only meet the requirements of 70% of homes. Mine is outwith the 70% and yours is borderline at best.
I wonder whether the fact that the IHD is sensitive enough to pick up the hub means that the opposite should be true? It maybe that the hub broadcasts a stronger system than the gas meter.
There has been discussion on another thread about linking connections (admittedly hub to WAN) via wired dipole aerials. I might try the same thing at the weekend although the aerials will be quite long and too big to go into our meter cupboard, so quite where I can put them long-term I've yet to work out. Prove the concept first then move on.
Edited to add that I have a ZigBee repeater and tried to use it to increase the range, but it appears unable to do so.

 

I realise that, but would the same idea with different aerial lengths (approx 1/6th) not work at 2.4Ghz?

 

I doubt you'll be allowed to modify the gas meter. For both data security and physical safety, it's unlikely to be easy to get at, even to add a better antenna.

My gas smart meter was installed in 2019, and for 18 months it took its own sweet counsel about whether it wanted to link to the electricity meter, and whether that forwarded gas data to my in-home display. Some days it worked, most days it didn't. Eventually my Co-operative Energy customer service was outsourced to Octopus, and after a few emails exchanged, Octopus reset something in their part of the network and it's worked since. You might "just" need something like that... but I can't tell you what was done remotely to fix mine.

Half-remembered rules for smart gas meters are that the "smart" bit has to be run from a modest internal battery, not mains (safety) or an external battery (too easy to tamper with). It's possible that your gas meter has a weak battery? If you could dismantle the meter, I think you might find a simple 2-wire switch coming out of the mechanical metering part and into the electronics module. It might work to extend that (a few metres of twisted pair signal wire?) so that the electronics, including especially the HAN antenna, were nearer to the hub on the electricity meter. One can buy gas meters with such a simple pulse output, which is why I expect that's what forms the bottom half of a smart gas meter.

For the avoidance of all doubt, do not try modifying your mains gas meter! It is neither safe nor legal.

 

Not entirely sure if you're responding to me or other posters in this thread so some of my replies might be redundant or misplaced...

I doubt you'll be allowed to modify the gas meter. For both data security and physical safety, it's unlikely to be easy to get at, even to add a better antenna.

The quote that @dk6780 posted about a larger antenna for the gas meter is "non-contact", eg the device is not being modified, connected to or opened in any way. The larger external antenna will be capacitively coupled through the plastic case of the meter to a pickup that then goes to the external antenna. In essence you're using some thin double sided sticky tap to stick an insulated wire to the outside of the case close to where the internal antenna is which will give capacitive coupling to the external antenna.

Fine if you already have a meter installed which is marginal, but mine didn't get installed due to failing the signal test during installation.

My gas smart meter was installed in 2019, and for 18 months it took its own sweet counsel about whether it wanted to link to the electricity meter, and whether that forwarded gas data to my in-home display. Some days it worked, most days it didn't. Eventually my Co-operative Energy customer service was outsourced to Octopus, and after a few emails exchanged, Octopus reset something in their part of the network and it's worked since. You might "just" need something like that... but I can't tell you what was done remotely to fix mine.

As I mentioned earlier in the thread the gas meter didn't get installed - he did a pairing/signal test with the gas meter sitting in place next to the old one, when it wouldn't connect he didn't go any further with the gas meter installation. So I still have my analogue gas meter.

Half-remembered rules for smart gas meters are that the "smart" bit has to be run from a modest internal battery, not mains (safety) or an external battery (too easy to tamper with). It's possible that your gas meter has a weak battery?

No because it was brand new and it didn't get installed anyway....

If you could dismantle the meter, I think you might find a simple 2-wire switch coming out of the mechanical metering part and into the electronics module. It might work to extend that (a few metres of twisted pair signal wire?) so that the electronics, including especially the HAN antenna, were nearer to the hub on the electricity meter.

First you're advising against modifying the meter, now you're suggesting to take it apart - make up your mind.

One can buy gas meters with such a simple pulse output, which is why I expect that's what forms the bottom half of a smart gas meter.

The problem is even if you buy a meter with a pulse output nobody (at least in the consumer market space) is making a gas monitor that will connect to a non-smart gas meter anymore.

The last consumer device on the market to monitor analogue gas meters was the Loop energy monitor. I had one for two years - both the electricity clamp and the gas meter sensor which was an optical sensor you stuck on the front of the face of the meter where the small dial hand swings around - it counted revolutions of that hand and then transmitted that back wirelessly (on 868Mhz!) to the main base unit which forwarded it over the internet to their servers.

I had gas usage graphs and data down to a 15 minute resolution. Unfortunately Loop were bought out by another company who made their own energy clamp product and about 6 months later the legacy loop system was discontinued and the servers shut off. The new loop product is only an electricity clamp with no gas sensor...

I still have the old hardware in a box somewhere - the hardware is fine but without a server to connect to it's useless and I'm not aware of any reverse engineering efforts for the legacy loop hardware and don't have time to attempt anything myself.

My guess is that with smart meters becoming common now a 3rd party solution for smart gas monitoring isn't deemed to be worthwhile (or profitable) so it was abandoned, which is a real shame.

There are a few commercial systems that include legacy gas meter monitors but they're well into the hundreds of pounds and are intended for things like commercial buildings or apartment blocks - they're not really intended for a home user.

For the avoidance of all doubt, do not try modifying your mains gas meter! It is neither safe nor legal.

Quite, so I'm not sure why you suggested it.

 

So, still no email reply from Bulb about whether it's possible to get a Dual band hub and gas meter installed, and I haven't bothered to chase it up with a phone call yet.

I sent a similar enquiry to Octopus on the email address given earlier in this thread and after about a week they replied, however it's not a particularly encouraging reply:

Hi Simon,

Thanks so much for getting in touch!
It depends on your location and which engineers are assigned to your property, as it will depend on their stock and availability.
Some engineers may have stock of these boosters, but unfortunately this is not something we can guarantee.
You are more than welcome to switch over to us, but I cannot guarantee that we would be able to install a dual band booster.

Kind regards,

Not what I'd hoped to hear. Referring to a "booster" makes me wonder if the question about a Dual Band hub was actually understood, or whether they think I'm talking about a ZigBee repeater of some sort, which is not what I want.

This reply also makes it sound like they contract a local installer to do the installation and what hardware I get depends on what hardware this local installer has ?! Can the company contracting the installation not request what hardware is installed ??

Despite seeing plenty of documentation from the likes of DCC to say that Dual band Hubs have been "available" and are being "rolled out" by providers since January, when it comes to actually finding such equipment or an energy provider that says "Yes, we can install that for you" I'm drawing a blank!

I also have no idea where else I can go to follow up to find out what's going on with Dual band Hubs in the UK. It's starting to look like I'm probably just going to have to sit on my hands for another year until Dual Band hubs and meters (hopefully) start to become standard issue for new installations. Unfortunately this particular winter of all winters is the one where I really needed to be able to more closely track my gas usage!

Ho hum.

 

I just solved same issue in scotland with no signal at all. You need a flying lead extension, let me knof if you still have the problem, seems it was some time ago.