The battery swap is a very interesting proposition. I would like to see more though. Nio has already done 4M battery swaps in China, but that tech is non-existent outside of China.

 

Both are somewhat old news. I've seen links to some kits in France on this forum about 2 years ago, and Tesla did trial some battery swap 7-8 years ago, and decided against continuing the program.

Battery swap requires some kind of battery rental scheme as you keep on getting a different battery every time. So even if you generally charge from home, you'll need to maintain the battery lease. Renault hasn't been very successful in this country with the idea, so I'm unsure if the wider public will be interested enough to make the swap solution widespread, which it needs to be to be a success.

With 250-350 kW chargers becoming more common, 20-80% charge on an 80 kWh battery takes about 10 minutes, and I expect the hardware installation and maintenance to be significantly cheaper than swap stations. I'd rather the same money was invested in high power chargers than swap stations as I think it will have a much better impact on long distance EV driving in the medium term.

And that is from someone who makes regular (2 to 4 times a year) 750 miles single day trips.

 

The battery swap thing was a solution in a world where “fast” charging meant 7.4-22kW AC charging and BEVs had 150 mile range. Nowadays BEVs have 300mile range and you can add 200miles of range in 20mins. As 800V architecture becomes more common, 200miles in 10mins will be the norm.

The whole battery swap thing is solving a problem that no longer exists.

I’m very interested in EV conversions. Particularly for classic cars. It’d be great to see more of them. However £5k? What sort of range would you get for that? 30 miles?

 

The battery swap thing was a solution in a world where “fast” charging meant 7.4-22kW AC charging and BEVs had 150 mile range. Nowadays BEVs have 300mile range and you can add 200miles of range in 20mins. As 800V architecture becomes more common, 200miles in 10mins will be the norm.

The whole battery swap thing is solving a problem that no longer exists.

Well, you think like that because you are looking at it as a single issue. It is not. Never was.

Battery swap, like battery rental was never only about the headline. Just imagine that you can easily get a "fresh" battery, basically for the price of the charge. A battery that is properly, in a timely manner, conditioned, and checked and you can swap it any time you want for a better, newer, larger/smaller battery. All of this is about the life-expectancy, range, quality, performance, etc. of a battery, and the customers that have "fears" from new products.

The charging or the electricity is just a by-product of the service that the battery swap offers.

 

They say twice that (100 km), but 5k is just the cost of the kit. That will increase with installation.

 

No chance. Not possible! A 10kWh battery costs £5k. That is without the motor, control circuitry, onboard charger, mounts, etc.

At 4mi/kWh that’d be 40 miles.

Don’t forget a converted ICEV will never be as efficient as a ground-up BEV.

If they’re going to lie they should at least make it believable!

 

For decades my dad had an Austin 30 that was built the year he was born and was the car he learned to drive in. Unfortunately he sold it a few years ago. I'd love to get one and convert it. Totally impractical - wheels, breaks, impact protection, even the indicators aren't up to modern life. But it would be awesome.

 

Initial Renault lease model didn't include the option to buy out the lease. They changed their mind based on the market. And the idea of allowing swaps doesn't have to be forever what NIO currently make of it.

I'm not trying to advertise for the success of it. I don't know if anyone can make it work. But the way it's being denigrated here feels like the way battery cars might have been denigrated 40 years ago. Oh look, that way of doing things doesn't work. OK, I agree (see post 3 in this thread), but that doesn't mean that the idea has to be forever wrong. There could be some other applications (the short term battery rental being just one from someone who's not really a visionary) that make it work.

I'm not comfortable with paying 40-50k for the battery in the first place, and having to carry that huge weight everywhere you go. With ICE, it was easy to deal with both regular short distances and irregular long distance travel in the same way. With BEV it's not so as long distance travel has both a cost and an extra weight to carry all the time (note that I don't worry about charge time).

From someone who spent over £100k on 2 Teslas, it seems weird to have a comment based on what's been done in the past. Do you think we'll never do better than what's been done to date?

 

A good uk site for general classic car conversions to EV power trains:

Electric Classic Cars | The World's Largest Converter of Classic Cars

Welcome to Electric Classic Cars™, the world's largest converter of classic cars to electric.

www.electricclassiccars.co.uk

 

Not exactly 'EV conversion' territory, but 12,500 euro (after incentives in EU) for a brand new EV is more like it (for mass adoption):